Duke is overrated.

College Search & Selection
181

<p>Word. I think Chicago is an awesome school, i just took offense to some high school senior attending Chicago next year saying that its superior to Duke, obviously without knowing anything about academics/fun/the real world.</p>

182

<p>^ Yes, but people got turned off by your attitude. </p>

<p>I would expect more from a graduating Duke senior than a high school senior entering college.</p>

183

<p>My attitude that I think Duke is better than Chicago in nearly every way? Well, I do think that...but I still think Chicago is a strong school. I just get irritated extensively by the whole "Chicago is a superior intellectual experience bla bla bla" mentality of a lot of people.</p>

184

<p>^ you also wrote blunt statements like "Duke>Cornell", "Duke>Chicago", and "Duke>Brown"...TTP, i believe most people in the country know that Duke is a fine school, no need to bash other fine schools.</p>

185

<p>agreed. i think the united states is damn lucky to have any of these institutions. uchicago is an anomaly of sorts, sorta like reed college except on a grander scale; these kinds of places are perfect for the right people and certainly provide an outstanding education that equals that of any undergraduate institution in the nation</p>

186

<p>A lot of you guys/girls aren't very adept to responding directly to arguments. Maybe a debate or rhetorics class is in order.;)</p>

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<p>Um, people do get off waitlists you know. I believe you are familiar with the concept since you were accepted off the waitlist at Yale. You should consider yourself extremely fortunate. Duke is just as good if not better than all the Ivies besides HYP academically and boasts a better social life so I don't know why I would be bitter.</p>

<p>

Seeing as the SAT/ACTs are the only objective tools for measuring the quality of a student body, how do you suggest we compare the student bodies at schools across the country? Students at Mississippi State are just as smart as the kids at Harvard!! They just did a "little" worse on their standardized tests because they are bad testtakers.:rolleyes: Get real man.</p>

<p>

Chicago might have a lot of extracurricular offerings but I still stand by TTP's claim in the sense that Duke has a better support structure in place for translating students' college extracurricular experiences/research into FT job offers on Wall Street and admission into the nation's top med/law/biz schools than Chicago since it's more pre-professional.</p>

<p>

It doesn't really matter what you think about preprofessionalism. The fact is that a VAST MAJORITY of college students use an undergraduate education as a stepping stone to a professional career and not for graduate school in academia. So, what TTP and I are arguing is that the VAST MAJORITY of high school seniors would be choosing Duke over UChicago since it's better socially/academically and thus it is a much more desired school overall. MOST kids like making money out of college and MOST kids like to party in college. There is a small minority of kids that would prefer UChicago under your criterion of having an academic mindset but I must emphasize again that this is a MINORITY.</p>

<p>

Duke is definitely different, better academically and MUCH better socially than Chicago.</p>

<p>

Actually, Duke students hang out in small groups and go to the same 5-6 bars too. However, there are MANY MORE of these small groups and the bars are MUCH MORE frequently visited at Duke as supposed to UChi. Most Chicago kids don't enjoy socializing in the traditional sense. They would much rather discuss The Republic over Chinese takeout on Friday night than pregame for a couple of hours in the dorm and roll out to a club. There are definitely social circles and niches at Duke that complement the UChicago social scene so what I'm saying is that even the "niche" Chicago students would fit in well at Duke. Unless of course, you're of the belief that just the mere fact that you're going to be in close contact with a number of students who choose to party a lot will be detrimental to your college experience directly somehow. I definitely think that if you're the type of person that is extremely judgmental of the individual decisions of people regarding alcohol, drugs and sex, then you probably will like Chicago more. However, this is simply no the case for the vast majority of kids.</p>

<p>

Why? TTP uses objective, logical and fact-based reasoning as supposed to the flawed arguments made by many of the posters on this thread like yourself. The reason TTP and I defend our school so vigorously is that we constantly come across ignorant people like the OP who bash Duke for being extremely conservative, unintellectual, self-segregating, inferior to all of the Ivies since it's not an Ivy and for being an institution that's filled overwhelmingly with jocks, frat boys and impressionable white girls. Many of these ill-informed opinions have been formed as a result of an overly-exaggerated Rolling Stones article, a false lacrosse scandal and the wrongly-stereotypical novel "I Am Charlotte Simmons". When in reality, Duke is filled with an extremely diverse student body whose overall interests can be categorized to fill a wide variety of nicles, whose cumulative credentials are only surpassed by the student bodies of HYP and who enjoy success in job-hunting on Wall Street and placement into the top law/med/biz schools at rates only surpassed by HYPS and matched by students at Dartmouth, Columbia and Penn.</p>

<p>TTP is a minority who got a near-perfect SAT score, played football in high school, appeared on CNN as an freshman, participated in various organizations on campus, was active in a fraternity, enjoyed a good social life, pulled off good grades and is now going to work for one of the top 3 consulting firms in the country and will likely make 100k+ right out of college. Suprisingly, I would say he is closer to the norm rather than an exception to the typical Duke senior. I'm sorry you expected more of him as a Duke senior UCBChemEGrad. Clearly, Berkeley students are commonly far more accomplished. Oh wait...</p>

187

<p>
[quote]
Why?

[/quote]

Are you kidding me? </p>

<p>While TTP may be correct on student strength with SATs, and Wall Street I-banking placement, he loses credibililty by bashing Chicago over its lack of social experiences. </p>

<p>It is his language and tone that has an air of arrogance that places himself in a bad light. It is for this reason why I said I expect more from a Duke grad than a high school student.</p>

188

<p>Kim Jong Il, you're taking my comments out of context...It's not TTP's accomplishments that I have a problem with.</p>

189

<p>"Duke is definitely different, better academically and MUCH better socially than Chicago."</p>

<p>Utterly preposterous claim EAD. No university on Earth is "better" than Chicago save maybe Harvard, MIT, Princeton, Stanford and Yale...MAYBE!</p>

<p>Chicago and Duke are academic peers for undergraduate education and Chicago is superior to Duke in most graduate programs.</p>

<p>As far as social life goes, that depends on one's preference. Personally, I would prefer a more laid back and liberal atmosphere, so Chicago trumps Duke. Of course, for a traditional college experience, socially speaking, I agree that Duke is better than Chicago.</p>

190

<p>can we turn this into a Duke vs. Pennnotwharton grudgematch instead of the whole Chicago thing please... because um, I'm trying to decide still and ya
cool :)</p>

191

<p>^ I'll start...</p>

<p>IMO, Penn/Wharton >>> Duke.</p>

192

<p>"So, what TTP and I are arguing is that the VAST MAJORITY of high school seniors would be choosing Duke over UChicago since it's better socially/academically and thus it is a much more desired school overall. MOST kids like making money out of college and MOST kids like to party in college. There is a small minority of kids that would prefer UChicago under your criterion of having an academic mindset but I must emphasize again that this is a MINORITY."</p>

<p>Both of you seem not to understand that "what most people want" =/= "better." Most high school seniors across the land -- not just the high-ranking ones who populate CC -- would probably prefer Arizona State over Harvard because the climate is always warm, the academics are less demanding, the girls are hot, and there are parties galore. Does that make ASU better than Harvard?</p>

<p>I am planning a visit to a particular city I've never been to. I am choosing between a luxury "mainstream" (brand name) hotel, and a charming, off the beaten path but equally luxurious bed & breakfast. Most people would rather go to the luxury mainstream hotel because they're familiar with this name, and like the standard amenities. The appeal of this particular bed & breakfast is much more limited; some people don't want the quirks of a b&b; they want to be able to have a gym and a lobby and other typical amenities. However, that doesn't make the b&b an INFERIOR choice to the hotel. It's just a DIFFERENT choice. </p>

<p>Thinking about things so linearly ... that there always must be an A > B > C ... isn't really the hallmark of an intelligent or well-educated person, IMO. At the Duke and UChicago level, the schools are both excellent and will provide anyone any opportunity in life they darn well want. It comes down to PERSONAL preference, which is not the same as UNIVERSAL preference.</p>

193

<p>"There are definitely social circles and niches at Duke that complement the UChicago social scene so what I'm saying is that even the "niche" Chicago students would fit in well at Duke. Unless of course, you're of the belief that just the mere fact that you're going to be in close contact with a number of students who choose to party a lot will be detrimental to your college experience directly somehow."</p>

<p>Some people DO feel that way. At the extreme, that's why BYU exists, that's why Wheaton College (Illinois) exists. At lesser extremes, that's why you have UChicago, Reed, Swarthmore, etc. which offer qualitatively different cultures than Duke, Stanford, NU, etc. So what? Why can't they just be equal but different? Why can't you get it through your minds that it's equally valid to prefer the UChicago type of culture as the Duke culture?</p>

194

<p>"TTP is a minority who got a near-perfect SAT score, played football in high school, appeared on CNN as an freshman, participated in various organizations on campus, was active in a fraternity, enjoyed a good social life, pulled off good grades and is now going to work for one of the top 3 consulting firms in the country and will likely make 100k+ right out of college."</p>

<p>Good for TTP that he'll "likely make 100k+ right out of college," but maybe you don't seem to get that there are plenty of students at all of the top colleges who are NOT primarily driven by what they think they'll make. I doubt the average UChicago student thinks that way, and success isn't merely predicated on money. And? So?</p>

195

<p>"Chicago might have a lot of extracurricular offerings but I still stand by TTP's claim in the sense that Duke has a better support structure in place for translating students' college extracurricular experiences/research into FT job offers on Wall Street and admission into the nation's top med/law/biz schools than Chicago since it's more pre-professional."</p>

<p>BUT LIFE DOESN'T CONSIST SOLELY OF FT JOB OFFERS ON WALL STREET AND ADMISSION INTO MED/LAW/BUSINESS SCHOOLS. Frankly, if that's all you think students have in terms of goals, that doesn't reflect well on Duke.</p>

196

<p>
[quote]
You can still find a UChicago-like intellectual niche here at Duke. Actually, there's a co-ed frat in the IFC here in which the brothers/sisters socialize primarily through board games and intellectual conversations, NOT alcohol. So tell me, why would even a UChicago-type student not mesh well into the Duke community if he/she could have the same sort of experience here?

[/quote]

As a newly-initiated brother of that specific fraternity, I can say that this is an accurate description.</p>

197

<p>Pizzagirl - we are pointing out at Duke has much better pre-professional placement than Chicago. However, we are also pointing out that it has an intellectual niche with students interested in grad school, theater, etc., just like Chicago. Basically, Duke has a wide range of social options.</p>

198

<p>And? Some people who prefer the intellectual niche prefer a school where most everyone is of that bent; others who prefer the intellectual niche prefer a school where only some are of that bent. Why does that make the second school "better" than the first? </p>

<p>Having a wider range of social options is just that - wider. Not necessarily better. Is it "better" to have a Greek system on a campus than not? I enjoyed my Greek system just fine and it was a highlight of MY particular college experience, but I can't conclude that any college that doesn't have a Greek system is "inferior" or that my school is "better" because it did. It's just different.</p>

199

<p>Braaap, I'd go Pennnotwharton over Duke myself. Which is not to say that both are not excellent choices :-)</p>

200

<p>I'm going to be honest here.
As a whole, Duke is NOT intellectual.
It is a different environment than University of Chicago.</p>

<p>It is easy to find intellectual-types at Duke (I did..), and it's much easier than it was at my high school (on the other hand, I didn't go to one of these fancy boarding schools where everyone goes to a top school... I went to a regular public school), but I would say that Chicago is likely the more intellectual school. I think I would have met more people like some of the really good friends I have made at Duke in a place like Chicago.. or even Dartmouth or Georgetown and definitely Brown, HYP.</p>

<p>I chose Duke over Chicago because Duke held this more 'selective' factor.
In the Northeast, Duke is more selective than most of the lower Ivies.
This is because Duke has to have a certain percentage of its students from North Carolina.
I know of more people on Long Island who got into Penn and not Duke than the latter.</p>

<p>It wasn't until I first went on College Confidential six months ago that I learned of Duke's 'inferiority'.</p>