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meanwhile, engineering unemployment in 2004 was around 2.2%...</p>
<p>From what I understand, the number of computer sci. majors is way done because students have seen how U.S. industry has treated these skills; laying off and outsourcing at every opportunity.
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<p>I still maintain my original stance that engineering (and CS) is actually a quite useful undergrad degree to have, if for nothing else, than for the fact that it can deliver a relatively safe and decent-paying career. Of course it is not a completely safe career, but hey, it's a lot better than what a lot of other people have. For those people who think that majoring in engineering is a bad idea, I would ask, what other major is better? Film Studies? Art History? Parks & Rec? Leisure Studies? Yes, true, your engineering job might be outsourced. But it's better to have a job that might be outsourced than to not have a job at all. </p>
<p>Which is why I question the rationality of people who choose not to major in CS because they say they're scared of outsourcing. Ok, fine, maybe they are scared. But shouldn't all those people who are majoring in Parks & Rec be more scared of simply finding a job at all? Consider this quote:</p>
<p>"In the US, more students are getting degrees in parks and recreation than in electrical engineering."</p>
<p><a href="http://www.ti.com/corp/docs/press/company/2003/c03033.shtml%5B/url%5D">http://www.ti.com/corp/docs/press/company/2003/c03033.shtml</a> </p>
<p>Like I said, EE degrees might be less valuable because of outsourcing. But it's still gotta be better than what a Parks & Rec degree can get you. </p>
<p>I would furthermore point out that there are a LOT of mediocre no-name colleges out there an a lot of bad jobs. Not every college graduate gets a good or even half-decent job after graduation. A lot of college graduates out there really do end up driving taxis, waiting tables or sweeping floors. When we're talking about the plum engineering jobs, or star consulting or banking jobs, those jobs are generally available only to people at elite colleges. Let's face it. If you are going to a lower-tier no-name college, you're probably not going to get a good job after graduation. In fact, you might not even get a job at all. In that case, getting an engineering degree may be the best way for you to go. At least by doing that, while you'll probably end up with a low-end engineering job, that's still a lot better than what a lot of other people from that college end up with. I'd rather have a low-end engineering job at some low-end company than be mopping floors or washing dishes somewhere. For these people, getting that 45-50k engineering job is a pretty sweet deal. Engineering obviously doesn't guarantee you a job, but it's more of a job guarantee than a lot of other majors are. </p>
<p>I used to live in the Deep South and I've seen people from poor rural backgrounds struggle their way to degrees in Chemical Engineering or Petroleum Engineering at the local colleges. These guys are by their own admission, not superstar engineers. They know they have no chance of ever going to a place like MIT or Stanford, and they know they'll never make it to McKinsey or Goldman Sachs, or a Microsoft or Google. They're not earning top grades in their engineering classes, but at least they're passing their classes. All they want is to complete their engineering degree and get a job at the local oil refinery or natural gas processing plant or drilling platform. To them, making 45-50k a year to start is a fantastic sum of money, as some of were literally raised on welfare checks, and especially considering the low cost of living in those areas. They can use that salary to raise their family out of poverty, buy a house, etc. and that's all they really want. Engineering is obviously a great choice for them, given their circumstances. So I ask - if these people should not major in engineering, what else should they be doing? How else should they be trying to escape poverty? </p>
<p>As a corollary, that's why a lot of people in China and India study engineering. It's not because they really "love" engineering. It's because in those countries, if you're born poor, as most are, then engineering is a ticket out of poverty. I believe I read somewhere how engineering graduates in China can make 5 or even 10 times more than a liberal arts graduate in China does to start. If you're a poor kid in India, then getting into and graduating from IIT is a way to a much better life. </p>
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Do what you <em>LOVE</em>, or your lack of enthusiasm will be obvious to all potential employers.
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On the contrary, I could see many IIT (India) and Tsinghua (China) graduates perform better than their US counterparts, notably, MIT, Caltech, Stanford. With similar intelligence those from overseas maintain the perseverance to work harder and hence may perform better.
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<p>I would argue that fundamentally, Chinese and Indian engineers are not really "doing what they love". They're doing what pays. Or in other words, they're working hard in engineering for fear of having to return to the poverty-stricken life that they are trying to escape. A poor Indian may work extremely hard to get into and graduate from IIT if, for no other reason, because he doesn't want to be poor anymore. And let's face it. To be poor in India is to live a pretty bleak life.</p>
<p>And so you ask why is it that Americans at MIT, Stanford, etc. may not work as hard as those from IIT or Tsinghua or whatever. And the answer is simple - because they have no incentive to. Economics is all about incentives. The more incentives you give somebody, the more they will work to earn those incentives. I believe I read somewhere that a guy who graduates from IIT can expect to make a $8000-$10,000 starting salary. That's 3 times the per-capita income of India (which is about $3000). But a guy who graduates in engineering from MIT or Stanford cannot expect a starting salary of 3 times the US per-capita income (which is about $40,000). </p>
<p><a href="http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html%5B/url%5D">http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/rankorder/2004rank.html</a></p>
<p>If MIT engineers were all getting paid 120k to start, you'd definitely see a lot more Americans working hard to get into MIT engineering. But as it stands now, Americans realize that they can make a good living without busting their butt. American kids say "Why should I go to a difficult school like MIT when I can go to an easier school like an Ivy and still earn a comfortable living?. The MIT engineers may earn more, but not a huge amount more. Because the salary premium is not that large, I'd rather forfeit that premium and have more free time to enjoy myself in college." </p>
<p>The point is, the fewer incentives you give for hard work, the less hard work you will get. People don't work hard just to work hard. They work hard only if they think they will benefit from it. Hence, I wouldn't say American kids are lazy. They're just not properly incentivized. </p>
<p>And by that, again, I mean the Americans who are academic stars. Again, those kids in the Deep South I talked about see engineering as the best way to get out of poverty. That 40-50k engineering salary may be literally 3 times what they could make othewise. But few MIT engineers are making 3 times what the Ivy liberal arts graduates are making. </p>
<p>That's why I support a 2-track salary system. The regular engineers can continue to make that 40-50k to start. But what's so wrong with a superstar engineer getting paid 100-150k to start, especially if he's 3 times more productive than the regular engineer? You do this, and a lot of top MIT engineers would no longer drift over to banking or consulting.</p>