Thanks @twogirls and @EllieMom Awesome! Anyone else with suggestions…keep them coming. Love it!
Exactly. Isn’t HYPS coined on CC? The kid I mentioned didn’t even try HYPS for undergrad.
Several posters mentioned Kenyon. A often-heard young author John Green graduted from there. I don’t hear a lot more authors of that calibre and age came out of HYPS.
I agree and did say that obviously, reach schools do not have to be on the list. My point is why not if they fit socially, academically and financially.If you are not applying ED, why not have all of the choices included if you find ones that match your needs.Reading this, it almost seems that people are criticizing those that find schools that are thought of as reaches for all, to be not included in ones options. As I said earlier, my oldest went to a state school as it was a perfect match for her major. Worked great, got a job as a teacher upon graduation. Next, was also lucky, had a job before graduation, went to a semi target school for finance but more importantly it fit him like a glove.
Not sure why it is looked down upon if someone loves Brown or Williams and wants to apply.
Answer to the question is obvious.
This made me quickly google the colleges of some people who have created work that I consider to be full of intelligence and insight. I found a wonderfully eclectic mix of schools. Some prestigious national research universities, but also state schools and LACs of varying reknown—Kenyon, UGA, Antioch, Wesleyan, UChgo, Hope College, the Citadel, Columbia, RISD, Auburn. (Those were the colleges of the first 10 people who came to my mind.)
Yes, that’s a very personal list and one that is not based on any careful analysis. But it does point out that there are lots of schools out there that can nurture and challenge intellect. And not all of them would be defined as “reaches” (by any definition, whether it be based on student profile, rank, or selectivity) for talented college applicants.
My daughter was recruited to a lot of schools that would have been reaches for her academically (Kenyon, mentioned many times in this thread, is one) but she didn’t want that type of school. She had the grades but not the scores, but more importantly she doesn’t LIKE that type of school. She’s very happy at her ‘lesser’ school.
I’m on the ‘no need to reach to be happy or challenged’ team. We had no reason to pay the $50 application fee just to find out if she could be admitted and ‘know’ that she was good enough.
Replying to @fleishmo6 agree 100% I notice a LOT of negativity towards elite
I don’t think anyone is looking down on the student who loves Brown or Williams and wants to apply. I know I’m not! But I do think it can be a liberating concept for students and parents alike to realize that it’s okay to love Kenyon instead of Brown, for example, even for a student with stats that would make them an excellent candidate for the “reachier” college.
Really? Where? Because I’m not seeing that at all. In fact, I skimmed back through the responses on this thread and couldn’t find anyone expressing negativity toward elite schools or those who chose them. Maybe you’re seeing something that I’m not.
BoiDel, this is your first post on CC so presumably you’re new around these parts. There’s no negativity towards elite schools on this thread.
You should only apply to schools that fit you academically, socially, and financially- schools that you love and will be happy attending. You have to apply to safeties - you don’t have to apply to reaches.
Why cant the parents that strive to send their kids to elites also want it for the VERY same “enriching” “rewarding” “meaningful” “experience” like many quote their kids actually received at elites?
Why is there a perception that all those wanting elite education are “rank hungry” “prestige hounds” “status seekers” “Dont know better” “Should be ashamed of themselves” “embarrassed” ?
Why cant the purpose of elites be the same for all?
@EllieMom I read the first post on page 5 that says “wanting to go to HPYMS is embarrassing” I dont understand why
Someone has agreed with that post. Maybe you missed that post
@droppedit , I like what you have to say. If striving for a tippy top motivates a kid, more power to him.
@EllieMom , great points all, but look at it this way (no doubt someone has, haven’t read all replies): is wanting to go to a top college any different to wanting to have a private yacht, or the most expensive car, or the fanciest house, or a champagne lifestyle? In some ways, it’s much more appealing to top students to aim for the very top schools. Isn’t it egalitarian, in a way? (Okay, it isn’t really, but I will explain…) Any student can try to get into a top college, becasue you don’t necessarily have to be rich, or famous, or beautiful, or have connections, or any of the things that you pretty much must have in order to be rich and famous. Top students understand that they have a better chance than most. So why shouldn’t they have reaches too? It’s a tantalizing prospect when you think you have a real shot at it.
I’m not in any way trying to disparage Kenyon, actually, I think it’s a very fine school. So I hope that no one other than PG is going to put that opinion into my mouth. But I do stand by my opinion that for a kid with scores 350 over the average at a school, any school, that is not an academic match no matter how low their admit rates might be. They might be fine with that, but they might prefer a more academically matched school. There’s no need to sneer at people who make either choice, or pressure them to make the different choice.
Agree 100% with Lindagaf
Well said!
Trying for elites when a (Top 1% )student knows him/her has a 6.5% chance is a fantastic idea.
Nothing wrong in being well informed AND taking the “risk”.
What’s the advice about using “always” and “never” when making statements? You’re making an unwarranted generalization and taking comments out of context.
I maintain that the purpose of “elites”* is not the same for all because all are not the same. I know a lot of kids with near-perfect stats. And no two of them are identical. So it’s not surprising to me that they may benefit from different things in college. Elite education is NOT a one-size-fits-all proposition. Nor should it be, IMO.
I agree very much with what @kiddie says above: “You have to apply to safeties. You don’t have to apply to reaches.”
*I do think it’s interesting that while the discussion is framed in terms of “reaches” which can be applied to students across the board, the most fervent commenters often want to change the focus to a discussion of “elites.”
@EllieMom I never said kids should not apply to any safeties. I went and reread my posts. And I did not turn this conversation towards elite, it happened long before I posted on this topic.
I haven’t read all of the comments, but I agree with the original poster. I admit though, to having some angst about this when my son was applying two years ago. He was a high stats kid who flat out refused to apply to any Ivies or similar reach schools. My husband and I worried about whether or not we should push him to do so (and my mother-in-law was in a real tizzy about it). However, w!e talked about it with DS a bit, and he said, “Mom, I don’t want to apply to those schools because I don’t want to go to them.” I had to admit that made total sense, and since the majority of those schools required additional essays, it would have taken away time that he spent on essays for the schools he liked. Bottom line for me - if you want to go to a school you see as a reach, go for it! If you don’t, it’s not necessary and adds stress to an already stressful process. My son is now a sophomore at his first choice, Brandeis, and it is a perfect fit. I couldn’t be happier. It’s also worth noting that because he got significant merit aid at Brandeis and several other schools that just isn’t offered at the usual reach schools for high stats kids.
I’m thinking it’s different strokes for different folks.
And, I don’t think the reasons for applying to lottery-level reaches are the same for everyone.
DS is still processing into essays what he learned about himself from his recent summer program, but part of what he’s thinking is:
He doesn’t pay much attention to rankings, especially outside his desired major and minor. He’s looking to partially recreate his summer experience, which we gather for the most part happens at reachy STEM colleges. It’s clear to him that what he’s looking for isn’t the same as what many others are looking for.
@Lindagraf
I liked your post a lot. And I think that’s a very perceptive insight. And, actually, I agree with you. (Like I said, there were a lot of reachy schools on D’s list. And I’ll admit that, as a mom, I felt a twinge of buyer’s remorse the minute the she hit “send” on the ED app to a “lesser” school. To extend your analogy a little, I still hankered a bit for the Lexus even though she was sure the Toyota was what she wanted.)
I guess I would like to see more “holistic” evaluation of what schools have to offer a student and recognition that sometimes the best choice may not be the “reachiest”. It’s easy to decide x is better than y if all you’re doing is looking at the rankings or the admissions rate or the stats of the incoming freshman class. I would like to give credit to those students and families who are willing to do a more nuanced evaluation of their options. (And, I’ll admit, my daughter was better than I was at that when she was figuring out which schools to apply to. She’s taught me a lot. 
)
Edited to add: I think @Awesomekidsmom and @Ynotgo have kids who have thought about the college app process in a way that make sense to me.
but @EllieMom you started this incorrect connection (“reach”==“elite”) in your opening post: (correct me if I misinterpreted you)
Probably all of us agree that FIT is the most important element of college choice. Most families work to form a list of colleges the child would love to attend, then look at the chances of admission. That’s when things tend to fall into reach-match-safe categories. If a child is a pretty sure bet at the whole list…congratulations!..they will have a low-stress application season and be happy with the result. I don’t think anyone is saying you must add a ‘reach’ if you’d prefer to attend schools that are a ‘match’ for you.