<p>Why is it that many theists require a reason for their existence. The two aren't co-dependent on each other.</p>
<p>And how would we know what happens when we die. The only thing we know is that we die, any hypothesizing beyond that point is fruitless because no one in this world has experienced it before.</p>
<p>A lot of atheists do not presume to have definite answers to the questions you ask, Biff. </p>
<p>How is it better to have answers that you have no basis for than simply to say, "I really don't know"?</p>
<p>
[quote]
Although Christianity was at its low during the Middle Ages,
roman catholicism was the predominant from of Christianity during this time. The RC doctrine, in my opinion, is absolutely absurd in some of its teachings. For example, RC mandates salvation by works only;this facet completely goes against the Bible. This whole thread seems to prey on the deficiencies of Rc church and that is fine with me. Methodism and protestantism are completely different and correlate with Scripture. Please do not associate all Christianity with Roman Catholicism.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>So I'm assuming you're protestant (or methodist) right? The Catholic Church is the one who originally defined what the Bible is. I'm sure you know that there were not just 4 Gospels back in the day. They were very numerous, often with very different accounts of Jesus's story, but these Gospels were destroyed by the Catholic Church. Your own religion's interpretation of the divine nature of its scripture seems flawed to me. It astounds me that a protestant can have faith in the 4 Gospels knowing their history.</p>
<p>I mean... let me try to tackle this again.
You - Protestant (or methodist), know the Catholic Church has some amount of bull going on, otherwise you'd be Catholic right? You certainly know they have a history of bull. Yet you read their bull as if it was the word of God (literally).</p>
<p>In a world with a God, what is the meaning of life, why are you alive, and what happens after you die? Aren't the answers just as unknown as in the Godless world?</p>
<p>
[quote]
In a world with no God, what is the meaning of life, why are you alive, and what happens to you after you die?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I'm an atheist and I'll answer. </p>
<p>The meaning of life - I don't think there is one. I don't see why there needs to be one either. If there is one, I don't know it. I plan to live my life the way I see fit and deal with the cards dealt to me the best I can.</p>
<p>Why am I alive? Simple - my parents gave birth to me. There's no other deeper reason. Had I not been alive, I couldn't have answered the question.</p>
<p>When I die, I die. Nothing more to it. Depressing? Maybe, but no need to make up stories because of it. It's going to happen to all of us. I'm hoping I leave with no regrets.</p>
<p>[The New Testament is not an update in the sense that it is meant to "correct" flaws within the Old Testament.]
See that's the miracle about the Quran, there are NO flaws.. never has one person changed it, God told the last prophet Mohammed (S) that he would protect the Quran... There was a test done in an arabic country where they changed ONE vowel in the quran, and everyone realized it... everyone noticed there was a mistake.. that's cuz that ARE A LOT of people who have the quran memorized, and the ages range from 5 year olds (yes they exist) and higher..
[if your logic holds true that an "update" is needed every time that the meaning of holy scripture is corrupted then we should expect another prophet to visit the Earth to provide an "update" to Islam since, as you said it, some of its teachings have been "warped" or corrupted by extremists.]
As I mentioned above, the quran is protected by God, so thats why the prophet Muhammed (PBUH) was the last prophet... Also, during Mohammed (PBUH)'s time as the verses were revealed, people would write them down.. However during Prophet Jesus (PBUH)'s time, the first bible written was written NINETY years after he was actually taken from this earth.. For the other books such as the torah, the case was similar to Prophet Jesus's case</p>
<p>BTW: PBUH=Peace Be Upon Him, and S= Arabic for PBUH</p>
<p>Yes there is. It's still based on faith.</p>
<p>[in a way, the books (the Bible, old/new testaments, Baghavadgita, the Koran, etc) demonstrate the progress of science, each one documenting what was best known at the time.]
no, the quran states scientific facts that were just found very recently, for example: just recently, a scientist was researching, and found that there were little black dots on the surface of the sun.. After observing he realized that the black dots move, he found out that the sun orbits too!.. and in case most of you forgot, when for example, I studied science, we learned that the sun doesnt move, just the earth and all the other planets orbit around it... in the Quran, there is a verse that states that everything orbits around itself, the planets the moon and the sun.. so you see, Prophet Mohammed (PBUH) was illiterate, he couldnt read or wrtie, he never even saw an ocean in his whole life.. how could he know that everything orbited around itself??? only God could have told him that.. so that is one of THE MANY miracles of the quran, and the fact that it has never been changed.. you can search up other miracles but make sure you search on creditable websites, like islamicity.org, sites like that..</p>
<p>Uh, so what?</p>
<p>Admittedly I've never read the Quran to know the validity of your claims. But even the Bible claims a lot of things that could be interpreted as being "scientific facts". So what? That still means jack to the fact that Islam still requires faith, because any belief (or knowledge in your case) must stem from two inital statements:</p>
<ol>
<li>God exists.</li>
<li>The Quran is true.</li>
</ol>
<p>These are both as uncertain as the shakiest of sciences.</p>
<p>everything orbits around it's self? no it doesn't, how is that even possible?</p>
<p>that doesn't even make sense taken literally.</p>
<p>
[quote]
everything orbits around it's self? no it doesn't, how is that even possible?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>whoa who posted that?
I hope it wasn't one of us atheists.</p>
<p>I do not feel that there has to be any meaning to anything.
Meaning was something else that humans invented.</p>
<p>Meaning is not essential to existence.
Humans assign meaning to objects, ideas, emotions to make sense of the world around us. For many, that meaning can be found in religion.</p>
<p>no it was ME_, in defending the quoran.</p>
<p>"in the Quran, there is a verse that states that everything orbits around itself, the planets the moon and the sun.."</p>
<p>well, as far as i know the planets dont..orbit around themselves. nor does the moon. or sun.</p>
<p>unless there is some sort os symbolic meaning that I am missing out of context of the Quran (which I am not familiar with), that makes no sense.</p>
<p>it may have symbolic meaning, i'm assuming it does, but he claimed that quote as being proof of the quran fortelling scientific facts, I'm just making the assertion that that is not a scientific fact, and if it's meant to be taken as such it's wrong, and if nothing else prooving the quran not true...</p>
<p>Unless you misquoted it, I have no knowledge of the quran at all.</p>
<p>"For the other books such as the torah, the case was similar to Prophet Jesus's case"</p>
<p>Uh, what are you talking about, exactly? </p>
<p>"only God could have told him that.. so that is one of THE MANY miracles of the quran"</p>
<p>I'm not so sure that this is the only possible explanation, even if it is what happened.</p>
<p>If a book contains a few modern scientific facts, does that make it credible?</p>
<p>Where is the history expert everkingly? I thought he would have refuted my points concerning his OWN culture, but as of now, they still stand. (he posted after my posts, yet have not gone over a single point of mine).</p>
<p>
[quote]
See that's the miracle about the Quran, there are NO flaws.. never has one person changed it,
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Proof? Saying something doesn't just make it so.</p>
<p>
[quote]
If a book contains a few modern scientific facts, does that make it credible?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Haha, have you seen the so-called accurate calculation of the speed of light based on the Koraan? (hint: one step involves calculating the "average speed of angels.")</p>
<p>Isn't pseudoscience fun?</p>
<p>
[quote]
Proof? Saying something doesn't just make it so.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>The prophet Mohammed (peace be upon him) taught the Quran to his companions - they learned it directly from him. Uthman reported that every time a new verse was revealed, the Prophet would immediately call someone to record it, and put the verse/s into a specific chapter. Scribes wrote down the revelations, although they were not compiled into one book - most of the companions knew it by heart. The companions of the prophet also taught the Quran to the next generation of Muslims - it was continually passed down. After his death, the companions worked to arrange the Quran into one volume. Zayd ibn Thabit, one of the companions most known for his memorization of the entire Quran, was appointed to lead the effort, and had dozens of others who had memorized the Quran check over it.
Two copies of Qurans distributed through Muslim cities by Zaid ibn Thabit still exist.
The Quran has been passed down orally as well as in book form. If it had been changed, the two would be entirely different.</p>
<p>I dont know if it has ever been changed, or not, but even if it is unchanged, does that make it unflawed?</p>
<p>
[quote]
The Quran has been passed down orally as well as in book form. If it had been changed, the two would be entirely different.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Yes, I understand the story. But this still isn't proof. I could say the exact same thing about document x, but it doesn't make it proof.</p>