<p>If I decide to go with a more general major, such as simply Biology, would this open more doors for me, than say, attaining a degree in Environmental Science/Biology? </p>
<p>I was thinking, and I am not exactly sure what I want to do after my first four years in college, but I believe the Biology can be converted into many things after I graduate with a degree. For example, a Biology major can, if desired, apply to medical school, and pursue becoming a doctor, or some other professional in the medical field. In addition, A biology major can decide to educate others by becoming a teacher, and achieving his/her credential. Further opportunities exist as well - or so I have heard. </p>
<p>I’d say that it depends on your focus in Biology (e.g, Micro or Conservation, lab or field) as to what opportunites directly follow.</p>
<p>Med School does not require a specific major. It mostly depends on GPA, pre-req courses, MCAT, and interview.</p>
<p>Teachers come from all sorts of backgrounds. Some good ones never attended college (rare, though). It mostly depends on the state/district as to what qualifications are preferred. An Environmental Science degree would allow this, as would a Biology degree.</p>
<p>Now that you have narrowed down fields, start looking at programs at individual schools to see what they concentrate on. Do undergrads have a chance to do research, Where do alums work, How many have gone to Med School, etc. There was a thread on good Env. Science programs recently.</p>
<p>Good advice, and I will have to check out that post on environmental science programs. Do you know which section it was in? Thanks once again, this thread has really cleared a lot up for me, and thus, I wish to give my gratitude to all that have posted here!</p>
<p>Wow! Interesting to see what the college student thinks environmental science work is really about. I especially liked the counting bighorn sheep response…whatever. [fantasy! for all but about maybe 1 % ]
I have a masters in environmental management. I worked for a consulting firm and also did some consulting for the US army.
If you wish to pursue this degree because you think it’s about counting bugs and bunnies in the sunny outdoors like in some college recruitment or sierra club photo or you believe you will stop global warming by building windmills then you need to STOP WHAT YOU’RE DOING, before you borrow a huge amount of money or blow a huge amount of your parent’s money and look up local consulting firms or call your state dept. of the environment and ask to speak to someone who works as an environmental scientist and ask them the reality of trying to find work in the environmental field and what your daily duties may be. You seriously need to speak to real world professionals about what work in this field is really all about. SERIOUSLY!!!
As for work in consulting firms, if you can find it, ask someone what writing Phase I ESAs all day, week after week is about and then ask them about the salary too. That’s most likely what you’ll be able to do with an environmental science degree.
Again, SERIOUSLY, you need to ask real world professionals about what work in the environmental field is all about. Professors and college recruiters are CLUELESS!!! Most people burn out from the low pay and boring work in 2-5 years and go teach science in the public schools or go into nursing or pursue something completely different.
Environmental ENGINEERING has a better paying salary but that also has nothing to do with counting bighorn sheep in Montana and requires you to be a good engineering student and then, if you find work in that field it won’t be cleaning up anything very sexy. But at least in the engineering path you may actually end up doing something that actually helps the environment instead of writing boring reports or applying for corporate permits all day. The other jobs out there are more in environmental OSHA employee safety type work. Boring, but at least you can find work in that field.
Trust me, but don’t take my word for it, do some research now on your own or reap the benefits down the road, call actual real environmental scientists and ask them what this career field is really all about before you pursue this major.</p>
<p>I’m not sure what’s up with your post, but what was wrong with mine? Shiny20 expressed an interest in ES because they like the outdoors and they like biology. I have a friend who was pretty much the same, and he doesn’t just “count” bighorn sheep. He does help monitor the population and the health of the bighorn in general, but there are also aspects of park management, sample collection (for example, collecting blood samples for gene analysis), tracking herd movement and migration, and other such things. I brought it up because it sounded something that might interest the poster.</p>
<p>That said, I do have a lot of ES friends in consulting. And it’s true that more of my ES friends have been ending up in consulting than in conservation. However, just because more people are funneled in to consulting doesn’t mean that conservation isn’t a possible career path.</p>
<p>Based off what you’ve told us about your interests, I would say that environmental engineering is probabably not the best fit for you. That major is an offshoot of civil engineering (at U. Michigan they’re grouped in the same department), and they focus on hazardous waste disposal, design of water treatment systems, etc. </p>
<p>If you want a career in biological or environmental research & field work, I’d suggest getting a PhD in biology, ecology, or environmental science. Michigan’s School of Natural Resources & Environment (SNRE) is something that might interest you, as it offers a lot of field research opportunities. There’s also the UM Biological station and UROP program if you want to do research early as an undergrad.</p>
<p>I agree with a good bit of what enviroscientist has to say, esp. about the type of work that a lot of folks who obtain an Environmental Science degree perform. I can give more details if anyone is interested. Personally, I enjoy working as an Environmental Scientist - but the work that I perform is not “sexy”.</p>
<p>I’m sorry if my response about what most environmental science work was not what you wanted to hear. That does not however make it less accurate of a response. I merely wished to urge people thinking of pursuing that major that it would behoove them to call and talk to actual environmental scientists at consulting firms or with their state department of the environment or their parks department before choosing that as a major unless they don’t really care to find work in the field after college and just want to get a bachelor’s degree in environmental science because they think it would be interesting.
The truth IS that it is hard to find work in that field now. The jobs you will find will most likely be doing something like writing Phase I site assessments which is a little like writing the same book report over and over 12 months of the year and it is really only part of the liability end of real estate deals and on top of being boring and not really doing anything to help the environment…it also does not pay very well. If you rack up major college debt you may find yourself trapped in that job and living at your parent’s home for a long, long time or until you go back to college to get a nursing degree or something else that pays better. You may find work doing some other things at a consulting firm but it will most likely be similar work. The Bighorn sheep counting jobs I was alluding to and other parks department and natural resources jobs out in the environment pay almost nothing which is okay if you have a trust fund or a spouse whose job pays well and income isn’t terribly important and those jobs are funded by the government or a college [which is also partially funded by the government] and now that the stimulus money has been spent to keep the people currently doing those jobs on the payrolls for this year those jobs may be done away with next year. I am sorry if my post doesn’t seem very optimistic but I would hate to have someone pursue a major in this field because they think they will be out in the great outdoors getting paid a good wage to hike around and look at nature all day long. Those jobs are very hard to come by these days and they do not usually pay well. If you need to go to college to get a degree so you can move out of your parent’s home and support yourself you need to seriously do some research into this line of work before you jump into any big college loans that you will have to pay back later.
As with researching any college major you might wish to pursue do not rely on any information that comes from anyone who is not working in that field. Listening to someone who knows someone who knows someone whose brother in law does that type of work is pretty much useless. Also, relying on information from professors or the head of that college department is a bit like asking the barber if you need a haircut. They’ll tell you you do. My own dept head years ago would always give me a vague answer when I would ask them about what type of jobs I could get if I pursued my masters in Environmental Science and then he’d change the subject. That should’ve told me to research the field more myself.</p>
<p>Wow! All this talk and I was gone on vacation. Well, I have read all your recent posts, and I would like to sincerely thank all of you for pointing out the pros and cons of pursuing this type of degree. I think I have decided to take a more broad approach, and will probably major in Biology. I figure that Biology will be a better fit, with better options. If I want to pursue medicine, that’s possible, and if I finally do want to do something more nature or research oriented, that is also an option. Truthfully, I want to major in a science because I feel it is one of the safer routes to a higher paying job, and to a career that I will have interest in, and be challenged in. Thank you guys again for all of your wonderful aid! I still have some time to decide where I will take myself, so it’s back to the thinking board again, I suppose.</p>
It’s worth noting that there is a big difference between MEM programs and PhD programs. The former is more focused on consulting and policy, whereas the latter is geared toward research. At least at Duke, which is the only program I can vouch for, there is relatively little overlap in the goals and career outcomes of the different tracks. </p>
<p>I agree with much of your post. It’s the sort of thing I’ve often told posters wanting to go into marine biology thinking they’ll get to play with dolphins - the reality is you’ll get a week-long research cruise a year (at best) and spend the rest of the time writing up results and grant proposals. Still, it could be worse. There aren’t that many jobs that involve the outdoors at all, and environmental science is better than some and pays better than most.</p>
<p>
I’m in the camp that prefers a traditional science degree for environmental science. I switched from biology to geology, as I found it more practical (and I strongly dislike pre-meds). The last report that I saw (1998, so pretty old) reported 1.23 jobs for every biology graduate, 5.23 jobs for every physics graduate, 9.07 jobs for every chemistry graduate, and 14.35 jobs for every geology graduate. I’m biased, of course, but there are very few careers that have better prospects than geology, though there are several that pay more. Most people with a strong GIS background can find at least SOME job in CRM or related fields, and your prospects get a lot better if you have a background in hydrogeo or other in demand areas, which is more than you can say for some disciplines - even other sciences.</p>
<p>In more practical terms, it’s easy to go from biology to environmental science, but it’s less easy to go from environmental science to biology. Biology is a very flexible degree, though only a BS would be somewhat limiting.</p>
<p>enviroscientist: It’s not the message you were conveying, but rather the style of your original post that bothered me. You do bring up some good points about ES, and that is quite helpful and informative.</p>
<p>warblers: Do you know if they have an updated report of those 1998 statistics? I’m curious because I’m a geology major, and just about all of our grads go into academia or hydrogeology (and every once and a while, oil/energy). Of course, that’s like, 2-3 grads per year, compared to the MANY MANY biologists at my school, haha.
(sidenote: and I agree, premeds can be such a pain!)</p>
<p>How close it Ecology to Environmental Science? From what I can tell, Ecology is more focused on how the environment interacts and Environmental Science is more concerned with environmental issues. Is this accurate?</p>
<p>If I wanted to work at a zoo, perhaps, would an Ecology major be more fitting?</p>
<p>I am glad this post has grown so much, it gives not only me, but others with the same questions to obtain answers. Thanks again for all the help. I suppose I have come to grips with the majority of career options out there, that being, that very few jobs are a cake walk, but, with proper consideration, there still exists many favorable options that you may come to adore. Very enlightening!</p>
<p>kmh 11, I apologize if you didn’t like my “style”. I tend to shoot straight from the hip. In my experience college catalogs and recruiters and other career sites, written by people who are not actual environmental scientists make it sound like a non-stop frolic in the great outdoors in your L.L Bean flannels like some cover photo from Outside magazine with the Rocky Mountains in the background.
The environmental field is about laws, permits, rules, regulations, research of databases, looking through pages of regs for parts per million/billion to see if your test results are in excess, excel spreadsheets of test results, writing reports all day long for weeks at a time…and then one, maybe two days a month you might get to leave your cubicle and go to an abandoned factory or old warehouse or a cell phone tower site out in some farmer’s field or something like that and poke about looking for old leaking “constituents of concern” or possibly underground storage tanks, usually finding nothing worse than an old rusted can of “Raid”, quart of used motor oil, or jug of paint stripper. Then you write up the report, make copies, figure up all the billable hours and the admin. assistant packs it up and mails it to the client along with the bill who then puts it in a file cabinet. Then your project manager leans into your cubicle and tries to get you to come in and work through the weekend because we need to get a few more reports out this billing cycle.
There are, of course different aspects to the field, wetland delineations, environmental impact studies, remediation plans, construction site inspection/stormwater/sewer projects, etc. so there are other things you can do at consulting firms which break up the same ol’, same ol’. Plus, as someone else mentioned, there are plenty of other jobs where you NEVER get to leave the office at all so that alone is a diversion to be thankful for. There are also other jobs which may require you to travel a good bit to do site assessments, lead and asbestos stuff so you can find a firm that sends you on a lot of out of town travel too if that sounds interesting. It’s not all drudgery but be forewarned that it’s not all a hiking trip in the woods.
I still urge research with actual environmental scientists at consulting firms and government departments of the environment to find out if the flavor of the actual day-to-day work is something you’d enjoy before pursuing the field as a major, especially if you need to borrow lots of money to get your degree. Also look into how hard it will be to actually find work right out of school and know that like many other majors, it may be hard to get a job in this field with the number of more experienced folks out there also competing for the same job in this economy.
Just one person’s opinion, your mileage may vary.</p>
<p>If you’re style is shooting straight from the hip then can you let me know what type of salary a pencil pushing consultant or government type can expect with an environmental science/studies degree?</p>
<p>If you’re style is shooting straight from the hip then can you let me know what type of salary a pencil pushing consultant or government type can expect with an environmental science/studies degree?</p>