Don't Know About Extra Time Scam on SAT? -- click here

Test Preparation
1

<p>Years ago, SAT in an equitable act of fairness, allowed students to take its test with more time -- n/k/a extra time.</p>

<p>Recent events have made this a scam. Students without learning disabilities request this advantage. Some take the test in two days. </p>

<p>A few years ago, someone thought that labeling the test as extra time was unfair to students. Now, it is not marked. What resulted? Abuse. Now everyone who can afford to have the psychological evaluation to obtain this advantage seem to be requesting it. Why not? </p>

<p>Even AP students request extra time now. The abuse of the extra time has grown to being as many as 50% of the students in affluent neighborhoods -- like mine. Now, the slick kids are reading the test on day one (when they allegedly are only capable of finishing half the test) and preparing the answers for day two. Boing!!! Their scores jump. And, many are being admitted to Ivy League schools. </p>

<p>Don't believe me -- read a few articles.</p>

<p>Taking</a> the SAT untimed. - By Arthur Allen - Slate Magazine</p>

<p>Extra</a> time on the SAT?</p>

<p>ABC</a> News: Does Loophole Give Rich Kids More Time on SAT?</p>

<p>Who is more to blame? The students or their parents who pay for this? Wasn't the playing field uneven enough before with prep classes?</p>

2

<p>Being one who typically finishes in 1/2-3/4 the time (aside from essay), I would have to say that extending time to such extents is truly unnecessary since one of the key purposes of the SATs is to test how we apply knowledge within limits of time. I think most of those kids just want time to review each question to catch careless mistakes.</p>

3

<p>More information:</p>

<p>By KENNETH R. WEISS, Times Education Writer</p>

<pre><code> The number of students who get extra time to complete the SAT
</code></pre>

<p>because of a claimed learning disability has soared by more than 50%
in recent years, with the bulk of the growth coming from exclusive
private schools and public schools in mostly wealthy, white suburbs.</p>

<p>Indeed, although only a tiny fraction--1.9%--of students
nationwide got special accommodations for the SAT, the percentage
jumps fivefold for students at New England prep schools. At 20
prominent northeastern private schools, nearly one in 10 students
received special treatment.</p>

<p>In sharp contrast, an analysis of 10 inner-city high schools in
the Los Angeles region, including Roosevelt, Garfield, Inglewood and
Santa Ana, found that not a single one of 1,439 students who took the
SAT got extra time or other accommodations.</p>

<p>working</a> the SAT system</p>

<p>And it spreads:
Demands for special accommodations--which schools usually
approve based on a psychologist's recommendation or sometimes a
doctor's note--are similarly on the increase on other high-stakes
tests, such as those that involve admission to law or medical schools.</p>

4

<p>My D scored low on PSAT. People insist I should get her diagnosed with learning disability so she gets more time and Adderall. Other than not doing well on PSAT, none of her teachers have ever suggested that she has a learning disability.</p>

<p>I don't want to do this as I want her to get through college and find employment without excuses. A kid in my hs had no arms. I can understand making special accomodations for that!!! The asterisk method where people who got more time because of disabilities were distinguished was much better; I think it still allowed colleges to judge the student fairly.</p>

5

<p>Here's some information on accomodations from the College Board.
[url=<a href="http://professionals.collegeboard.com/testing/ssd%5DSSD%5B/url"&gt;http://professionals.collegeboard.com/testing/ssd]SSD[/url&lt;/a&gt;]&lt;/p>

<p>Note:
"Doctor's notes and IEPs are not sufficient to substantiate a request for accommodations, and conclusive statements without supporting information are unhelpful."</p>

6

<p>I'm not planning to "find a doctor to diagnose" a learning disabililty for SAT purposes, but because I have a younger child diagnosed with LD, I'm familiar with testing and don't think it would be impossible. I would have no objection to my "certified LD" child getting more time as well as an asterisk; I would trust the admissions people to evaluate that fairly.</p>

7

<p>Here we go again. Lets update my list of people on CC against fairness in the world (Yes, I'm still keeping my list):</p>

<p>Amb3r
FLBoy
Father of the Boarder
Marimare
SillBill
Noobcake</p>

<p>There is a false assumption that LD students aren't smart or simply don't have the ability to perform on par with their peers, which is simply not true. ADD, Dyslexia, and especially high-functioning Autism are perfect examples of this; none impact actual intelligence.</p>

<p>Personally, I'm offended by your remark where you said "Even AP students request extra time now." I'm LD and I'm also an AP student. Learning Disabilities affect the processing of information; NOT the actual retention of it.</p>

<p>If you want me to talk about that more later I will, but I want to get to attacking the heart of your argument. I keep repeating these points in every anti-accommodations thread posted here on CC, and frankly I'm sick of doing it.</p>

<p>The College Board's and ACT's decisions to stop flagging were just and necessary to disabled people in this country, especially those applying to Ivy League schools. Of course, these schools reject many students that have just as good of a chance of success as those admitted and sometimes admissions could seem random. If two students, one who is disabled and another normal one have similar GPAs, ranks, and test scores and they have to admit one it could come down to extracurriculars and personality etc. However, if flagging continued admissions would see one has a learning disability. Guess which one got admitted? Flagging allows colleges to rid themselves of all the "undesirables" so they don't have to worry about meeting ADA standards.</p>

<p>Now you brought up a debated issue about whether or not wealthy parents go "accommodations shopping." Well, let me begin by assuring you that is not how I got my diagnosis. I was diagnosed as a very young child. By young, I mean three years old. We went to numerous doctors, even traveling out of state to find out why I was having issues. Different doctors gave different diagnoses. Some said ADD, others said Aspergers, and others suggested some other disorder currently only recognized in Sweden! Eventually, with close contact with a reputable researcher we were working with, (she worked at the University of Chicago at the time) she recommended that I be diagnosed with Aspergers, though it did not 100% correctly describe me. Why? Because schools are picky and always want a firm diagnosis. I had a learning disability that does not have a name; so many others do. All psychologists can do is diagnose something similar that both resembles us and gives us the accommodations we need. DISABLED STUDENTS ARE BEING HELD IN A BIND BY BEING FORCED TO GET A FIRM DIAGNOSIS.</p>

<p>No, I'm not done yet. It was also brought up that wealthier students get accommodations more often. Of course, it seems many missed the fact that ANY psychologist costs MONEY, and LOTS of it. Many not so fortunate families can't afford one and thus can't get accommodations. In addition, some statistics showed that certain private schools have higher rates of students getting accommodations. Many disabled students are FLOCKING to private schools to avoid falling through the cracks in the public system. So how does that change statistics? Let me use my own school as an example. They send literally over a dozen grads to Ivy League schools each year. However, the school is split between two major divisions. One houses the average to gifted students while the second caters to the learning disabled students and attempts to get them mainstreamed. Many mainstream with great success and eventually take on AP classes in high school as I have done. However, being disabled is for life. With so many students either still in the disabled classes or migrating out of it because of success, there is bound to be a higher rate of students asking for accommodations from my school. After all, an entire HALF of it caters to disabled students!</p>

<p>The rest of this post is in the form of a short skit I created for the ACT discussion still going on about accommodations. The "normals" argued that LD children shouldn't be given accommodations because they can hurt people in their careers. I.E.- LD disabled doctors killing patients. It's ridiculous if you ask me. Anyway, here it is.</p>

<p>LD Kid: I'm in the 5th grade but struggling with my homework, so these friendly school psychologists gave me some sweet meds. I was also demoted into a remedial class that they said would be "more at my level." I don't like this. I'm moving out!</p>

<p>Amb3r or noobcake as a school administrator. Take your pick: Not so fast!</p>

<p>LD Kid: Amb3r/noobcake!</p>

<p>Amb3r/noobcake: Though you have an intelligent mind, you are not succeeding in the regular environment. This remedial class is the only alternative after I helped push the legislation to abolish accommodations. Sure, this is too easy for you, but it is the only place you can get good grades. (And the only way we don't get screwed over by NCLB)</p>

<p>LD Kid: Will I still get a good education in the end?</p>

<p>Amb3r/noobcake: Of course! That community college down the road will be a perfect fit for your current placement. Since we're not letting you out of these remedial classes because accommodations are illegal, that is your goal.</p>

<p>LD Kid: I'm going to commit suicide now because I'm not being allowed to demonstrate my potential.</p>

<p>Amb3r/noobcake: You go do that. You won't be useful in the workforce in your adult life anyway.</p>

8

<p>"The College Board said students without learning disabilities did not show any marked improvement in scores when given extra time."</p>

<p>"Jay Brody, the tutor, said that extra time is as good as adding a couple hundred points to a student's score."</p>

<p>I wonder who has the better data? </p>

<p>


</p>

<p>If she has a learning disability, she should get diagnosed. If she doesn't, she shouldn't. I think the "people" have been spending too much time with Jay Brody.</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>This policy was developed to bring the test into compliance with Title II of the American with Disabilities Act (ADA) and various other federal laws regarding testing and accommodations.</p>

<p>A student with a legitimate, diagnosed learning difference has as much of a real problem as a student diagnosed as blind. Do we know if the can "really" see or not? That's probably easier than "seeing" a learning difference. Providing extra time is just as valid as providing a braille exam form for a blind person (a braille exam will be generated if even 1 person requests it, as well as the appropriate learning material)</p>

<p>People do scam the system (the "blind" beggar is a running joke in many movies, such as Eddie Murphy in trading spaces), but for those with legitimate difficulties, the attitudes expressed by many without disabilities only makes for a more difficult row for a diagnosed student to hoe.</p>

<p>Most of what I read in the references was opinion, first, second or third-hand, or "everyone knows" or "I have a friend that." Let's see a study or two of real data. The Washington study only shows that the students who received extra time in DC were better performers than their peers, while the ones nationally were not. A better score by itself does not establish a large number of cheaters, nor does a disproportionate number of diagnoses in one school.</p>

<p>A student who takes a year off to raise his SAT score (from one of the items) is placing too much importance on the score.</p>

<p>Perspective and solid data are important when addressing this issue.</p>

9

<p>dvm-my LD child is very intelligent and in most academic situations performs on par with peers. But I'm not sure how much of the extra time is a reasonable accomodation and how much is an advantage. I think the way it works is you get time and a half or double time? So I would be uneasy about getting more time without a footnote. I think academic institutions do recognize that LD students can be incredibly intelligent and talented.</p>

10

<p>There are three options for extra time: time and a half, double time, and unlimited time. Unlimited time is EXTREMELY rare. These newspaper articles really gave the impression that most students getting extra time do get the unlimited designation, when in reality, most who get extra time receive time and a half, like me. In addition, the College Board and ACT have been trying to spot potential "accommodations shoppers." Though many of the policies are bogus and don't work correctly, they are the only current solution. Basically, if the child already took the test without accommodations and got an average score, they refuse to give the student any and say that his/her scores are already good enough. In reality, this doesn't work because there are many bright LD kids who would score as high as 2100+ but then score average because of their lack of accommodations. (Points to self)</p>

<p>There are other accommodations on the other hand that stir little controversy; I am allowed to circle my answers to questions in the test book and the proctor transcribes my answers to the answer sheet after the test. I get this because I have a visual tracking issue. As you can imagine, giving this accommodation to a normal student couldn't possibly change his/her score. So does the person who has a visual tracking issue and nothing else deserve his/her test to be flagged, suggesting a much more severe accommodation?</p>

<p>That's the issue. Frankly, on my applications my scores being flagged or not wouldn't make a difference because I talk about my disability in my essay, so they know anyway.</p>

<p>In the Florida university system, applications have a check box where you are allowed to declare you have a disability. Disclosing it is completely optional. If you check the box you are asked to send your documentation to the disabilities services office where they will give recommendations to the admissions office on what obstacles you may have overcome and if that should have any bearing on admission. The admissions committee has the final say and has no obligation to follow the recommendations of the disability services department. In addition, it was able validate your reasons for taking the SAT/ACT with extended time back in the days they used to be flagged. This check box is VERY helpful when applying to the more selective schools like the University of Florida because it allows you to give verifiable reasons you couldn't start AP classes earlier in high school etc. This way, they can look beyond those things while looking at your application. Personally, I feel all colleges in the U.S. should adopt this system.</p>

11

<p>I would want colleges to know about LD; my child works really hard to compensate. Just am a little nervous that so many people think it is a good idea for me to spend time and effort getting my non-LD kid diagnosed! I'm way too busy surfing CC!</p>

12

<p>You guys are either arrogant or ignorant if you believe that extra time is fair. Screw kids with LD's, they either need to take the test "STANDARDIZED", or not at all.</p>

13

<p>
[quote]
I am allowed to circle my answers to questions in the test book and the proctor transcribes my answers to the answer sheet after the test. I get this because I have a visual tracking issue. As you can imagine, giving this accommodation to a normal student couldn't possibly change his/her score.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>I think you're wrong. Misbubbling is pretty common. Sometimes entire rows are off. I'm not unsympathetic, but don't think it's not a problem for kids without a diagnosis.</p>

<p>So if 504s and IEPs aren't enough for these accomodations, what is?</p>

14

<p>College Board provides some information on the process. Here's a link.
Application</a> Process</p>

15

<p>Wow, anyone who abuses the SAT extra-time guidelines meant for kids who are truly in need of it are completely morons and idiots and dont deserve to go to college - pieces of dirty scum.</p>

16

<p>dvm, please never become a playwright.</p>

17

<p>
[quote]
I am allowed to circle my answers to questions in the test book and the proctor transcribes my answers to the answer sheet after the test. I get this because I have a visual tracking issue. As you can imagine, giving this accommodation to a normal student couldn't possibly change his/her score.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Lol, are you kidding me? Well guess what, I dropped 100 points on my first take of the SAT because I have a .. dun dun dun "VISUAL TRACKING ISSUE" and misbubbled, shifting some of my answers down by one and skipping a line! Oops, I'm such a bad tracker, man. If I had gotten to write in the book, I would have gotten the 2400 the first time (my answers were correct, just shifted, I verified that with a QAS). So yes, my score WOULD have changed. And I'm not an isolated case. I know others without so called LDs who made silly mistakes like that, accidentally missing a line, bubbling in two answer choices by accident, forgetting to bubble something they knew the answer to, not bubbling in dark enough, shifting down or shifting up. Lots of kids make bubbling mistakes because the SAT is a HIGH-STRESS, FAST-PACED, TEDIOUS, WEARYING experience, and that is how it was designed. that is why lots of the most meticulous students are making juvenile bubbling mistakes, something you will never do because extra accomodations have made it IMPOSSIBLE for you to make a bubbling error. If bubbling is truly irrelevant to the purpose of the SAT, then why do you not have to worry about it when others do?</p>

<p>"Can't possibly change our scores", eh? I guess we're all LD, cool. Now maybe I can finally get into my dream college, MooMoo Community College (GO COWS!!!)</p>

18

<p>Would you people who are against accomodations also suggest a blind person have none? These kids cannot help their disabilities, and I am sure would never choose to go through life with the difficulties they encounter. I have a son who was diagnosed at age 4 with ADHD, and then dyslexia and dysgraphia. All of these affect his test taking. He had to go through a battery of tests throughout his academic life. These tests not only confirmed over and over that he in fact has these disabilities, but also included IQ tests, which document his above average intelligence.</p>

<p>He was granted accomodations, which included extra time. Did he make use of this time? NO, and the reason is because of his AD/HD with impulsivity. Because of his disability, he actually had great difficulty sitting through a test of this length. He finished well ahead of the standard time, even though I begged him to double check his work, especially that he had bubbled in the correct answers.</p>

<p>The frustration I have seen him suffer because of the hell he has gone through, from children making fun of his reading--even though he always read above grade level to himself, his phonetic dyslexia made reading out loud difficult, to "helping" moms making him redo writing assignments because he did it so sloppily, to not being able to concentrate long enough to complete assignments. Do you truly think a student would choose this? To mock the fact that everyone makes mistakes and tires proves your naivete and immaturity, and does nothing to prove your superiority. As many of the 2400 SAT kids are learning, it is not all about the numbers. </p>

<p>I agree, there probably have been abuses, just as there are in every facet of life. However, I know that our documentation had to be impeccable, and could not even have been a recent diagnosis, even with documentation. </p>

<p>Sorry for the rant, but you struck a nerve. Also, check out the medical journals, which have documented research proving that there is definitely a difference in brain functions of people with AD/HD.</p>

19

<p>Here we go again amb3r. I really didn't want to fight you in two different threads at the same time. Craziness.</p>

<p>Well, you're off again with the assumption that LD children are only good for community colleges. Perhaps Yale will educate you on that subject in the future.........or better yet, a LD student at Yale.</p>

<p>My "play" was made to be comical and outright ridiculous, though it does explain your position on the issue: comical and outright ridiculous.</p>

<p>And if you ever did read any of my posts in the ACT thread (I doubt you did because you keep ignoring my questions) you would have seen that my visual issue is beyond what you are describing. I'm tired of typing this stuff again and again, so go back to it.</p>

<p>And guess what? With the right accommodations, the SAT is still a high-stress, fast-paced, tedious, wearying experience.</p>

<p>BTW, I completely agree that in rare instances, the system is abused. The situation, however, is overblown in these articles.</p>

<p>I'll ask this question one more time amb3r, and this time you'll answer it. What proof exists that LD children don't have the capabilities to succeed in a professional workplace?</p>

20

<p>
[quote]
Well, you're off again with the assumption that LD children are only good for community colleges. Perhaps Yale will educate you on that subject in the future.........or better yet, a LD student at Yale.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Dvm, my comment about MooMoo community college was a joke, but maybe your visual tracking disability makes it difficult for you to understand sarcasm when you see it. heehee. Next time, I will try to keep the subtlety to a minimum, giving you the necessary accoMooMoo(Community College)dations to understand my points. :) Otherwise, I would be a Crusader of the Unfair in this cruel, cruel world.</p>

<p>Okay, I'm tired of arguing with you. I need to finish some mundane holiday-related things, and I have to find my santa hat.</p>