<p>Since Dean Blackburn has said that UVA, like all other schools, is concerned about yield, and, with the elimination of ED, I wonder whether and just how an applicant can communicate to the Admissions Office that he or she is prepared to attend UVA, if admitted. I do not want to be naive in thinking that applicants do not cut and paste his or her "dream school" characterization on more than one application. However, it would seem mutually beneficial if the applicant could show a sincere commitment to attend, if admitted, and, at the same time, Admissions could perhaps weight the likelihood of attendance on acceptance of such an applicant. Perhaps there is no way to get this message across, and certainly no way to enforce it, but it would seem to me that Admissions should not be left to a crystal ball to predict yield on a per applicant basis, rather than a purely historical percentage basis.</p>
<p>Due to the change from ED to RD, two things can happen:</p>
<p>1) Bigger class size, because the yield rate will be hard to predict due to the elimination of ED. UVA might decide to accept more students, fearing that a lot of students might flock elsewhere.</p>
<p>2) Keep acceptance rate close to last year's overall rate. UVA might be risking a lower yield rate, though we don't know for sure if this will happen. But in this case, the class size will go down. </p>
<p>My guess is that the first scenario will happen, with a significant increase in the number of incoming freshmen next year.</p>
<p>That's actually not what will happen, aceit. The University, I'm sure, has taken steps to prevent having a larger-than-expected class, because they simply wouldn't be able to handle it. It's more likely that they'll initially under-admit with the intent of going to the waitlist. To arrive as a sound number of acceptances to send out, they probably employed some sort of enrollment management consultancy to model applicant behavior based on previous data from UVA and other schools that have abandoned ED.</p>
<p>Cav's got the right idea, as usual. </p>
<p>If you look back at articles from when the ED elimination was announced, you'll see that a drop in yield was anticipated, but seen as acceptable in light of the University's goals.</p>
<p>Our office didn't bring on consultants, but I wouldn't be surprised if upper level administration did.</p>
<p>My guess is they'll accept the same, maybe a few more (~200), applicants as they did for RD last year. They'll just turn to the waitlist more. Remember, all the other top schools that eliminated ED are now competing with UVA. So some kid that might have done ED to Princeton might get Jefferson's or Echols to UVA and chose UVA. So I wouldn't expect the yield to be terribly lower, either. It most likely will be lower, but again, not by a landslide. Kids have more options now, and this can both hurt and benefit the rate.</p>
<p>The school wait lists more than 20% of the applicants--there won't be a problem filling up the class size. I'm curious to see what happens in the future--will the school counter the lower yield with a higher admit ratio, or will it simply start using the wait list more aggressively. I'd assume the latter--at least to protect the school's image (like it or not, people correlate admit % to how good a school is).</p>
<p>Good point about the waitlist, I didn't think about that.</p>
<p>I agree with all that has been said. However, my original post was a bit more specific in its inquiry--that is-among those who are given offers in the first instance (and not taken at a later date from the waitlist), is there any way for Admissions to gain insight into those candidates who will attend if given an offer and any way for the applicant to demonstrate to Admissions that upon receipt of an offer, he or she will attend?</p>
<p>Can you rephrase your question? I'm not sure what you're exactly asking. Every candidate who applies is given consideration, and if given an offer, it's up to the student to accept or decline it. I would imagine that the office keeps acceptance rate to roughly the same as it was last year. If the yield is lower than expected, then they'll pull off people from the waitlist, which I predict will be longer this year.</p>
<p>i heard that UVA was looking to increase the size of the incoming engineering class by about 70 kids. Anyone else hear something similar?</p>
<p>I don't think Admissions would want to do that jOHN. I think one of the reasons UVa got rid of ED was to try to make the process more equal and to not give students that were able to say that they would definatly attend UVa any sort of preference. By doing what you said, it would do that, which would kind of conflict with one of the reasons they got rid of ED in the first place. </p>
<p>I'm not sure if that is all correct, just the impression I've gotten.</p>
<p>JR:</p>
<p>I think I understand what you’re asking: how does a UVa applicant let Admissions know that he/she will attend the University if offered admission, thereby making it easier for UVa to accurately predict matriculation on a case by case basis, instead of having to rely completely on historical yield data to estimate how many folks will accept UVa’s offer?</p>
<p>The applicant could do this by including a personal letter with their Application Package that unmistakably expresses the student’s reasons for, and specific intent to, attend UVa if offered admission. Some applicants almost certainly already do this when they submit their UVa Application.</p>
<p>While this approach might marginally impact consideration for an individual applicant, it would be extremely problematic for the UVa Admissions Office to rely on voluntary non-binding individual applicant representations to help predict their yield on a global basis, unless there was some formalized “Statement of Intention” process or procedure that was binding on the applicant if he/she was offered admission to the University.</p>
<p>I don’t know if any other schools are either considering or doing something like this; perhaps UVa has even given it some thought. However, I’m guessing we’re still much too close in time to the elimination of ED for UVa to do anything radically different in this regard. I suspect UVa will continue on their current path until they can clearly tell how getting rid of ED is shaking out (for them and the other schools who did likewise).</p>
<p>I hope this addresses your original question. Do you, or anyone else, know how other colleges and universities deal with the uncertainties associated with predicting yield, besides utilizing a Waitlist to meet their enrollment targets?</p>
<p>While I understand UVa’s rationale for terminating ED, I don’t agree with the decision because I believe ED benefited both the University and a significant number of their prospective applicants. Yes, you can make the case that ED disadvantaged a relatively small percentage of UVa’s applicant pool who want and/or need to have a firm financial aid package in hand before they make their final decision on the college they will attend. However, I’m convinced UVa could have satisfactorily addressed the needs of these students while retaining the school’s ED program.</p>
<p>I also don’t buy many of the other arguments proponents for eliminating ED at UVa often make to justify their decision. Foremost among these is the contention that requiring high school students to have their applications completed and submitted by November 1st is “bad” because it puts too much pressure on students at the beginning of their senior year. My son had his two most difficult and time consuming applications completed by the end of October, and this allowed him to fully focus on his high school studies after these were out of the way. He completed his other college applications over the Christmas break. However, he could have much more fully enjoyed his last year of high school (while still maintaining excellent grades) if he had known of his acceptance at his preferred college by December 1st instead of April 1st, and he could have relaxed more during the holiday season as well. Please don’t get me wrong; we’re very grateful he was ultimately accepted to attend the University. But the stress he felt for much of his senior year would have been mostly negated if he had received an ED acceptance to UVa.</p>
<p>Sometimes you lead NOT by following, but rather by being creative and coming up with your own (innovative) approach to meet a given goal or objective. In this regard, I think the University was much too quick in jumping on the bandwagon and following the lead of a couple of other prestigious schools who terminated their ED programs for the above reasons. Frankly, I would like to see UVa boldly assert their leadership by reversing their decision on ED, while also developing an effective plan to meet the needs of students for whom the financial aid package is a determining factor in choosing a college.</p>
<p>I’m not na</p>
<p>Franco,</p>
<p>The engineering school is increasing its size, but I don't think it is 70 students all at once. It might be more like 20 additional slots per year. I haven't heard that the number of open slots for the capped majors for SEAS will increase, though.</p>
<p>HopefulHooDad - you did encompass the gist of my question. I did not intend to raise again the pros/cons of ED. With that said, and going back to my original question, I forgot to mention that with UVA going to the common app, more and more applicants will be tossing his or her hat in the ring, so to speak. Here's a sinister idea (partially joking, of course). To offset the negative press associated with a lower yield as a result of the elimination of ED, UVA may have decided to go to the common app to increase the number of applications overall, and admit what will look like a lower percentage of applicants. So, while yeild may be down, selectivity will go up, off setting the negative press that may accompany a dip in yield.</p>
<p>Right on John.</p>
<p>The only sincere and logical way to convey your intention is through early decision. Since UVA did away with this, there is no way for them to tell for sure if you are 100% interested. I know many kids who say that a school is their first choice on interviews and applications. They email their adcom, travel long distances to interview and visit the campus, and even stay overnight. But then they change their mind when all offers are in. I think UVA is well aware of this, and professing your interest at the onset may have little impact on your application.</p>
<p>What lower yield? Seems like yield has been great this year as always. Please advise if this is incorrect?</p>