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So if you are fortunate enough to be full-pay at a selective college and therefore graduate with no debt, you should only look to date other full-payers? Is that how it works? What's the point of the wonderful diversity of a selective college, if the goal is just to find people Exactly Like You?
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<p>I did not have any debt and neither did my husband. But I personally would feel really bad if I bring to a marriage a lot of debt. It's just me. I don't like to take advantage of anyone and do not like anyone else to take advantage of me. </p>
<p>PS: My husband is not exactly like me. On the contrary, he is the opposite. :D</p>
<p>How do we define "lots of debt?" I mean, have we actually established what this means? I tend to look at debt as relative. After all, being $500 in debt to your buddy is pretty nasty when your weekly allowance is $10, but being $10K in debt when you make $100K a year isn't as bad, relatively speaking.</p>
<p>Many people with PhDs do not make that much money at all, if they have academic jobs. H has a PhD in math and is a Prof. at a state Univ. (has being a faculty for 18 years). If I were a stay home mom, his annual income after tax, even we dont use a single penny, would not be enough to pay for D1s one year college cost (which is over $50K).</p>
<p>I dont know how to quote, but Columbia student said "I dont like to take advantage of anyone and do not like anyone else to take advantage of me."</p>
<p>If you love someone and you KNOW they love you, that is not taking advantage of. The man I am involved with makes I'm sure 10x what I make, but he would never think because our incomes are not similar that I would be taking advantage of him.''</p>
<p>I'm sorry, I don't see love as a business transaction..</p>
<p>There have been many posts on this forum about kids who are graduating from college with 75-100k loans (sometimes more) for a BA from a good (but not extraordinary) college. The general consensus seems to be </p>
<ol>
<li> This is way more debt than makes sense to take on, </li>
<li> Where were the parents when this was happening, and </li>
<li> How the hell is this kid going to pay this off (live with parents, pay loan til age of 50, whatever).<br></li>
</ol>
<p>I would be concerned if my daughter was planning to marry someone with that kind of debt, from any source, and of course that kind of debt merits serious consideration by both parties. How are they going to pay it off? Who is responsible for it? How does it affect their financial life together? I would request, to the extent that I could, that these two sit down with a financial counsellor and talk about some of these issues. (In fact, it's not a bad idea for EVERY couple to do that before marriage!) It puts the problem right on the table, where it should be. I don't think it's a deal-breaker, but I would definitely want everyone to have eyes wide open about it.</p>
<p>And yes, I do think it makes a difference if that debt is incurred going to medical, dental, or law school. The ability to pay the debt off factors into the equation. If I graduate from XY U. with a BA in English (or most other majors for that matter) and a debt of 75,000 k, I'm in way deeper water than the person who graduates from dental school with a debt of 200k.</p>
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How about if your child marries someone and the two of them then jointly decide to put the spouse through graduate school? What's the essential difference, really, between Mary marrying Johnny who's already incurred $200,000 debt from med school, and Mary marrying Johnny and the two of them incurring $200,000 debt while Johnny goes to med school?
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<p>In the case where they have incurred debt together, hopefully they have jointly decided it's a good investment for Johnny to go to med school.</p>
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I did not have any debt and neither did my husband. But I personally would feel really bad if I bring to a marriage a lot of debt. It's just me. I don't like to take advantage of anyone and do not like anyone else to take advantage of me.
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<p>By that same token, if two people go to an equally selective / prestigious school, have equal degrees / potential, and one goes into business and makes $250,000 and the other elects to be a social worker making $25,000, the social worker who isn't contributing as much financially as he or she technically could is taking advantage of the other. Is that how you all see it?</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, I don't see it that way at all, unless there is an expectation from the partner who is earning 250k, that the spouse earn an equal salary. Those are issues that should be worked out between the couple long before entering into marriage. Also, life's circumstances change, and so do expectations during a marriage.</p>
<p>LOL, someone earning 250k would probably know that the person who is a social worker is not earning 250k if they had any common sense. If spousal earnings were so important, they probably would not date a person earning far less to begin with.</p>
<p>To add some perspective to the example above, My H and I met almost 25 years ago, both in stages of medical training. He'd gone to in Ivy and had big loans, I to an HBCU and had a military commitment. For awhile, I earned more, and while I have the potential to continue to do so, I chose job satisfaction over income generation. I believe this reflects a difference in our values. Some of this became more apparent as our D approached college, and I faced a decision about doing work I didn't like, to add my "fair share" for her private tuition. Not such a big deal, and we started talking about our different philosophies with our " financial planner" about 12 yeas ago, but we certainly didn't anticipate it 20 years ago, when we were "dating".</p>
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By that same token, if two people go to an equally selective / prestigious school, have equal degrees / potential, and one goes into business and makes $250,000 and the other elects to be a social worker making $25,000, the social worker who isn't contributing as much financially as he or she technically could is taking advantage of the other. Is that how you all see it?
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It's a personal choice. I stated my personal choice. I would not marry somebody who makes 10 times what I would make either. I would be in an unbalance union and I don't want to be the one that has to kowtow to that person. I generally don't kowtow to anyone period.</p>
<p>In addition, what do I give up for this person to make 10 times more money than I, time to be together and raising our children together. Not in a million years.</p>
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I dont know how to quote, but Columbia student said "I dont like to take advantage of anyone and do not like anyone else to take advantage of me."</p>
<p>If you love someone and you KNOW they love you, that is not taking advantage of. The man I am involved with makes I'm sure 10x what I make, but he would never think because our incomes are not similar that I would be taking advantage of him.''</p>
<p>I'm sorry, I don't see love as a business transaction..
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<p>I don't see love as a business transaction either. However, I do know of people who are taking advantage in the name of love, actually more often than not.</p>
<p>I assume you are a female. If after another 5-10 years, you have been married for more than 10 years. You start to make multiples of your husbands. But your job is time consuming (say 10-11 hours daily and some weekends) and very stressful, you would really hope that your spouse would stay at home to help since the amount of income that he brings in really makes no difference to the life style of your family anymore. By keeping his job, it actually adds stress to your life (in the sense of house chaos and taking care of kids). But both jobs are professional and he would like to keep his job, what do you think that your relationship would head to?</p>
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I would be in an unbalance union and I don't want to be the one that has to kowtow to that person. I generally don't kowtow to anyone period.
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<p>I do not kowtow. Especially not to my husband, who has been the sole income earner for many of the years of our marriage. We do not view money as lifes only currency or it's most important one. For now we approach money as he makes it, I manage it, we confer on big decisions and long term planning. Other times we've both made it, he's managed it and we've conferred on big decisions and long term planning. </p>
<p>We're a military family. Without me, my spouse would not have been able to have the things that mean the most to him; a child, dogs, a home. The idea that my spouse would expect me to kowtow him after I've held down the fort through six deployments, two of which were in Iraq, moved 8 times and kept this family together and on-track is ridiculous. In fact, when I get off line I'm going to tell him about the kowtow theory and I'm sure he'll find it even funnier.</p>
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However, I do know of people who are taking advantage in the name of love, actually more often than not.
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<p>How would you know that? I mean, really know it.</p>
<p>For example, I've read people express the opinion that at-home parents are taking advantage of the parent doing paid work and vise versa. </p>
<p>I find keeping my marriage healthy and growing to be enough work. I don't have time to form a serious opinion of other people's relationships. Especially not since what we see on the surface is not always a good indication fo what is going on in private.</p>
<p>What would those in debt do if high salaries went away and normal salaries went into a long-term decline at 5% per year? That's what happens in a depression.</p>
<p>"How would you know that? I mean, really know it."</p>
<p>I know a lady that moved from husband to husband always managing to trade up quite a bit from the previous one. She did have kids along the way too.</p>
<p>BCEagle, I'm more inclined to say "then there is Donald Trump." But the post I responed to said "more often than not", which I find odd.</p>
<p>As for knowing vs marrying, I did not set out to marry someone exactly like me nor did my husband set out to find his twin of the opposite gender, thank goodness, and I hope my kid is not either.</p>
<p>One could put Donald Trump in either position. He's pretty good at marrying money and then divorcing the debt.</p>
<p>"nor did my husband set out to find his twin of the opposite gender"</p>
<p>That's a strawman. There's a lot to be said for the wisdom of not marrying up or down. The US is a place where a lot of people like to break wisdom but the costs are something that usually show up way down the road.</p>