How would you advise your daughter re: career?

Parents Forum
41

I have a daughter in a PhD program who is worrying about this a lot. She wants lots of kids. Right now all that maternal energy is going into teaching undergrads whom she terms “adorable”. She calls to tell me how proud she is of them. Etc.

Her boyfriend is not worrying about this, nor are any of the male PhD students. Is your boyfriend worrying about how to fit kids into his career life or vice versa? Are many of the males thinking about jobs that allow for time at home?

I understand that your professor is urging grad school and you are considering various professions, but I find this entire thread deals with larger categories of jobs. I think the job market is pretty complex and diverse, with many jobs that don’t fit into these categories. And major and job don’t have to match. If you love love love chem or biochem or pharm or whatever, do it (my daughter is in the arts and cannot put it aside despite potential poverty in the future). So I would first of all ask if you really need grad school or if you want to try the work world first.

At some point, it seems, women start looking for a relationship that makes whatever life style they want, work.

We had three kids, fairly late in life. We raised them on pretty meager income because special health needs of one dictated that I stay home. But even before that, I was home when each was under 4, and there is nothing like waking up some sunny spring morning, packing a picnic, and taking three kids to the park. I never felt my skills were wasted and as they got older I found ways to use them locally, by running a political campaign, raising money for a foundation, that kind of thing.

I am a believer in “sequencing.” Catchy term but I would never be able to do work less than fully, or child rearing less than fully. I worked until 35 in social service, and staying home and helping my kids grow was very rewarding.

Some of my kids went to top schools and young women there say they don’t want kids. It is kind of “in” not to want kids among the so called elite group of students. They want to focus on career. We’ll see how they feel at 35.

You’ll find a balance, you really will. There are many options for work and when the time comes for kids, I hope you have some options then for being home as much as you want, and doing other things as much as you want. This is a tough tough issue somewhat ruled by biology no matter how much our culture tries to say otherwise. Work and children are both gifts but they don’t have to be simultaneous.

42

I just want to throw this out there. My mom wanted to be a stay-at-home mom with a big family but after staying at home with me for just a few months, she realized that she was NOT cut out for it and I have no younger siblings (mom’s only child- I have an older half-sister from my dad). She was a part-time worker for a while until I started school and then went full time. My dad was the primary wage earner.

My last day of 7th grade, my dad got into a horrific accident and that was the last time he worked. My mom suddenly became not only the only worker but had to take on her full time job plus other jobs to make up for the hole that my dad’s accident caused in our monthly income. My dad became my SAHD but that was never part of the plan.

After my husband and I got married, I ended up getting really sick. I have a severe, chronic, lifelong illness that has majorly thrown a wrench in our “perfect plan” for me to be the primary wage earner and him to be the SAHP.

Life is unpredictable. There are a lot of moms on here though who plan on being “career” people but then decide that they wanted to primarily be a caregiver. I just wanted to point out that the opposite can and does happen for a lot of reasons. That’s all.

Good luck to you. From the bottom of my heart, I hope everything works out. Everyone deserves to live out their dreams!! :slight_smile:

43

Please don’t choose a career based on imagined “flexibility.” The level of flexibility you will have in your future job will depend almost entirely on the particular job situation you land in – what your employer’s policies are, how demanding your particular supervisor is, etc. That’s not a thing you can plan for. Choose your future career based on what you enjoy doing and you’re good at, not on how family-friendly you imagine it will be.

So what if you start out in a career that isn’t compatible with having kids? The days when people started in one career and stayed there all their lives are past. You will almost certainly work in more than one career during your working life, and for sure, the time to get involved in something demanding and intensive is right now, before you’re thinking about potentially starting a family.

Work hard, kick ass, make a name for yourself. Then, when you’re ready to step back a bit, you will have a strong resume, plenty of valuable experience, and contacts who will remember you if/when you’re ready to get back into the work force full-time.

44

I am not so sure about that dustypig. There are certain careers in which it is more difficult than others to have a flexible schedule. I know very few women that did not make some modification to their work schedule once they had kids. There are some, where both parents worked full time and a live-in nanny helped, but many more that chose not to pursue a college teaching career after obtaining their PhD or gave up being a lawyer to stay home with the kids. I know women lawyers who tried to work part-time, but found it very difficult and ended up working almost full time, but for less money.

I would agree that women should not in any way base their career path on a particular man at age 21 or 22. But for someone that definitely wants children, with or without a partner, and is not super passionate about a particular career path, thinking about flexibility certainly is part of the equation.

45

The OP brings to mind an old joke. “Berkeley professors can only be successful at TWO of the following three things: Teaching, Getting Tenure, and Staying Married.” This was a way of saying that careers in research intensive universities are never 9-5, nor 9-month work. Having survived such a career, I estimate that my typical work week was 60 hours. I did take vacations with the family, and I did quite a lot of travel for professional meetings, but basically it’s a demanding job.

46

I’ve been a working mom for 30 years and have two daughters with graduate degrees. I’ve always told them a few things.

First, like Fallgirl, I told my girls to always be able to support themselves and any children they have, no matter who they marry. Sometimes life throws you a curveball. I learned this lesson while I was on maternity leave the first time, when two of the young families in my social circle tragically lost a spouse, adding long-term chaos to heartbreak. I also tell them that the only person they can ever truly speak for is each of their selves, so divorce or job loss or ill health of a spouse could destroy a family if they aren’t able to support themselves and their kids. I also tell them to not have children until they have finished their education, established their careers, implemented a mature financial plan, and have gotten married.

I also tell them that if having children is a priority for them (as it was for me), then that priority should be kept in mind as they make their choices in terms of partner, career, location, health. It really is fine to prioritize something so important and to make choices in terms of optimizing that role for years before it is ready to happen.

If you know you want to have children, it’s great that you are thinking about it now. If it is your priority, then treat it that way. Not necessarily the current romantic relationship, but the knowledge that you want to be a parent. Good luck!

47

I’ve worked full time, part time, from home and not worked while parenting. Each option brings it’s only rewards and challenges. A few thoughts to add to the great ones I’ve seen upthread:

  • money helps ease the pressure.
  • the better you are at your job the more likely you are to be able to get the flexibility you desire
  • pursue plan a but always have a plan b, c and beyond in the back of your mind
48

@LookingFoward I agree completely and tell my daughters this too – I was all attached in college (to my now ex-husband) and honestly I regret not doing what “I” wanted for my life.

49

^^there was a great point up-thread about the possible pitfalls of “part-time” work. That happened to me a time or two. I was supposed to be working part-time but was doing full-time hours much of the time, with no benefits. And the stress level wasn’t much lower than full time.

Just something to be aware of . . .

50

@NEPatsGirl I understand I am jaded to a degree - but my ex was a SAHD for quite a while and his ego took a huge blow (and I WAS sensitive to it but it didn’t seem to be enough) and let’s just say in the end it was the death knell to our marriage. And a financial sentence for me (he took me for everything)-- I would never recommend to my kids that they have a stay at home spouse.

51

As you consider possibilities, think about geographic flexibility as well as the other issues discussed here.

Some careers are strongly tied to specific geographic locations – for example, government service in Washington, DC. And in some careers (for example, academia), it’s so difficult to get jobs that people have to be willing to go where the job is, no matter where that may be.

If one person in a couple is in a career that has geographic restrictions, it can help a lot if the other person is in a more geographically flexible line of work (such as, say, medicine or secondary education) or a line of work where telecommuting may be possible.

52

I think this is a fascinating thread, a look into how things worked or didn’t, for those of us in the generation (or slightly after) where we thought we could be superwomen. I don’t think there are any particular absolutes. Making a career, relationship, and parenting work well is a huge undertaking. It needs some savvy, a lot of energy- and a lot of luck.

OP, you’re getting a rare look.

There will be lots of opps for a stem gal who knows her stuff, can think on her feet, can adapt. The sorts of jobs are always evolving, but the basic skills sets and experience are the building blocks. See the range of ideas you can get at the career office.

53

@lookingforward --best post on CC today! I absolutely agree. OP–come back and update occasionally. At least two generations of women will be watching and waiting and learning!

54

Based strictly on my own experience, I love the post from @FallGirl, #33.

But I also agree that there are many ways to, and definitions of, happiness and success. Which is what @lookingforward is talking about in #51.

I suppose my advice to OP would be to think of her educational and career goals first, and to keep an open mind about the future. Somewhat contradictory, I know, but then, so is much of adult life…

55

So what would you all say to your sons regarding this issue? What advice would you give a young man who wants a family? If it different than your advice for a young woman, why?

56

FG, a piece of me wants to comment, Bingo!

That’s the vestiges of having had a mother and grandmother who were career women. I wonder how many have an instant reaction (whether or not they admit it,)“find a woman who supports your plans and needs, is flexible, will give more than her half in the relationship, as needed.”

DH was like that, willing to do as much as he could for the kids. His own schedule was packed (professor, researcher, no 40 hour work week for him.) But he made the time for the girls. Couldn’t necessarily make it to a game, maybe couldn’t drive them to extras. But did as much else as he could. At one point, he moved with me, so I had a shorter commute. A time came when I needed to move for his job opp.

57 
            I would advise my own children not to have children. I want my kids to be selfish enough to say no.
58

@FallGirl I am not sure what I would say to my son-- he has never expressed interest in being at home with children or taking a significant leave etc. Honestly I wouldn’t based on my life experience encourage my daughters to do it either – the only saving grace I had in my unexpected divorce was that I had MY career to fall back on and I didn’t NEED to stick around in a bad situation for money reasons.

To be honest I would discourage all of them to have long term non-working partners, it is a financial nightmare if something goes wrong in the marriage

59

I think I’d push for financial independence. Maybe I’ve seen too many ugly divorces?

60

I would advise my son the same way I would advise my daughter: work towards financial independence and find a like-minded partner who wants to build something solid and strong with you: a marriage, a family, a home.