<p>I've narrowed down my search to Oberlin and Grinnell. Despite this question being posted dozens of times, I have yet to see any thread with substance. Here is my list of things you should know in regards to your input:</p>
<p>-money is no issue. I will never need to worry about it.
-I am interested in oil painting, psychology, political science, and art history.
-I can handle any winter
-I am a left of center person
-being accepted into a top graduate/professional school is my main concern at the moment.
-the less sports matter, the better</p>
<p>Please please please provide some input with substance!</p>
<p>Why do you have to decide? If you aren’t sure which school is right for you, then don’t apply ED. Apply RD, visit again for accepted student days at the schools you are accepted to and are most interested in, then make a final decision.</p>
<p>You will be sorry if you rush it and make the wrong choice… it is a lot worse to have to transfer later. What are your stats? UW GPA, test scores, ECs?</p>
<p>I have about a 3.7 UW GPA and a 4.0 weighted. My GPA has improved substantially yearly as well as rigor</p>
<p>-2020 SAT, 770 US SATII, 620 World Hist SATII, 5 AP Gov, 5 APUSH, 4 World history</p>
<p>-I oil paint in classes 2 hours a week and at hope 10-20. I have had two internships at studios
-I have been elected to board positions three times for 2 and a half years duration in my youth group
I am Vice president of my schools politics club. I helped get the mayor to speak for the school, etc.
<p>First of all, I don’t think your chances at Oberlin RD are that bad. But only the admissions committee can say that for sure.</p>
<p>The things that you list as important considerations are probably about par at both Oberlin and Grinnell. Both schools are left-of-center, have pretty minimal athletic culture, get blasted with Midwestern winter, and have excellent records of sending students to top grad schools. Oberlin’s programs in art history and politics are excellent; I don’t know Grinnell’s strengths, but can’t imagine that you’d find their academics weak. In other words, forget the list. In all of the areas that are most significant to you, you won’t have a hugely different experience at either school … so you can relax a little knowing that no matter which college you choose, it won’t be the “wrong” one.</p>
<p>So, some other things to think about:
Have you had a chance to visit each school? Was there a campus where you felt more at home – where you had an instant gut feeling that you could see yourself living there?
Do you have a secret preference? If you were to flip a coin and it came up with Oberlin, would you wish deep down that it had come up with Grinnell? If you opened an acceptance letter from Grinnell, would you feel a pang of regret at never getting to experience Oberlin?
Which school is farther from home? This may not seem like a big deal now, but in four years you may feel differently.
When you talk to the people who know you best, where do they think you should go?</p>
<p>As a side note… I definitely understand wanting to get the process over with, and I don’t think it’s a bad idea to apply somewhere ED with that motive. Other people on CC will disagree with this, but in order to apply ED I don’t think it’s essential to be 100% certain that the place you’re applying ED is the one, and that it’s head and tails above every other school you’re considering, and that you could never be fully satisfied anywhere else. If you’ve got two equally great options, and you’re confident that you would be just as happy and do just as well at either school, and at the end of the day you can’t find anything that’s pulling you toward one over the other, and yet you really want to apply ED … then fill out both applications, close your eyes, stick one in the mailbox, and tear the other one in half. If you really think that both schools are equally right for you, and you’ve done your research and are being honest with yourself about what you really want, then no matter which one you pick or how you pick it, you’ll end up at a school where you’ll do fine.</p>
<p>How do you feel about music? Oberlin has the conservatory so there are plenty of music options to enjoy even if you do not play an instrument yourself.</p>
<p>Two great schools, that can both get the job done for you in terms of graduate school. One thing Oberlin has that might be of interest to you is a world class art museum. </p>
<p>“Despite this question being posted dozens of times, I have yet to see any thread with substance.”</p>
<p>I’m not sure what you’re expecting from College Confidential. You’ve elected to create this make-or-break decision, that only you can decide. Grinnell and Oberlin share a lot in common. You could find ardent defenders of either college, but what will that answer? Presumably, you’ve visited both schools, combed through their websites, and talked with as many people about the two colleges as you can find. Think about what attracts you to each college and try to prioritize what’s really important to you.</p>
<p>I don’t have first-hand experience with Grinnell (and this is in no way meant to knock it). However, there is an obvious difference in location. While both are in rural communities, the suburbs of Cleveland are now pretty close to Oberlin. Oberlin is a small town, but it is not isolated. Having two kids go to colleges far away from home, I can tell you that taking flights home, making connections, especially in bad weather, or during busy holiday periods, can be expensive, prolonged and really stressful. Getting rides and flights home from Oberlin,(the Cleveland airport is about a 35 minute ride from campus), was pretty easy. On at least one occasion, students banded together to hire a bus to take them to NYC to come home for a break. From there, it was easy for kids from the east coast to get bus or train connections home. </p>
<p>Oberlin is a dynamic and creative place - in part that’s due to the Conservatory. It has great academics and a thriving art scene. But in the end you have to decide.</p>
<p>One of my sons is at Oberlin and one of my best friend’s son is at Grinnell. They chose Grinell because of generous merit aid while my son did not want to be that far from the East coast. PM me with any questions that I can ask the boys.</p>
<p>I like this approach because I doubt that anyone would actually do it. At the moment they’re about to drop the application in the mail box and be eternally committed to a choice, they will want to take control over the decision. My guess is that the decision will become apparent to them when they are at the point where they’re investing application prep time toward the application of the school that, deep down, they’re not as excited about as the other. At some point prior to being forever committed to a choice they’ll see that they have a preference and that subjectively compared things are never equal.</p>
<p>Did you visit them? I would say go with your gut as they are similar. I went to Oberlin and it was perfect for me, but I felt sure it was for me after visiting it.</p>
<p>-I have visited both twice
-I know EVERYTHING about the schools in regards to information that is readily available. (Location, best majors, good teachers, museums, proximity to major cities, graduate acceptance/ placement, everything)</p>
<p>I am hoping someone on here has something more profound then “Why in the hell are you asking anyone for help on here”</p>
<p>I hoped someone here had something not previously mentioned or obscure that could provide new information. Just parroting what has already been posted is of no help to me.</p>
<p>I’m honestly offended by some of these responses.</p>
<p>Your post #15 is actually somewhat offensive. It sounds like you have done of research and visited twice. Sometimes there just isn’t more to know… and what no one out here can do is assign relative values to the qualities of each college for you. You sound like you want someone else to make up your mind for you. And you are getting kind of nasty because no one will ardently say to pick one over the other. They are fairly comparable schools. As someone who has been through the college selection process with two kids and also visited both of those schools, I would say neither has any great secret that is being hidden from you. I guess people could make something up…</p>
<p>beatlemania, you are dumping your own stress and anxiety on all the well meaning CC members who have generously attempted to help you out of your quandary by offering assessments/evaluations/anecdotes/personal experiences/strategies and offers of private communication. I can see how you would find this offensive. ???</p>
<p>The not so hidden fact is that NO ONE can give you the magic bullet you seek, because <em>you</em> are it. There are no more facts about the two schools that you need. You need to figure out which school you prefer. That’s your preference not anyone elses. No one here knows you and therefore no one could even guess at where you feel more at home. </p>
<p>If you have visited each school twice and really have no clear preference (or cannot access it) then it does not matter where you apply. I totally agree with the poster who said, in effect, flip a coin.</p>
<p>One of my D’s fell in love with Grinnell on paper when it was described as “a cornfield full of hyper-caffeinated geniuses”. Whether she will love it in person remains to be seen ( she is only a junior). My senior who is doing a series of fly-ins to NESCAC schools plus Carleton and Pomona has no trouble changing her impression of each school once she’s visited the campus, and it doesn’t have to do with stuff you can list or even identify. So far, she loves Williams despite the dark dorms with tiny rooms (esp compared to cushy dorms at Amherst and Bowdoin) – why? “I don’t know Mom, I just love it, I just feel really happy there.” All else being equal where do you feel comfortable, happy and inspired?</p>
<p>First of all let me apologize. That previous comment came off much snappier than I intended.</p>
<p>My intention was not to offend. To both Intparent and honeybee, your input is helpful and not at all what i’m referring to.</p>
<p>I found two great schools. It would have been easier if there was only one but I do feel lucky to have choices–especially since there is no guarantee I will get into either.</p>
<p>I would like to make it very clear that i’m not asking for someone to choose for me. That is both naive and frankly impolite to ask people like you all to consider. I was trying to get information that was very specific, for example: “Grinnell only has 1 painting class exclusive to studio majors.” This could very well prove useful in deciding, though expecting someone to do that kind of research on my behalf is pretty rude.</p>
<p>To avoid making a fool of myself even further I will refrain from posting any longer. Thank you for the help thus far. I can post my final decision and why I made it later if people think that will prove useful for the next years worth of panicked applicants.</p>
<p>I (and probably every other poster, esp parents) totally get that you are stressed about this. Of course you are. Your apology was gracious and sincere; I hope I was not too hard on you. I think we parents tend to do virtual parenting on this board without knowing the kid. You don’t need to stop posting. If you need help, ask for it. </p>
<p>And very best wishes to you as you make your decision. As others have said, you cannot make a wrong choice in this case…I will reiterate that at this stage, I don’t think it’s about one more curricular detail, I think it’s about which school you feel more drawn to. Do post and let us know when you decide!</p>
<p>OP, based on your last post, I would suggest (if you haven’t yet) that you spend time looking carefully at the graduation requirements for your proposed major(s), the course catalogs in those majors, and what has actually been offered over a few semesters. You can usually get at that info by digging around on the website. Just know that all courses in the catalog are not offered regularly, so IMHO it can be a little deceptive to just look at the catalog.</p>