Our S19 just got back from an overnight at a liberal arts school and, while the hosts did not drink, they talked a lot about the drinking and drug scene at the school. It really turned S19 off. He and his friends are athletes and do not drink or use drugs. He’s a social kid but just not interested in drinking. I’ve explained that there’s plenty of drinking in college even at schools that are not considered “party schools”. At the same time, though, I do want him to be able to find his people when he gets to school and not feel like he’s one of the few non-drinkers. Who knows? He may end up having a few beers here and there but he’s really against a big party culture.
I just read another thread where the student had the same experience, this time at Davidson which is also on S19’s list. We visit these LACs and everything just seems fantastic. Bright students, plenty of attention from professors, lots of options for research, clubs that aren’t uber-competitive so kids can contribute without having to try out for everything. How does one evaluate the student social culture accurately?
Our plan right now is to wait until acceptances and then visit where he gets in…and hope he can correctly gauge what the social scene really is on campus. At most of his schools, we know there are kids from our high school who he can maybe ask. He doesn’t know most of them but we think he should get in touch with them if their school ends up being considered in the spring. Any other suggestions on how to get the real scoop? I really want to believe that he could find his spot at these schools but after his visit and now reading about the Davidson overnight experience, I’m getting a bit concerned. Schools on his list include Grinnell, Carleton, Kenyon, Hamilton, Bowdoin, Middlebury, Davidson, and Dartmouth. I know all of their reputations. We just can’t seem to get to the real truth about any of them.
My dd ran away from a school where on the overnight drinking, drugs, and active use of Tinder were all that went on. She has the exact opposite type of personality. She recognizes that were other students on campus who were probably more like her, but it was one of the smallest campuses on her list and ultimately she decided she liked large campuses better bc it was easier to find her tribe.
What’s the real truth? If you talk to student A, he is going to give you his perspective, and if you talk to student B, you may be getting a different perspective. When AOs put together a class they tend to try to get a diverse class - jocks, nerds, musicians, artists…Most students do find find their own tribe, unless the school is so small that it is very homogeneous.
I am familiar with son’s list of schools. They are top tier LACs and there are students who study hard and party hard. At the same time, I am sure there are students who do not party at those LACs. I think it would be very hard to find any school where students do not party (drink).
My daughter turned down a school because when she did over night, her host took her to a choir practice and a coffee shop - not her idea of a good time. It was unfortunate she didn’t get paired with someone who was more like her. It is why I am not a big fan of over night visit because it could turn off a student if the host is not a good match.
I can tell you about Grinnell. My son is a senior, he does not drink or use drugs and has no problem finding his people. The first three years he lived in substance free housing and this year lives in a dorm that is on the same side of campus as the substance free dorms. According to him the campus is split in thirds between kids who drink, smoke pot or do neither. His freshman roommate was an athlete, so there are athletes who are substance free. The great thing about Grinnell is that none of the students care which group you fall in, it is an incredibly accepting, non-judgmental place.
It’s difficult (if not impossible) to find colleges where most students don’t drink at least somewhat regularly. The NIAAA reports that 60% of college students have drunk alcohol in the last month, and around 40% have engaged in binge drinking in that time frame. There are colleges where these rates are somewhat lower, sure, but alcohol is prevalent on the campuses of all of the colleges popular on CC.
Risk factors for a high level of alcohol abuse on college campuses include small enrollment, strong Greek presence, lots of athletes, mostly white student body, and location in the Northeast and Midwest (per a Harvard Public Health study).
College visits are often hit-or-miss; a lot of people are turned off (or pleasantly surprised by) the person they happen to get as a tour guide or host. Roll the dice again and you may get very different results. ¯_(ツ)_/¯ Waiting until the acceptances come in to make a decision to cut a school seems like a good course of action.
@warblersrule Understood that college kids drink. That’s ok. He doesn’t have a big chip on his shoulder about it but would hope he could go to parties and not drink or find kids who have other interests for some of the weekend nights.
I feel for you! My daughter wanted that small LAC experience as well, and is not a partier. We thought we did our due diligence in scoping out schools. But, when she got there, she did not find her people. Drinking and drugs were everywhere. I wish we had done overnights. She ended up transferring to a medium size state U and even though it has a big party environment there is a bigger variety of students and she is able to avoid that scene.
He might want to investigate sub-free housing at all those schools. It is the quickest way to find friends immediately who aren’t focused on partying. I’d say Carleton is a bit less party oriented than some of the others on your list (and I’d say that is backed up by the kids I’ve known who went there - he’d most definitely find a lot of kids not focused on it there). One of my kids turned down a school partly due to hard partying hosts at accepted student days — it wasn’t the only reason, though.
My kids did all of their overnights during accepted student visits (but that did mean at only a few schools that they got into and were top choices). The sdvantage of that timing is that the school often organizes activities for your kid to try out that don’t require sticking with the host, and there are more opportunities to meet other students because of that. So I think it is easier to get a read on the school.
@ucbalumnus you mean, the more athletes, the more drinking? I know that might be the case. I still don’t get it though. Our S19 is a xc/track runner and there would be no way for these kids to drink. They run 50-60 miles a week and take care of their bodies. His high school XC team are all student/athletes. Four of the 15 seniors are NMSF. So, my point is that he’s an athlete so he’s just fine with a large percentage of athletes but hoping to find some like-minded ones who aren’t “jocky”. (And of course he’s hoping to meet many, many non-athletes as well.)
My own two went to the same college and had two different experiences, despite overlapping years. Can the drinking be obnoxious? Yes. I might suggest he qualify the schools based on his academic opportunities, research opps, relationships that students can develop with profs, summer internships and career support, etc. Later, when admitted, take a closer look at the social on a visit.
Also check things like library and lab hours. Google the college and alcohol. Not for policies but yo see what sorts of info comes up. I’m afraid it’s very difficult to find colleges with little drinking. But less hard to find kids who dont overindulge.
Our experiences at Dartmouth with drinking and partying were not good.
I think it’s a good idea to connect with as many students as possible to talk about the culture. Very hard to tell from just an overnight because it’s so skewed by the hosts.
@lookingforward Right. Overindulging is what he’s trying to avoid if possible. He gets that kids will drink. And, like I said, he may end up having a beer or two. But he’s not interested in weekends where the goal is for everyone to get wasted and hook up. This is what he was hearing. His overnight experience really made him think that these kids drink a LOT.
@momofsenior1 the overnight experience at Dartmouth was not good? or the experience as an actual student was not good? I know about Dartmouth’s reputation but there have to be some serious students there out of 4000 undergrads who have a beer every once in a while and don’t overindulge every weekend.
@CottonTales ugh. I KNOW that. I’m saying that it’s also possible to be an athlete who does not. Not all sports have jocks who party hard all weekend. S19 and his friends are sporty kids. Most of them played very competitive soccer and tennis before switching to XC and track. They just aren’t dumb jocks who want to drink themselves into oblivion. So, where are the student athletes then? They exist I’m sure.
This was a work hard/party hard college and D1 was both. Some events were wild. But otoh, D2 stopped drinking at all in 2nd year and still had very close friends (still close to them, post grad.) Nice, smart, hip, cosmopolitan kids.
It’s hard to get a good read, in advance. All your choices will have a mix.