<p>is EC's a major factor in admission process?
i.e, would someone with good grades&test scores and good essay be rejected if he didnt have enough EC's?
im wondering if UC is one of those schools that put more weight on academics rather than other activities.</p>
<p>Pretty much every school puts more weight on academics. The only reason ECs are important at top schools is that there are so many students who are academically qualified. However, I'd say U of C puts less weight on ECs than other top schools and the essay definitely counts more. So in the situation that you described, I'm sure that applicant would be fine. Not to say that ECs don't matter-they want to see that you do something with your time and have some interests. Libby said something along those lines once...you can look for it if you want.</p>
<p>It's not how EC's many one has, but the quality of, and how passionate one is abut the EC's they do have.</p>
<p>With ECs, there is also the matter of the college wanting to select a well-rounded class. For example, they want to have enough to fill out sports teams, debate teams, political and religious groups, etc. While it doesn't mean you have to be super at everything and join everything, you can't fill out all your clubs and organizations by picking mostly kids who never leave the library.</p>
<p>From Libby on the other thread:</p>
<p>I think it's this extracurriculars hubbub. It makes me uncomfortable to see the way that college applicants are changing their lives so that they will "look better" to college admissions counselors who really only want to see them be happy and healthy. A question we ask ourselves a lot, and that you should probably ask the college counselors you meet, is: are we educators or are we businessmen? I am an educator, and as an educator I want my applicants to be healthy, and as healthy applicants, I'd rather you go on a bike ride than clock that 500th hour at a community service venture you don't really care about.</p>
<p>If your EC list shows that 1) you are interested in something (or two or three or four things) and, 2) you are doing that thing(s) you are interested in, then you've won.</p>
<p>Amen to that. And while I believe Libby, and UChicago by proxy, are being honest about it, do not the admissions decisions of other top schools indicate otherwise, even though they often spout some of the same rhetoric?</p>
<p>Also from Libby:</p>
<p>I have to say that ECs are very much overvalued in the media and on this discussion board. We just want you to be doing something that you like, which is not sitting on the couch. That can take any number of forms, from taking care of your little brother, to writing a political blog, to starting the pro-life league of San Jose. We do notice the “serial joiners” who do way more activities in their senior year than ever before.</p>
<p>Good for Chicago. That's all I have to say. =)</p>
<p>You should listen to Libby. </p>
<p>Observing from the trenches, I can tell you that the only way ECs matter is:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>sports. Even Chicago wants to fill out its teams. Coach wants you? It helps.</p></li>
<li><p>stellar performance or recognition in an EC. But note that it is the success or performance that matters, not the EC.</p></li>
<li><p>numbers. There are usually enough string instrument players floating about that a college does not need to pay attention to it (other than for stars. See previous.)</p></li>
</ul>
<p>Now, do colleges care about filling out teams and clubs, as drummerdude says? Only those in which the college has invested its reputation. Sports I've already mentioned. Debate? Maybe at some places that take pride in their winning debate teams. I don't sense that at Chicago. Other clubs etc? They exist for the students. The admin could care less.</p>
<p>If you want to know what ECs matter at a college, look at where they spend their money, and who spends it. If Student Government spends the money to fly the debate team to meets, (or more likely, take an overnight bus!), then I bet you the admin, and the adcoms, could care less about debaters. If the university, from U funds, sends them, then the admin cares.</p>
<p>The funding info is not easy to get. You might have to ask. But, if you're good enough in your EC that you want to continue, you probably should ask.</p>
<p>Newmassdad, you're forgetting the U of C's top-notch Mock Trial team! :)</p>
<p>I disgaree with Newmassdad that those are the only times ECs matter. I think a vital part of what Libby has said is the fact that you need to be doing something. You can't just waste every spare minute playing video games. Do ECs matter in that you need community service, NHS, soccer, Church, and all the rest? Of course not. But you need to show that you are a person who is interesting, interested, and active. I know that I would much rather have a campus of students who like to be involved in one thing or another than a campus full of kids who don't want to do anything other than sit and play video games for all hours. This seems to be especially the case seeing the direction U of C admissions has been moving in recently in terms of the types of students they're trying harded to admit.</p>
<p>corranged,</p>
<p>you are overinterpreting what I said. Would replacing "matter" with "help" make it more clear?</p>
<p>To put it another way, few ECs provide a boost. A complete lack of any ECs makes someone look a bit too lopsided, perhaps. </p>
<p>Funny how the admissions person says they're way overrated yet others still see the need to argue the point.</p>
<p>EC's can help with the overall picture of the student. If one is pushing the envelope with an truly loved EC that is both challenging and takes dedication and discipline, it will probably be advantageous. Having a list of EC's just to have them will probably work against one. I felt my S's EC's helped, but I have no way of verifying this. His essays were and stellar and that may have been all it took to overcome a GPA well below the comfort range.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Would replacing "matter" with "help" make it more clear?
[/quote]
Yes. I would say that word change would shift the meaning of your statement considerably. Something can matter without it helping a whole lot, like having some normal ECs won't help you very much in admissions but showing that you do something with your time does matter.
[quote]
Funny how the admissions person says they're way overrated yet others still see the need to argue the point.
[/quote]
There's a difference between something being overrated and something not mattering. What we are discussing is which ECs matter, how they matter, and to what degree they matter. </p>
<p>ECs can most certainly help in admissions, particularly if you're talented and devoted to whatever it is. Otherwise the specific ECs don't matter a whole lot, but it is important that you show that you do something with your life other than sit and watch TV. This activity does not need to be what CC kids see as conventional ECs but can involve volunteering with safer sex organizations, studying and performing your culture's traditional dance, building computers and writing code, learning languages on your own, designing masks, or whatever other productive things you like to do with your time. It can also include more common acitivities such as playing tennis, playing the piano, Model UN, woring with your Church, etc. (I know students here who did all of the things I've listed.) My main EC was music, and I know that the U of C cared about this EC, and I'm confident that it added to my application.</p>
<p>
[quote]
ECs can most certainly help in admissions, particularly if you're talented and devoted to whatever it is.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>This is commonly stated, of course. See idad in #12, for example. But curiously, there is little proof it actually matters in practice!</p>
<p>Worse, it is hard to know what "talented and devoted" means, especially in comparison to the rest of the talent pool. </p>
<p>Some parents think a kid who is first violin in the HS orchestra is a standout. At some schools, they're a dime a dozen in the applicant pool. </p>
<p>Further, I suspect, based strictly on anecdotal evidence, that there are few academically high performing kids that are not at least "local level standouts" in something. </p>
<p>But enough debate. If you feel, in the absence of any real info, that your ECs are going to matter, go for it. You'll have lots of company. But I would like to see kids that do an EC because they find the EC rewarding in its own right, not because they're building a resume. Then, it does not matter anyway.</p>
<p>Thanks everyone!!
i was just getting worried seeing kids at my school w/ pages of resume;;</p>
<p>I was speaking of my own experience, newsmass. I know that music mattered for me because the head of the department told me about reviewing the CD I sent in, and gave me an idea of the ranking and review she sent back to admissions about it. If admissions didn't care, they never would have taken the trouble of sending my recording to the music department to be evaluated.
[quote]
If you feel, in the absence of any real info, that your ECs are going to matter, go for it.
[/quote]
I am a student at the U of C already. Regardless, why wouldn't someone include their activities on the application where it asks for them? Everyone should include what they have done because the application asks.
[quote]
But I would like to see kids that do an EC because they find the EC rewarding in its own right, not because they're building a resume.
[/quote]
Of course this is true. Very few people, and no admissions counselors I've ever heard of, would debate this. I would only say that colleges are looking for the kids who have something they find rewarding and interesting and fun, and those are the students they want to fill their freshman class. </p>
<p>Anyway, as you said--enough arguing. To the point: Accepted, I'm sure that you will be just fine. Don't worry about it. Do the things you love to do, and everything will work out.</p>
<p>corranged,</p>
<p>Let me take another stab at this EC business, less someone misunderstand.</p>
<p>As Libby said, ECs matter to the degree that they show the applicant has a life, gets away from the video games, as you've said, and has a human side. But, this establishes a minimum standard, like when a college says "four years of english, two years of foreign language" and so forth. Beyond that, tough to say. But there's little evidence that"better" ECs make much difference.</p>
<p>In your case, depending on your major, your instrument and such, it could have made a difference, but who knows. And if the person to whom you refer was Barbara Shubert, I'd say she was more interested in keeping you in the orchestra than having an admissions impact. You may know she is a somewhat controversial figure. FWIW, many colleges send all CDs to the department. So that alone does not mean much. I would mean something if an <strong>admissions rep</strong> told you your music was the tipping factor. But you did not hear that. </p>
<p>Look, there are many folks the admissions office needs to keep happy. That does not mean they all get a say in decisions. </p>
<p>Now, for the important questions:</p>
<ul>
<li> what instrument do you play?</li>
<li> how do you like U of C?</li>
<li> what year? What concentration?</li>
</ul>
<p>I read Libby's statement as: all the hype you hear about how you have to do this many ec's and you have to do some leadership and community service and be 'well rounded' to get into any college is not true. For example, Chicago doesn't care if you're in NHS or Spanish Club or build model airplanes or some combination of the three. They just want you to be doing something. In that sense, the EC's don't matter all that much.</p>
<p>However, I think that if you have a really strong EC or two, say serious scientific research, or real talent in music or art, etc, it'll certinatly help your file. Not necissarily because those are some sort of godlike EC's, but because they show talent / promise, which is important to Chicago, no?</p>
<p>As an aside, during my on campus interview, I was told that when I submit my application I should further explain my research, which "can make an application stand out" and to fully explain a project that I've spent a considerable amount of time on (40+ hours a week, at it's peak).</p>
<p>It seems like we're close to agreement on the EC thing, for the most part. I'll PM you the rest.</p>
<p>Newmassdad makes a great point that some people overlook. ECs (and those who write them) that are senior year only, require little time or effort, and are meant to pad a resume are REALLY EASY for the adcoms to see through, and they will think less, not more, of you for seeing all that meaningless junk, IMHO.</p>