<p>Try reading the online Daily Princetonian -- including the section called The Street and the archives; also try reading the Daily Cal (an awful paper by comparison, but it might give you some idea of the culture).</p>
<p>myau- at this point, I wouldn't encourage her to go to Princeton or Cal.
Let her decide without further input from you. She can be confused for a few more days. You don't want her to pick something based on what she thinks will please you.</p>
<p>Personally, I think Princeton and Cal have different student cultures, and only she can know where she would be the most comfortable.</p>
<p>Hey, I don't mean to hijack the thread, but you all seem so helpful and I have a somewhat similair decision to make. I have to decided between Brown and Emory.I want to go pre-med, and i live in the South, so Emory would be 1.5 hour plane ride vs. 6 hour trip to Brown. I know it isn't quite the smae as Princeton vs. Cal, but any help would be appreciated.</p>
<p>My advice to both Myau's D and Fillinitheblank is to go to the more rigorous school that's farther away, with the idea that in both cases the school closer to home would be much easier to transfer into than the other way around. If things don't go well at the far-away school, it would be very comforting to know that there is likely a good option for transfer to the other school. If you stay closer to home next year, you may always wonder what you've given up. If the transfer outcome were equally predictable at both of your schools, then you would have a very tough choice ahead. But that is not the case at all. The transfer rates at Princeton and at Brown are pretty much the lowest in the country, even for those accepted as seniors.</p>
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<p>I wouldn't encourage her to go to Princeton or Cal. </p>
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<p>I am not going to. I want her to make the most informed decision possible, so there would be no regrets. I am going to give her this thread to read. :)</p>
<p>Skie, the transfer rates at Princeton are the lowest of all: they are zero. :)</p>
<p>myau, to address your latest concerns, i would be very surprised if Cal honors your D's Regent Scholarship (or anything near it) were she to transfer from princeton. consider this: if she doesn't like princeton and decides to come back to Cal, then she would likely be without a scholarship (and associated privileges), will have lost her freshmen year experience (the most significant period in a Berkeley student's social development), and will have to start anew making the same adjustments to college two years running. if she decides to go to princeton, i would strongly advise her to make a four year commitment.</p>
<p>some things about Cal. as you might suspect, some parents concern here regarding graduating early or on-time is misguided, per your own experiences with friends' children. i'm a current Cal student, explored classes my first couple of years, decided on a major and when i looked at the degree requirements before this spring break, i realized that i had virtually completed all my major, college, and university requirements: so I have decided to move up my graduation to this december, 3.5 years. the six-year graduation data cited earlier is misleading: roughly 1/3 of the University of California students are transfers-- mostly from community colleges (>90%)-- so students might need an extra semester or two to complete all university requirements. for entering freshmen, graduating early or on time is not an issue. </p>
<p>with your D's regents scholarship, she will get priority Tele-Bears appointments for course enrollment. and if she decides to major in linguistics, i highly doubt she will have any problems getting the classes she wants. to illustrate, suppose your D wants to get into a very popular class that has a total enrollment of 200, a class that will have a waiting list of 120+ when Fall semester starts. each student is given two Tele-Bears appointment for Fall semester, one in the spring (you can sign up to 10 units) and one in the summer (as many units up to college limit of 21). in the spring, when your D's priority enrollment comes around, she'd be hard-pressed to find more than 20 or 30 people enrolled in the class, she'll be able to get her class of choice with ease. the students who don't get the classes they want either (1) have later appointment schedules, which will not be the case for your D or (2) do not prepare in advance, ie, do not sign up for the popular class in the first enrollment period. </p>
<p>regarding housing (and finances), regents scholars are guaranteed four year on-campus housing, the "rest" of the Cal student population is only guaranteed two years. i believe when you state the total cost of education when comparing Cal to princeton, you're considering the university's estimate based on on-campus housing, which is set at roughly $13,000 for room and board. your D, being a regents scholar, has the option to stay on campus for four years, or she can choose to live in an off-campus apartment. assuming she shares a 2-bedroom apartment with her share at $800/month for a single (the going rate in Berkeley), it will cost her $7200 for housing in an academic year or a savings of nearly $6,000; obviously, if she shares her room, she'll save even more. be sure to factor this into your financial considerations</p>
<p>to dispel one point, but UCLA and Cal have the highest percentage of pell grant recipients among most competitive universities, generally around 33-35%. in absolute numbers, the University of California, Berkeley has more pell grant recipients than all ivy league colleges combined. </p>
<p>i had to smile when you mentioned that you did not know why your D feels more comfortable at Cal (95%, I believe) and I think the answer is simple: there are so many niches for her to fill. i laugh when some here decry that Cal is "big" as though that descriptor is inherently bad. it's not. it just means there are more places to look to find where one belongs. as a regents scholar, your D will have a built-in network among an association of other scholars. with your D's major, she'll have a close working relationship with other students within that major, with your D's dorm assignment, she has roomates and neighbors, and with your D's campus involvement, a shared interest with others. i'm sure she has friends who are attending or will be attending Cal and this, in addition to the possible "networks" above and with close proximity to family and home, means that there will be a ready support system as your D makes the transition to college. this is critically important, and I believe she'll find what she needs to be happy and successful at Cal</p>
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with your D's regents scholarship, she will get priority Tele-Bears appointments for course enrollment.
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<p>I don't believe this is true at UCB. (I know for a fact it's false, actually, but don't take my word for it, this could change.)
Scholarships</a> Prizes Honors</p>
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regarding housing (and finances), regents scholars are guaranteed four year on-campus housing, the "rest" of the Cal student population is only guaranteed two years.
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<p>This isn't true either. I don't think regular Cal students are guaranteed anything, certainly not two years. Anyway, most regent's scholars don't take advantage of the four years of on-campus housing.</p>
<p>Going to Princeton planning to transfer to Cal if you don't like it isn't a wise plan. It's very hard to transfer to Berkeley unless if you are a community college student.</p>
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<p>Going to Princeton planning to transfer to Cal if you don't like it isn't a wise plan.</p>
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<p>It's not a "plan". It's a self-comforting illusion. ;)</p>
<p>kenf1234, regents scholars get to enroll in classes sooner than peers. each semester, scholarship athletes and disabled students get first priority (it alternates each semester), then it's by seniority, but regents' scholars get priority relative to their class standing. it doesn't surprise me that it isn't advertised online, but it's one of many perks to being a scholar.</p>
<p>Cal freshmen admitted to the fall are guaranteed two years on-campus housing; up until two years ago, it was only one years guaranteed until the new Unit 1 dorms were completed. spring admits and transfer students are not guaranteed. if you don't believe me, feel free to read the first line in the link below.</p>
<p>Living</a> at Cal - Fall Freshmen</p>
<p>i wouldn't be surprised if most regents don't do four years with on-campus housing, but that's not the point. the option is available for the OP's D. more specifically, i mentioned this because cost estimate differs according to one's housing situation. like everywhere else, total cost as determined by FAO is adjusted to your living status. for certain schools this is a minor consideration, because most students live on campus. for Cal, calculating financial burden must take into account housing because Cal's dorms have been rated as the most expensive among US colleges so most students opt to live off-campus and, of course, students are only guaranteed two years housing, anyways. i'm not sure if the OP had considered this fact, because if she hadn't, then the $7-12K/year gap she was concerned with might be closer to $12-17K/year were her D to live off-campus as an upperclassmen.</p>
<p>Why Cal's dorms are so expensive? I don't get it, how come, given the Bay Area housing prices, it's cheaper to rent an apartment than to live in the dorm ...</p>
<p>I stand corrected regarding 2 years of guaranteed housing. I was completely wrong.</p>
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kenf1234, regents scholars get to enroll in classes sooner than peers. each semester, scholarship athletes and disabled students get first priority (it alternates each semester), then it's by seniority, but regents' scholars get priority relative to their class standing. it doesn't surprise me that it isn't advertised online, but it's one of many perks to being a scholar.
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<p>You really should post this information on the UC Berkeley forum. This question has been raised several times and no one has provided this information. How did you acquire this knowledge?</p>
<p>I'd speculate that it's largely because much new student housing has been constructed at Cal in the last couple of years and there is no huge endowment and insufficient tax revenue to simply absorb those costs and not raise the prices. Also, the apartment housing near the Berkeley campus is not underpriced, but much of it is not premium housing. The first year experience at Berkeley is quite important, as some here have noted; it is when students are eager to make friends and bond with each other. It is hard socially to go to Cal as a transfer student.</p>
<p>myau - what is your daughter's gut feeling telling her now? Sounded like she was happy about Cal - has that shifted? Any more questions that have come up?</p>
<p>BTW, three years ago my daughter didn't decide until, drum roll, May 2! We had to get special permission LOL.</p>
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i had to smile when you mentioned that you did not know why your D feels more comfortable at Cal (95%, I believe) and I think the answer is simple: there are so many niches for her to fill.
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Or maybe it's because she's from California. I think there's something to be said for stretching yourself, even if it's slightly outside your comfort zone. Speaking as an East Coaster who thoroughly enjoyed living in Pasadena for three years. Mind you I loved Cal when we visited, but thought it would be a much better place for grad school for my son, not undergrad. I really think your daughter will be happy enough wherever she lands.</p>
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<p>This makes me feel like you are on top of the issues and just have to wait out the final moments until your D makes her choice! Good luck to her and to you.</p>
<p>mamenyu raises some of the critical points re: expensive dorms at Cal. to add, median housing unit in Berkeley was built in the 1940s; new, premium units are not readily available around the campus area. those built within the last ten years or so have much higher rents; for example, new 2-bd apartments go for as much as $2600, which is comparable to dorm prices. </p>
<p>dorms are limited, demand is high.</p>
<p>dorms are generally located within one-to-three blocks of campus (the lone exception being Clark Kerr), so location is one factor. the price tag includes a full meal plan, which is valued at $1300 per academic year. dorms also come with security monitors, access to residential computing centers, and other services (for example, all dorms have a recreation room with television, pool and ping pong tables; some dorms have on-site gyms; some dorms have libraries, while others have study rooms). students are looked after by student "resident assistants," who uphold general rules and regulations for each floor.</p>
<p>i'm not arguing that dorms are a good value, but there are reasons why dorms cost as much as they do.</p>
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<p>She feels the urge to stretch herself academically and thinks that Princeton is better for that purpose; but Cal is more comfortable for her, socially ... and "environmentally" (large and hilly campus = natural sourse for excersizing; the unique blend of urban and outdoorsy environment - two great (from her point of view ;)) cities, the bay, hills, seabreeze ... She wined for about a few years about being sick of California and wanting to explore some other shores ... only to start crying now about its beautiful environment. ;) She really, really torn apart right now (making decisions even about small things had never been her strong part). :(</p>
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<p>BTW, three years ago my daughter didn't decide until, drum roll, May 2! We had to get special permission LOL.</p>
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<p>I have a feeling, we might need one, too. ;) How did you get it?</p>
<p>in terms of exercising, princeton has a very nice tow path along the canals that is great for running</p>
<p>We just asked...</p>