<p>Anyone that sends a top 5% kid (with a matching SAT/ACT score) to community college deserves to have child protective services called on them. There is no good reason to put them in such a non peer environment. I know a girl that should be at an Ivy right now (with means award) but her parents forced her to stay home and attend the local commuter college (with merit/means full scholarship), where she is two years in with a 4.0. The nutty parents couldn’t be happier and are using her performance as justification for their selfish decisions. So unsettling to see.</p>
<p>GullLake. Sending a kiddo to community college is not a life threatening issue for child protective services. </p>
<p>If this family can afford a four year residential college, then I hope they allow their daughter to spread her wings and go.</p>
<p>But if they insist on community college, I hope she just embraces that, does extremely well, and continues on from there.</p>
<p>Gull…- you are HS student or just graduated- you lack so much life experience and your posts on other threads show this. Please do not try to be authoritative, especially in the Parents forum.</p>
<p>Gull, please venture out into the world before posting any more.
Not that this really deserves a response but…
As someone who actually worked in child/domestic violence, you have no idea what you’re talking about. Furthermore, the vast, vast majority of people going to college are over 18. Not really a lot CHILD PS can do for an adult. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Actually, it probably is not that rare for high achieving students to start at community colleges due to lack of money or getting shut out in college admissions (which can mean not getting into the desired impacted major even if one gets into the campus) or other reasons.</p>
<p>Some examples of high achievers who got their college start at community colleges:
<a href=“Newsroom | UCLA”>http://newsroom.ucla.edu/releases/at-just-14-ucla-math-student-moshe-229359</a>
<a href=“Berkeley News | Berkeley”>Berkeley News | Berkeley;
<a href=“Aaron Benavidez | Department of Sociology”>http://sociology.fas.harvard.edu/people/aaron-benavidez</a></p>
<p>Of course, this is not to say that starting at community college should be the only option. However, it should not be automatically ruled out, just like starting at a four year school should not be ruled out.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>I think this is very often true, especially at schools that have mostly middle and upper-middle class kids. At my kids private school EVERY student went to a four year univ except ONE student who went to a CC. At the local public HS, I doubt any of the top 20% went to a CC because there is a good public univ with generous merit that kids can commute to if “going away” is too expensive. </p>
<p>I can totally understand the choice of choosing the CC to univ route when finances are an issue. If a student has money issues and doesn’t have the stats to grab large merit or qualify for huge FA as an incoming frosh, then doing the CC to univ route may be the only way to get an education. If that is the only choice, then go for it. My uncle had 6 kids. He told them that if they wanted to go away to college, then they had to go to a CC first…it was the only way he could afford the sleep-away experience. However, that is not the situation here with the OP’s D. </p>
<p>As for my TA vs a masters degreed CC instructor comment, I wasn’t comparing experience. I thought that the OP’s H was thinking that all CC instructors have PhDs. I also dont understand his smaller classes comment. There are some large lecture halls at CCs as well. If he thinks that all CC classes are the sizes of K-12 classes, he is wrong. </p>
<p>The merit issue is real. Yes, there are some small merit offers out there for transfer students at a few schools. However, there are far many more offers and MUCH BIGGER offers to incoming frosh. The dad may have no idea about any of this. He may understand WHY the big merit offers go only to incoming frosh because he doesnt understand the rankings games.</p>
<p>The dad needs to get clued into what is going on today. His D’s “equals” at her high school will all be going to univs unless there is some financial issue. None in her similar situation will be doing the CC to univ route. </p>
<p>If dad doesnt want to pay for the first two years, then the D should explore merit options.</p>
<p>Dad also needs to go on some campus visits!!! </p>
<p>Wow! I appreciate all of the varied replies. Thank you, everyone! Hubby had great CC experience after HS and in the recent past. After HS he went to CC and then to university, where we met. I continued to finish my degree and he didn’t, although he had more credits than I did! It was never a sore spot for him that’s just the way it happened. He is a seeker of knowledge. He is very intelligent. We got married and got jobs and built our life. Several years ago when we were at a good place financially he went to CC and transferred to local college to get his teaching degree. He is still friends with several of his recent CC professors. He currently teaches elementary school science, loves it and is great at it! He is a great guy and a great dad. </p>
<p>I’m sure DD would be fine with the CC/university plan. I think he feels it is the most practical route financially. I just don’t think it’s the best. I feel that considering her HS resume and her character, she should go away to college. Like someone posted…she has earned it! She works so hard at her studies. I will encourage him to speak to some of his respected colleagues. I hope advice from others and from the HS college counselor will help him see things in a different way. Or maybe I will see things in a different way…anyway, Thanks!!</p>
<p>Do you mind telling us in which state you live?. In California the CC to university route is a taken by tons of folks and from what I’ve read on this site the CCs are very good … meanwhile here in Massachusetts the community colleges are not very good and the path to high level universities even the state flagship is not taken all that often. I’d guess a lot of the responses from posters are being colored by the options their kids face.</p>
<p>Houston, Texas. CC’s are good here.</p>
<p>One of my other concerns is that she won’t be able to transfer where ever she might want to go because spaces might be limited, when out of HS should would probably be accepted anywhere. Hubby doesn’t think she would have any problems. But how do we know that?</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Depends where she wants to go. I don’t know about Texas but in Michigan there’s practically unlimited spots at public universities for Michigan CC transfers. If you’re up to the standards of the school, you’re in. I’d have to guess it’s the same in Texas but I don’t really know. </p>
<p>As someone who had the CC experience at a 4-year school, I say, let her go away! I, too, had a father who had issues with letting go and since I grew up in a college town, he insisted I go there. I enjoyed college and did everything I could to differentiate it from high school, but I really feel like I missed out on a lot of problem-solving and learning opportunities by not going away, and I paid dearly for it when I was out of college and working. </p>
<p>It’s too early to rule out any options. The decision doesn’t need to be made until May 1st of senior year. At this stage of the game, open mindedness by all is the key. I think your family would benefit from everyone going on some school visits together. Visit 4 year schools and the CCs. Ask questions, including about transfer options. Research and discovery will aid in in the decision process.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>If she has high HS GPA and test scores, there may be some four year schools willing to have her attend at a very low price. See the following lists:</p>
<p><a href=“http://automaticfulltuition.yolasite.com/”>http://automaticfulltuition.yolasite.com/</a>
<a href=“Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - #50 by BobWallace - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums”>Competitive Full Tuition / Full Ride Scholarships - #50 by BobWallace - Financial Aid and Scholarships - College Confidential Forums;
<a href=“http://nmfscholarships.yolasite.com/”>http://nmfscholarships.yolasite.com/</a></p>
<p>Note that merit scholarships for transfers are much less common.</p>
<p>Starting at CC should not be ruled out, but it should not be assumed that it is always cheaper than all four year schools.</p>
<br>
<br>
<p>But what if you showed him examples where going to a Univ would cost the same or less than going to a CC then a Univ? What would he say then? </p>
<p>
.</p>
<p>This is key. Back in the day, I attended cc before transferring to a 4 year school(financial reasons). It was not what I preferred and I certainly had the stats to attend a 4 year school, but it was what it was and I decided that I would make the best of it. I got a good education at the cc, had a decent social life and made a very smooth transfer to a university where I “got the college experience”. Of course the cc was not the same as going away to school, but it was like being in HS, either. It was in-between. </p>
<p>That said, I think that the OP and her D should explore all of her options. If she can attend a 4 year school for the same price/less than the cc and transfer and she finds a good fit, that should be considered. Show the #'s to the husband.</p>
<p>The comments about this student “deserving” to go away to college bother me. Did I “deserve/not deserve” the same? My siblings and I were honor students who went to cc. We grew up in an area with a mostly middle class population and a good cc. It was not at all unusual for vals/sals/top 10% kids to attend the cc and then transfer. It is the same today in that area. </p>
<p>
Thanks for the additional info … that will help a lot. This is a good question. A couple suggestions. First, I would think the local CCs your husband is considering has a placement/guidance department that keep track of stats like this … where are there graduates going, what are their acceptance rates, etc, I have no idea if they do but it would great if CCs have Naviance which will let your family see how students with certain stat sets fair while applying to transfer. Second, I would contact the target 4-year your daughter is considering (or your husband likes) and ask them about their transfer process … what is their acceptance rate, how many transfers do they take, are transfers eligible for merit aid, are transfers eligible for financial aid, are transfers eligible for advanced standing and/or they any limitations/reguirements on their courses, and are there any majors/school that do not take transfers or which typically take extra time to graduate.</p>
<p>This isn’t a case of child abuse by any means. I, too, disagree with the idea that any student is “deserving” in the sense of requiring someone else to pay a large sum of money for college. It bothers me to see an attitude of entitlement. I understand where this comes from though. Through grade 12, public education is available to all students, and while it wasn’t always the case, college is seen as an extension of education now. I don’t know how many students have a real concept of the cost of college, and since they see their friends going, they expect it as well. In general, I think many parents agree that college is the best next step. </p>
<p>It used to be that college was a privilege. That was when decent jobs were available to high school grads. You didn’t have to go to college to earn a living. Things are different now, and generally some kind of post high school graduate education for trade or profession is needed to get a decent job. </p>
<p>But what hasn’t changed is the financials. Up to grade 12, one can go to school without having to pay for it. College is different. Someone has to pay- parents, government, scholarships. Legally, at age 18, parents aren’t obligated to pay ( some custody agreements have this) but a student isn’t “independent” in general in the eyes of a college for financial aid purposes until age 26. Strange dilemma since post graduate education is needed by so many. However, CC’s exist as a relatively economical option, and it is a good one. There are bright students who take this route. </p>
<p>Basically, when parents pay for college it is because we want that for our kids too. Dad can choose to pay or not to pay for 4 years of college- and by default the daughter will need to take the CC route (unless she gets a large scholarship, but then dad will have to agree to helping with other expenses).</p>
<p>I’ve made suggestions on a previous post, but I would hope that to keep all options on the table, the OP’s daughter can apply to all of them, including colleges where merit aid is possible, and some that dad might like. Perhaps dad would be willing to look at some of them. Who knows- he might like them too. The decision doesn’t need to be made until next May. </p>
<p>
Fair enough … but doesn’t Mom get an equal vote with Dad? Why does it seem that whatever he says goes in this case?</p>
<p>^^^</p>
<p>I wondered the same. Does dad get two votes to mom’s one vote? So, he says, “start at a CC to save money.” Mom can say, “well, we have found alternatives that will end up costing the same or less.” At that point, the child can then choose.</p>
<p>To me, the dad is shooting from the hip, hasn’t looked into anything, wants to save money, and is just basing his entire position from his own experience. </p>
<p>OP…you have indicated that your D is a top student (and I guess strong test scores). If so, then there are schools that will give her enough merit so that the CC to univ route makes little sense. </p>
<p>I would sell the idea this way, “Honey, I agree that we shouldn’t spend money that we don’t need to. We have other concerns that need funding (retirement, whatever). Susie has great stats. XUniv, YUniv, and ZUniv will all give Susie $$$ for her stats, so our total cost will not be higher than the CC to Univ route. I am setting up campus visits. I think it would be a great idea if you came, too.” I wouldnt make it sound like H has the final say as to where Susie goes to school. I would make it sound like the goal is to get costs down so that the budget goal is respected. </p>
<p>I do think that the H needs to visit some of these large merit schools and the CCs…he’s bound to notice a difference. </p>
<p>I also wondered why the dad should have the final say. Even if the mom didn’t have a good job, savings, and a 529 account she should still have an equal vote. It seems to me that the dad thinks if he drags his feet long enough, the problem will go away. </p>
<p>I think M2CK’s suggestion is a good one. I’d schedule the tours and encourage the dad to attend. </p>