I was happy to let my kids make the decision about summer camp, karate lessons vs. basketball, and whether it was worth dropping debate to have more time for softball. It wasn’t my job to approve or disapprove-- even though there were some decisions which would clearly have been more convenient for us as a family. Anything that we couldn’t afford (and there were plenty of those) or were logistically impossible (nobody waking up at 5 am to head to the ice rink for hockey practice given the parental work, commuting, and travel schedules) were off the table, but anything feasible- the kids got to choose.
College isn’t summer camp. Our family made plenty of sacrifices (happily) to be able to send our kids to the college of their choosing, but that came with strings. Opting for urban vs. suburban? A personal choice. Georgian brick vs. gothic stone? Go where you feel more comfortable. Opting for a surfing/beach lifestyle vs. a rigorous intellectual experience? Not while I’m still the parent.
This is college, not summer camp. My kids could have been happy in lots of different places- fun parties, cool activities, hanging out with friends, nothing to spoil their buzz.
“opting for a surfing/beach lifestyle vs.a rigorous intellectual lifestyle?” I have not seen anyone here saying they think it would be okay for their kid to do nothing but party and hang out with their friends, regardless of the college.
We’re not the ones going to the school. But if we’re paying for it, then we have final say in what we will pay for.
If I decided my child needed a car, and I was paying for it, she might be the one driving it, not me. That doesn’t mean I’m buying her a Porsche, even if she (the only one who will drive it) really feels happier with a Porsche than anything else, and even if all the experts agree that the Porsche is better on a completely different level than a Honda Civic, and even the price isn’t an issue. She’ll tell me what cars she likes and why, and I’ll tell her which of them I’m willing to pay for.
When she’s buying the car with her own money, then she can choose whatever she wants without my approval. College is the same.
Now, if I wanted her to get a Lexus, and she decided she’d be happier in a Scion… the Scion will still get the job done. I’m not going to say it’s unacceptably bad at getting her around, even though I might much prefer her in the Lexus. If she wanted to get herself a repair-job 1970s Ford Pinto, and teach herself auto mechanics to keep it running… I’d say, not with my money, no.
Of course Alabama offers a lot of money to attract students who might otherwise have chosen elite schools, and I never claimed my kid would have gone there without the merit money. But the OP was also someone looking for a good financial aid package and it sounds like Michigan State offered a package that rivaled the generous aid Amherst and NU offered. All things being equal, one kid might pick MSU, a second NU, and a third Amherst. There’s no wrong choice here. And believe it or not, lots of people who can afford the pricier things in life, including “fancy-schmanc elite schools” will still choose the “budget” option IF it meets their needs otherwise.
There are definitely some kids at Bama who would rather be at other schools but didn’t get accepted or couldn’t afford them (there are probably Stanford and MIT rejects at NU and Amherst too–so what??), but there are also OOS students who pay a lot of money to go there. Not a choice I would make, but who am I to criticize them if their parents can afford it and the school has everything they want both academically and extracurricularly?
Look, I’m somebody who spent a lot of money to send my kid to private school for K-12. It was never an easy decision and I wished our local school district was a good match for him. But it wasn’t and since we could afford, through sacrifice and later some generous FA, to send him to schools we thought were a better fit for him, that was the choice we made. He did very well there and we got our money’s worth. He did so well in fact he was prepared to hack it in a big public flagship university. Aside from bragging rights, what has he given up going to the school with the least prestige? Seriously, what am I missing? Is his life irreparably damaged in some way?
Who on earth here is arguing for that? The OP’s kid wants to study engineering at MSU.
@FCCDAD, what if the Scion cost as much as a Lexus?
Would your response change if the Lexus was priced as low as a Scion usually is (or if both were almost free) vs. if the Scion was priced as high as a Lexus usually is?
My surfing/beach comment was in response to the poster who said that it is not within a parent’s purview to judge/assist/ a college decision. The young man in question is going to be plenty challenged- that wasn’t my point. MY point was that it’s clearly within a parent’s right (in my home at least) to weigh in on the decision. I don’t buy the argument (put forth earlier on this thread) that as long as the kid has found his/her comfort zone/fit, the parent needs to butt out.
I know kids who are in year 5 and 6 on a prolonged path towards a BA… a few credits here, an incomplete there, withdrawing from two courses which the kid was surely going to flunk, but the kid has had the time of his/her life… fraternity parties, ski trips, spring break in Florida… I’m willing to bet those parents wish they had not played the 'it’s your college and you need to find a place where you feel comfortable" card. College isn’t summer camp.
I posted that, so I’ll respond. Somehow this has become an argument of absolutes. Anyway. My simple point:
PARENTS can stuff a kid into the PARENT’S choice of schools. If that school is not the KID’S choice, Mom and Dad are pissing their money away. How this became me saying, “Yes, send your kids to Margarita University” I have no idea. I also pointed out parents can HELP shape the list, but the decision is up to the kid.
blossom, are these kids smart kids who got into elite schools but chose “less ranked” and “fun” state colleges? Don’t they have frats at elite schools and aren’t kids allowed to leave for Spring Break or ski trips? A kid determined to play around during school will do so wherever they are. I know kids from both types of schools who did an amazing job in school and those who took the long route to graduation or not at all. The “val” from my HS class went to Harvard and dropped out before the year was through. The most brilliant person I’ve ever met went to a flagship state college and has been at a top hospital ever since doing important research. He also took time to ski and party. I know, because I went along for both, more than once.
PT: If she decided she really would be happier in the Scion, it suits all her transportation needs, and maybe has some advantages of its own (fits in tight parking spaces? Saves on insurance and fuel expenses? Is unlikely to be stolen or broken into?), then that’s a perfectly reasonable choice, even if it is clearly not the choice I would have made. If I’m buying (at least somewhat reliable) transportation for her, and the transportation she’s happiest with and that works as needed is the Scion, then yes.
In RL, I’d lean more towards a Scion than a Lexus myself, too, actually. I’d rather have the small car that I can drive the heck out of it.
One of my kids guidance counselors was aggravated with me- I was not willing to have the kid apply to any of the colleges on the GC’s list of safety schools. There is a nearby state (not our own flagship) with a fine engineering school- not as inexpensive as attending our flagship, but a great value for the price. A good example of a university where a part (engineering) is greatly better than the whole (the rest of the university-- i.e. not a UVA or a Berkeley type situation).
I said, “here’s the safety school”. Kid said, “works for me”. GC said, “But here are all these great colleges which are such a better fit for what Kid wants”. I said, “Not willing to be full freight for a better social life, and none of these private U’s have a better engineering program than this state flagship”.
I was nicer and less curt about it. My kid was fine with it also. And although I do think that fit is important, it’s nowhere near as important as the academic offerings and the quality of the academic programs. Good food, nice weather, access to the beach, beautiful landscaping, lazy river/climbing wall-- I understand that for some families, these trump academics. Even to the point of paying more for them.
But not my family. Kid loved where he ended up so we didn’t get to test my hypothesis that a challenging academic environment (which he’d have gotten at the State U) outweighs some of the recreational/leisure time amenities (all of which are better at the private U’s his GC was encouraging-- but at a price). But in the sciences, I am hard to convince that inferior resources translate to a superior intellectual experience.
There are plenty of parties and frivolity at all colleges. The question is do you pay full freight at High Point- more fun, nicer amenities, vs UIUC- less fun, better academics, lots of bad weather?
@FCCDAD, even if the Scion costs as much as a fully-priced Lexus?
Even if there’s a Scion (but not in her favorite color) or a similar car for much cheaper?
Personally, I’m not so rich that I’d fritter money away for little value that I can see (and getting to cheer for a particular team isn’t something I would pay for).
@FCCDAD, even if the Scion costs as much as a fully-priced Lexus?
Even if there’s a Scion (but not in her favorite color) or a similar car for much cheaper?
Personally, I’m not so rich that I’d fritter money away for little value that I can see (and getting to cheer for a particular team isn’t something I would pay for).
I was a small-town kid, and I think I made my college decision based on which sent the best looking postcard. And I’m not a complete blockhead. Some 18-year-olds can make the college decision based on factors that matter, but many – even most – are inclined to make that final decision based on which tour guide they preferred… or which school gets the most coverage on ESPN. In the end, we parents interested in parenting do our best to guide and encourage our children to make wise choices and, with some guidance, most of them will do quite well.
Now, I do concede that there’s only so much we can do in the end. You can’t exactly make a child attend any college if they don’t want to go.
Last night at a concert, I was talking to my sister about a friend of D’s who is going to NU, hoping to get some advice to pass along to him or even a friendly person for him to contact when he gets there. My sister’s BFF’s daughter is a senior there now, and she is a delightful young woman interested in many of the same things D’s friend is. But there was a bit of embarrassed silence, when I asked about the girl’s “experience” there.
The girl is very bright and she has enjoyed her classes at NU, but because she never really became invested in the campus, she feels very alienated from much of what the school has to offer, continues to focus on hometown friends, and is going to be commuting from her exurban hometown during her last quarter before she graduates early this winter. It made me sad because I think this may have been a case where a “lesser” college might have been a better choice for this particular girl…but she didn’t want to disappoint her parents or teachers or all the other adults who had been so excited for her when she was admitted to NU three years ago.