<p>I have been very interested in attending Dartmouth for a long time. I have also been interested in Cornell. Looking at last year's stats, the Cornell school that I am interested in admitted 37% ED, while Dartmouth only admitted 26% ED. Clearly anyone would stand a better chance at Cornell. </p>
<p>I am not asking anyone to chance me, but what I am more interested in is hearing what you would do in the following situation:
Female from Ohio, highly competitive private school known for grade deflation. My GPA is around 3.6 and a little higher weighted. I have taken every honors class and all but one of the 7 APs my school offers.
My predicted SAT score is between 2100 and 2250. My SAT IIs are 700 and 770.
I have made several connections with the admissions offices at both places, and my interest is equal--so I don't want any "You should apply to the school you most want to go to" responses. </p>
<p>If both are equal in your evaluation, then I would suggest using the statistical averages to help you. Clearly, Cornell’s ED acceptance is higher than is Dartmouth’s. However, Dartmouth’s ED acceptance is higher than is it’s regular admission rate. Even though that is true for Cornell, it’s regular acceptance rate percentage is more in line with Dartmouth’s ED percentage. So you may have an opportunity to still get in to Cornell regular admission if you applied ED to Dartmouth and were not accepted.</p>
<p>I do have trouble understanding though how two such different schools appeal to you equally. Have you visited both campuses and spoken with undergrads on campus to get a sense of whether or not that particular university/college is the best fit for you?</p>
<p>First, realize the ED rates at both schools are heavily skewed by hooked candidates.</p>
<p>If your SAT score falls at the low end of your range, without hesitation I would suggest trying Cornell. Any way you slice it you have a better chance there. A 2250 will make Dartmouth more realistic.</p>
<p>hmom5 is right. Admission into Dartmouth is much less realistic than into Cornell if you SAT doesn’t get close to 2250 since your GPA and SAT 2’s are not great.</p>
<p>On-line advice from strangers is cheap, but may not be worth the price. It’s you who has to live with your decision. It would be hard for anyone to gauge your comparative ED chances at Cornell and Dartmouth with the info you’ve provided. It sounds as if your academic record might put you in the ballpark at both, but aside from grades and test scores, what else will your application show? </p>
<p>Have you visited both schools? They’re both in small towns with northern climates, but otherwise, as Dartmouthdad mentions, they’re very different places – Dartmouth more like a liberal arts college, while Cornell is a big, research university. The cultures are different, and so is the mix of academic strengths. </p>
<p>One of the realities of the admissions game is that there’s an unpredictable, might-as-well-be random element in admissions at all the elite schools. Cornell and Dartmouth have similar average scores on the SAT for admitted students; Dartmouth’s admitted freshmen tend to have somewhat higher GPA’s than Cornell’s. You could be accepted at either and rejected at the other, and it’s not easy to know what will happen for you. </p>
<p>It may not be what you want to hear, but I’d say apply early to the one you really want to go to.</p>
<p>Once again, I am not asking anyone to chance me. I can do that myself. What I am asking is simply what other people would do, or have done, in a similar situation.</p>
<p>To answer questions regarding why I have such strong interest in both, here are my reasons.
Dartmouth has one of the strongest Geography departments among the top schools and the only one in the Ivy League. Geography is a major interest of mine and a likely major if the school has it. </p>
<p>I am interested in Cornell simply because of the ILR School, with a curriculum that corresponds to my interests and experiences. </p>
<p>These may seem like hugely different programs/academic areas, but each follows up on my interests and would prepare me to pursue my career goals.</p>
<p>And yes, I have visited both schools. I’ve spoken with professors, current students, graduates, and visited classes. I have had individual information sessions with admissions officers at both. I have most certainly done my research.</p>
<p>“Even though that is true for Cornell, it’s regular acceptance rate percentage is more in line with Dartmouth’s ED percentage.”</p>
<p>Cornell does not have a “regular acceptance rate”.</p>
<p>Cornell undergrad consists of 7 different colleges, with individual applicant pools.
Each individual college has its own unique acceptance rate, and its own unique profile of matriculated students, and they are not all the same.</p>
<p>The admissions rates of the individual colleges in a prior year varied from about 32% to about 15%. That’s rather a wide spread for you to be lumping them all together indiscriminantly. I don’t know what the breakdowns are, by college, for ED vs. RD, but there is no reason to believe they are very similar to each other.</p>
<p>And I don’t know about ILR. However, at each of the colleges demonstrated interest and affinity for the particular program of studies is widely thought to be a significant factor in admission, conventional stats aside.</p>
<p>As for what I would do: post #2 reflects my opinion.</p>
<p>Actually, Cornell’s 2008 regular admission rate for college of arts and science was 28.7% Sure, some of the specialty schools are different, such as the school of engineering, agriculture and human ecology. I did not get the impression that the OP was asking us to focus our suggestions on the specialty schools. If so, please let us know that. If you are asking us to give some insight to the general arts and sciences programs, then my data as I quoted it earlier is correct.</p>
<p>“I did not get the impression that the OP was asking us to focus our suggestions on the specialty schools. If so, please let us know that.”</p>
<p>OP already did let us know exactly that, in post #7 . And post #9.</p>
<p>“Actually, Cornell’s 2008 regular admission rate for college of arts and science was 28.7%”</p>
<p>??? Where did you get that from??
If, by “regular admissions rate”, you mean RD, I’ve never seen RD vs. ED broken out separately for College of Arts & Sciences ("CAS’) alone. I would like to see a link for that data. However, when I find it, I don’t see how that’s the number it will show.</p>
<p>The university aggregate RD stats are reported, for 2009 the aggregate RD admissions rate was 17%, and CAS is one of its most selective colleges.</p>
<p>The RD admissions rate for CAS alone had to be a lot less than its ED admissions rate, and hence less than its overall (ED+RD combined) admissions rate, didn’t it?
The overall admissions stats for the individual colleges are reported, the overall admissions rate for CAS was a tad over 18% in 2008, and it was under 17% for 2009. </p>
<p>I’ve no idea what the figure you cited pertains to. Perhaps some old data that was not updated? I’ve seen that happen before. But, both the reported overall CAS stats and the reported university aggregate RD stats indicate to me the same thing, that the RD admissions rate to CAS was likely in the 15%s in 2009, and perhaps in the high 16%s in 2008.</p>
<p>The data that I have offered to you comes directly from a website that I have looked at on occasion in the past. The source is Michelle Hernandez. Perhaps you have seen her on the national news or quoted in national newspapers. I do not know her nor did my son use her as a consultant, but she seems rather knowledgeable about the Ivy League admission process and she is relatively well published on the subject. Whether her data is accurate or not, I cannot guarantee, and I am not one who has 3,000 posts so, I must admit, I do not claim to be an expert on minutia of the numbers and have come to rely on those who have published in the area. However, my message to you is similar to that which I passed on to my son who chose Dartmouth in 2008. You should go with which college feels the best. I sense that you are really passionate about ILR. Cornell is with few peers in the that area of study. </p>
<p>If you are looking for a broader liberal arts experience, then I suggest that US News has opined that Dartmouth is ranked #1 for undergraduate teaching for national universities. I am sure that if I have misstated that ranking, I will be told by others who track this data and will correct me, but I think that I am correct in stating that Cornell was not ranked in the top 10 for that category.</p>
<p>Lastly, I am attaching for you the site upon which I relied for the prior data that I cited. Nonetheless and more importantly, it seems that you have a passion which speaks to the excellent fit Cornell would provide to you.</p>
<p>Ya, that number is bizarre, I’ve no idea where she got that from, it doesn’t correspond to any 2008 data that I can see. It is grossly in error.</p>
<p>For Fall 2008 15,474 applied to CAS and 2,840 were accepted. I wrote it down before the linked page changed over to 2009.</p>
<p>The RD admissions rates were obviously lower than these overall rates.</p>
<p>As for undergraduate teaching,e tc., ILR is a very small school at Cornell, it is quite conceivable that the overall environment of undergraduate instruction there differs considerably from the larger colleges. Although I never took courses there, I’ve read posts on CC to the effect that it offers a more intimate experience, within the larger university. OP may wish to investigate this point, if it’s important to you. CC posters gomestar and CayugaRed2005 would be good people to talk to about it, and about ILR generally.</p>
<p>I guess Michelle Hernandez is not so much into the “minutia of the numbers” either.
But that degree of mistake is not really all that “minute”, I bet there are potential applicants who read that on her website, just as dartmouthdad evidently did, and took the school off their list. Somebody should really point that out to her. I’m not sure it helps her marketing efforts to have a stat there that is demonstrably wrong, either.</p>
<p>Thanks for the corrected data monydad. I just wanted it to be clear that I did not create the numbers but instead relied on a source who is otherwise viewed with credibility in this subject matter. </p>
<p>In any event, while you did not comment on the substance of my remarks, I assume you agree that the OP should go with where his passion lies and that seems to be Cornell’s ILR program.</p>
<p>I think OP should think long and hard about both situations and, at the end of the day, and only after that is done, go with post#2. I don’t feel like I’m in a position to advocate either choice for OP.</p>
<p>To be bluntly honest - its going to be hard with a 3.6 to get into Dartmouth ED, even with over a 2300. I think Cornell, while also very tough, is more realistic. Just being honest.</p>
<p>except OP says “highly competitive private school known for grade deflation”.
If school is a known commodity by Dartmouth and Cornell, grading there will be understood. If it’s good enough, for either school, I don’t know. Because it is not a known commodity to me.</p>
<p>I agree 10mwil with the previous posters and have been urging the same thing. You need to go where you feel you have the best fit. Ultimately, we cannot offer you any greater advice than to consider the strengths of each school and the major which is best suited for you and give it your best shot. You made it clear you were not looking for a “chance me” evaluation. You asked us to offer our insight as to what to do since you find both schools equally appealing. I think you can help yourself the best by carefully weighing the strengths and weakness of both Cornell and Dartmouth and the answer will come to you.</p>