I am writing on behalf of someone’s daughter. In my opinion, the disconnect between test scores and academic results may indicate a need for ADD testing: unweighted GPA at a rigorous prep school 3.7, weighted 4.8, all honors/AP except one art class, SAT results 1290-1470 all three sections (CR+M+W) over 4 test dates, took ACT too over 3 different test dates, scored 16-19. Those test scores don’t match with an excellent student at a well-known prep school.
I suggested she get tested for ADD. Her mother is willing to try, but she’s a single mom, very low income, and the counselor said it’d cost about $1,000, which is completely undoable for the family.
Do you know of a place in Florida (Miami and thereabouts) where ADD testing can be conducted and where it wouldn’t cost so much?
Thank you!
ADD does not suddenly show up when a student is faced with the ACT or SAT scan sheets. It is a life time struggle which impacts negatively and first on classroom performance and GPA. It is a life span disability. The term DISABILITY is purposeful. It means the individual is NOT ABLE without significant supports. A student with a 3.7 GPA (in a very competitive private school) is about as unlikely to have ADD or a learning disability of any type as Tiger Woods is to be blind (thus explaining his recent problems). Seeking out that sort of testing seems ill advised. It is very ill advised.
There is no ADD or LD that is so subtle that it spares classroom performance but rises its ugly head when it sees the word College Board on a scan sheet. Many people resent students who are getting special designations when they reach senior year without having encountered any significant barriers or academic problems prior to that. And well they should resent those students-those students are cheating. Those who resent those people the most are those with the disorder because the gamers reinforce the idea that ADD (or ADHD and related disabilities) are not real disabilities at all but are attempts to gain advantage or game the tests.
If the student has a ADD (even a minor variant) , this is what you 'd see. The student started to have difficulty in KINDERGARTEN and even if not diagnosed, the disability was a consistent presence that lowered grades and resulted in persistent academic problems (although some students can develop strategies to be successful with great and obvious effort), resulted in discord at home and often resulted in peer difficulties. Students with ADHD rarely gain entry into a competitive private school-and especially not at an early age. While symptoms may vary across students, at least some (usually all) of the following areas are SIGNIFICANTLY impaired (not subtle):
- Impaired working memory. The student is not able to keep information in their working memory in order to use it to guide what they need to do. To others, this might look like the student is scattered, forgetful, acts without thinking, has problems with time management, loses track of time completely, forgets what needs to be done and wonders off, and more. You don't make it to senior high school with this problem without many people suggesting that the child should not be in the typical classroom. No student with ADD gets a 3.7 GPA and is able to go through school without significant HARDSHIPS without significant support from experts working with children with ADHD. Just does not happen.
- Difficulties with developing and using internal language. Typical people use private speech, talking to themselves internally, to guide their actions. Internal speech helps typical people sequence tasks, follow rules, follow directions, plan for and follow through with, activities. Children with ADHD have significant difficulties with their ability to follow rules and complete tasks because of deficits in developing and suing internal language. The is not subtle (like you may have read about or seen on tv when characters find that they had ADD when they'd never dreamed they had academic problems-that is BS-reality is longstanding significant and disruptive problems).
- Problems regulating emotion to such a great extent that emotions derail them. As young kids they may have melt downs even at school. Someone watching such a child may conclude that the child was self destructive because the child does not seem to act in his or her own behalf. Good example: A 2nd grader so freaked out about a home work assignment that would take 10 minutes that she/he melted down and cried for hours-missing a party she or he was looking forward to. Why didn't she or he just buckle down to get it done? Because she or he has a disorder that makes regulating emotion in order to deal with challenges almost impossible. Not subtle.
- Problems with with typical problem solving and rigidity such that the student can't seem to reach their own desired goals, usually because they don't figure out solutions to very minor obstacles that typical people would naturally consider. They show erratic or poor performance on academic (and other) tasks and have highly variable outcomes. So while most typical students may do well in one area and poorly in the next (say get A's in Math and C's in English) a child with ADD (or ADHD, names change) will get an A in math on one day and a C in math the next. The variability you see is within topics and usually present even if the student has strong mastery of the topics.
A student who has not been SIGNIFICANTLY impacted by these problems does not have ADHD. And I have to admit to resenting people who try to game tests by trying to qualify for accommodations when they don’t have the disorder. it would be like someone asking how to see a doctor for wheelchair accommodations so they can get a space close to their work place entry when they don’t have a medical problem. That is because students like the one described make it look like those who have struggled their entire life are also faking. People end up not believing that the disorder exists. yes it exists and does not preclude success but it requires far more effort for success than would be required for typical students.
Typical students who resent accommodations given to peers who really have the disorder are either self centered narrow minded competitive uninformed students who lack empathy and kindness or they are clueless about the disorder and need an education badly. I find that the typical students who resent those with disabilities are students who are themselves competitive and who use every advantage they have to beat out peers. It must pain them to find one perceived advantage they can’t access. Too bad they can’t live one day like their disabled peers!
The student described here has strong academic skills, does not have ADHD but is a lousy test taker. Don’t make life harder for those already challenged with ADHD by gaming it for your purposes!
If you don’t know about the disorder, read Russell A. Barkley’s writings.
Also, if there were never any “disconnects” between grades and test scores tests would be unnecessary because they would be redundant. A student lacking competency in test taking, if that is the problem, may have trouble in a large university that relies on test taking as a means for assessing student mastery. Alternatively the student could be less quick then peers and works very hard at academics-maybe is given some breaks and better grades for being a nice compliant likable student. Another alternative is that the school is not very good and has high grade inflation. That would be confirmed if the student does poorly on all external (to the school) assessments but has a high GPA. Lastly, students from backgrounds where English is a second language often score poorly on the verbal (not math) sections. Averages for certain ethnic minority groups are lower although the evidence suggests that the tests are not less valid (concurrent or predictive reliability) for those groups then they are for other groups.
I understand your anger at kids who try to game the system, but this is not the case here. In fact, quite the opposite.
What you describe about “great obvious effort” is there, as well as number 1. Number 3 not at all, and the rest I have no idea. I think this is a highly intelligent student who has a Learning Disability but due to circumstances wasn’t diagnosed, and it’s just doing due diligence to check that. If not ADD, then dyspraxia, or visual processing, or all of the above, because it’s clear to me there’s something. It’s actually painful to watch. You see a bright kid look like she’s in pain then falter, you give her time to recuperate while you change the format, and she can do the work faster and without pain. Don’t you want to know what’s going on?
I should have added that up to a year ago, the child lived in another country, where LDs aren’t even thought of (or are thought not to exist). In fact, the mother believes that LDs or ADD don’t exist and is very much afraid of the ‘stigma’ if the child got tested, since “disability” for her means “inferior”, “unworthy”. She’s very resistant to the idea of testing but agreed to ask and was told it’d cost $1,000 by a private center, which is totally unaffordable.
(Now that I think of it, the idea may have been brought up before and the mother been as resistant as she is now.)
When she moved here, the student scored poorly on standardized tests but it was easy to think it was due to adapting to a new school system + a slightly less than native fluency (although, how does a student win “best student in Algebra 2” in 10th grade and gets a 15 on ACT math, and no one questions this, is a mystery). She took lessons offered by the school, took the test again, and still scored poorly. She studied at home and on weekends and took more free lessons, and reached a 17. At this point I figured something was wrong, so I worked with her to see what that might be: she could answer pretty much all questions if laid out differently than with the booklet/bubble chart (which is why I started sensing it was not related to preparation and more to some form of LD). We worked very well and I fully expected her to score in the 25-28 range because she got most questions right. Nope, 16 accross the board. The only exception, her writing score has improved and is an 8 (which meshes with her school grades, but not with her overall test score.) So I really think there’s some kind of learning disability at play, either visual processing (the bubble sheet gives her a literal headache) or perhaps dyspraxia, or both but who knows? That’s why she needs to be tested.
BTW, she does well with all essay writing but has trouble with everything that requires “bubbling in”. She’s taken the SAT and the results are the same.
I’ve met enough kids who were hard-of-hearing yet never tested, visually impaired but didn’t have glasses…not to assume that it has been caught before or they’re faking or trying to game the system, especially poor kids who come from other countries. (And she’s not URM, at least not around here, and if you took “ethnic/cultural groups” into account her mother would be lamenting an ACT 30. Fortunately, the mother gets that 16 is not good, but she has no idea how bad it is and no “objective” for her daughter.)
Only upper class people get ADHD testing…
It’s sad when you see a kid falling through the cracks because of an issue that hasn’t been identified. I’m in NY and don’t know about the Florida system but a few thoughts come to mind.
In New York, any parent can request free educational testing from their child’s public school, simply by sending a letter stating the parent believes the child to have a learning disability. Does the child’s private school offer any testing? The parent can also contact the public school system that the child resides in. Even though the child attends private school, she is still qualified to receive services from her local public district, such as educational testing/ screening.
Secondly, you might look at large hospital or educational institutions- maybe there is somewhere that offers a sliding scale. Although $1,000 is pretty cheap for educational testing.
I can’t vouch for this guy-- found him through a basic internet search. He is listed in psychologytoday.com.
Dr. David Tessler does evals, and charges $90-130 per session + has sliding scale. He has worked as a school psychologist. I think even a basic WISC-4 or 5 would be helpful in identify whether there is a processing issue or working memory problem holding back a kid with a high VIQ.
Cadenza Center for Psychotherapy and the Arts
450 N Park Rd
Suite 400
Hollywood, Florida 33021
(305) 712-6292
I really resent the sentiment above by the person who claimed those with high GPAs at competitive schools can’t have ADD. That is a misconception and an insulting one at that. It ignores the hard work, intelligence, and perseverance of many students that suffer from ADD.
I had a respectable GPA (4.0 weighted) in high school and have all As in college. I was diagnosed with ADD in elementary school and Autism Spectrum (Aspergers) late high school. I went to a STEM magnet high school that’s consistently ranked in the top 10 schools in the country (has been ranked #1 numerous times) and I knew many students with ADD at the school. We had to maintain a 3.0 to stay at the school and most students, including those with ADD, had GPAs in the 3.5-4.0 range.
Many students with ADD who are bright are able to cope with it until they hit high school, when the work becomes more rigorous. Some exceptionally bright students are able to cope completely in school, but still may have difficulties with standardized testing. I know that my SAT scores were ok (way above average in the nation but did not break 2000; 80, 95, 90 percentiles) but they were really weak coming from my high school and way below its average (4th percentile CR, 22nd M, 13th W).
As for testing, I would contact someone in the public school system in Florida to see if they have any testing programs in Florida. I believe that Florida has Child Find, which the testing is free for, but that only applies in very early elementary school. The disability services at the public school may know if there is a similar program for high school students in the state that will evaluate the student for ADD at a low or no cost.
I wish her well but I would urge her that there is no better investment in a good Neuropsych eval if her kid has issues…
A thousand bucks is a lot of money but might be considered inexpensive to many quotes I have seen. I have seen an average comprehensive exam take 3 sessions - several hours each.
I would try some family fund raising or any other mechanism to get the money together if she can’t get the school system to pay for it. I can’t emphasize how important quality testing could be.
Aside from the SAT and ACT, having info on the disability or cognitive challenges can prove invaluable when she attends college in case she ends up needing accommodations.
There are so many different things that can present in comprehensive testing that can be helpful in managing solutions for the child long term.
I understand the anger at affluent parents who game the system but frankly late discovery of LD symptoms is not uncommon at all. And no not only “upper class” get tested. I have witnessed people going into 30 day eviction proceedings so they could use the rent money to pay for testing.
Statistics I have seen indicate the accommodations primarily benefit those who have disabilities or LDs.
Many cope and put in a TREMENDOUS number of extra hours over other students to display a seemingly normal and successful outcome. When something shifts in work or testing requirements , the issues may become apparent.
Not to mention the mental fatigue and depression, anxiety with a child who has to constantly put out 150% to get a 90% result.
Yes the bad apples have made it much harder to get accommodations from the College Board and ACT people but if the parent feels its a real issue, there should be no holding back. Getting a proper diagnosis is way more important than which particular school they end up in at college.
My son had a 3.4 and a 29 act and tests in college very highly. His problem is organisation and not turning work in on time. Can’t her daughter just go to a psychiatrist and get tested there? That seems a cheaper route than an expensive psychological test. We just moved to florida, So Idon’t know how it works there but for something like this, I’d try a psychiatrist. They administer their own tests.