I fail to see how it could be perceived otherwise. The child led the petition movement and was placed at an all-boys table. Unless there are other kids who are the sole members of their gender at a table, this was clearly retaliation by an insecure principal who can’t handle even the most polite (and rather cute, I think) challenge to her authority (and given the irrelevant reference to Sandy Hook, is also a bit of a nut). I don’t think there’s an elementary school teacher or administrator anywhere who would think that kind of seating assignment is appropriate.</p>
<p>The principal probably is singling out this girl because of her letter and it most likely is a bit of adult bullying, but I can pictue this differently.</p>
<p>The principal could have identified this girl as a compassionate strong leader who can break down the cliques. The all boy table could be the kids with the worst social skills in the school who need a peer role model. I have seen principals try assigned seats at lunch and it never goes well. Hopefully, at least seats will be changed weekly. I don’t think the assigned seating will last, too many parents will be up in arms. </p>
<p>We spend a lot of time trying to teach kids to stand up to bullies. I don’t see the principal’s behavior – as described here – as being anything else. Forcing an 11 year-old girl to sit at an otherwise all-boy lunch table is inappropriate and smacks of retaliation.</p>
<p>If the principal were truly trying to break down barriers, it wouldn’t be by putting one girl at one table. Take a different context: what if the principal had singled out one black student and required that one black student to sit at a table where all the other students were white. Or even required a whole table of black students to break up and each student integrate one otherwise all-white table. </p>
<p>Maybe the principal thinks this is a reasonable solution. After a lot of years of working in schools I’d strongly disagree.</p>
<p>OP, what is the r-word? Maybe it is getting late or I have led a sheltered life but I have no idea what that is.
Yes, this principal certainly appears to be vindictive. Sharing a meal with friends is supposed to be enjoyable and a fifth grade girl who has to be the lone girl with a table full of boys is justifiably going to feel like she is being punished. I second the suggestion to contact the principal by email. In the email, mention the earlier meeting the father had with the principal and again request an appropriate change in the lunch room seating arrangement. Make sure to send copies of the email to the guidance counselor, the child’s home room teacher, and the school district superintendent.</p>
<p>Agreed. It’s not normal for principals to be micromanaging lunchroom seating patterns…especially in placing 1 girl at a nearly all-boys table or vice versa. </p>
<p>At such ages, most prefer to stick to socializing with their own respective genders and the more immature/intolerant ones can get quite ornery about a member of the other gender “invading their space”. Hence, it’s no surprise when OP’s younger sister was placed at an all-boys table…they opted to ignore her…effectively shutting her off from socialization at the only time she was free to do so during the school day. </p>
<p>Moreover, maybe gender relations among elementary school kids are better than they were 20+ years ago when I was in elementary school…but considering my experiences at a Catholic elementary school…I’d also wonder a bit about her safety considering 10-11 year old boys may not have any compunctions about using physical intimidation/violence to exert dominance or to show their displeasure at “an outsider”. </p>
<p>The bullies at my Catholic elementary school certainly showed no such compunctions when they were 5-6 and up. That is…until one older bully was surprised when I started to stone him badly as a 6 year old second-grader. </p>
<p>As for seating, the catholic elementary school had us seated at each row of tables by grade and some teachers would actually separate genders on each side of the table. Other than that, we were free to sit where ever we wished. </p>
<p>In that arrangement, boys and girls tended to mostly ignore each other and chat among themselves…or start random boy vs girl foodfights before the teachers, lunchroom staff, or the assistant principal would immediately put a stop to it. Admittedly, this was much more common among first graders to third graders rather than fourth to sixth graders.</p>
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<p>Educrats and educators who do this are complete idiots!! </p>
<p>First, it never works because the well-behaved/good students at most schools tend to be disdained and even socially ostracized for such traits. You think one well-behaved/good student will be able to influence a group of the most ill-behaved/academically lagging students…hahahahaha. If you believe that, I have a nice bridge in NYC to sell ya! </p>
<p>Second, it places what is IMO an unfair heavy burden of responsibility on a young child which really belongs with the teachers/educational staff.</p>
<p>Regardless of the reasons, the OP needs to get the parents involved and to be prepared to escalate it as high as possible to get this vindictive idiot principal to change the policy or if not…hopefully sent packing.</p>
<p>oldfort, from what I understand, the problem is that THIS girl is the ONLY one who was MOVED from her assigned seat AFTER she presented a petition. She alone was deliberately moved away from her table, which had a diverse group of kids. This isn’t a case of a whiny kid not getting what she wants. Going along to get along isn’t called for here-principals are not gods and parents aren’t high-maintenance for asking for what’s right.</p>
<p>I feel for this little girl. At least she’s letting her family know what’s going on. It’s been four years and I am STILL learning about some of the things that happened when my own D was in a bullying situation, because she didn’t tell us at the time and have us worry. At least in that case, we had the teachers and principal on our side. Other than the bullies themselves, the problem was parents like you who think people should sit down and shut up rather than speak out.</p>
<p>I’d like to clarify that it isn’t assigned seating I have a problem with. I’m mostly indifferent to that. It just bothered me that my sister is the only kid in the grade to not have others of the same gender at her table, and that it happened after this incident. I don’t think it’s high maintenance to ask she be treated the same as the other kids. </p>
<p>We have a lot of other adults on our side. What my parents decided to do was get a group of them to join us and consult the superintendent. Something else I think worth noting is that my sister’s homeroom teacher actually told me a few weeks ago that she and most of the other teachers supported my sister and were against assigned seating, but they felt uncomfortable expressing this to the principal. The teacher was extremely supportive of the petition and proofread it for her. It is not just us whining about something that hasn’t bothered anyone else.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the good conversation on this!</p>
<p>Developmentally, pubescence is a time when children need to be with others of their own gender. This is not a time to isolate a girl from other girls. The CDC has a good web site that talks about the importance of same sex relationships at this age. It could be used as justification for changing the current seating situation.
[CDC</a> - Child Development, Middle Childhood (9-11 years old) - NCBDDD](<a href=“http://www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/childdevelopment/positiveparenting/middle2.html]CDC”>Middle Childhood (9-11 years old) | CDC)</p>
<p>If that link can’t be posted here, let me know and I’ll get it to you another way… or just use a search engine to look for child development middle childhood CDC. </p>
<p>We had a new principal come in for the last few years my kids were in elementary school. She was a control freak and made all kinds of ridiculous rules with no real purpose other than to control things. Rules should make sense and should have some good purpose which can be explained. </p>
<p>I suspect assigned seating is done when there is a large group of trouble makers who always sit together and cause trouble. Instead of just addressing that small group and splitting THEM up or giving THEM detention, the whole grade gets punished. This used to happen on my bus in junior high. The group that sat in the back of the bus got out of control so we all had assigned seats. I had to sit next to one of those idiots. They should have just kicked them off the bus or given them assigned seats and allowed us to sit where we wanted. They were still disruptive and still acted like idiots every day on the bus.</p>
<p>This is good to hear. Please let us know the outcome. I would be very surprised if the superintendent does nothing. He/She may have to be careful not to criticize his employee in front of a group of parents, but action will be taken. I can’t imagine anyone who works with elementary school children thinking that an 11 year old girl should be singled out and placed with a random table of 11 year old boys daily for their only social time, no matter what the reason. It’s pretty obvious that it’s pay back, but it doesn’t matter, it’s not appropriate. </p>
<p>I will never forget being in kindergarten and having assigned tables. My best (and only) friend was in a different class, and we basically weren’t allowed to see each other at lunch. I tended to eat alone. Sadly, things didn’t pick up from there. </p>
<p>OP–I wish you and your sister the best. I hope, most of all, that she realizes that there’s nothing at all wrong with what she did. In many situations, her ability to take initiative and fight for what she believes in would be considered admirable. I hope that message doesn’t get lost in all this. Keep us updated!</p>
<p>I do have a lot of experience dealing with school administration. If OP truly feels the sister is being singled out, I would have worked with the principal to get her rotated to another table in few weeks - pretending it wasn’t a retaliation, appeal to her sense of “we are all here to do what’s right for the children.” Going to the superintendent is a bad move, especially with a lot of parents because you are basically declaring a war. Most things can be worked out if it is done in a quiet way (no one loses face). When it becomes very public then the administration will have no choice but to take a hard stand. Ask yourself what is it you want to get out of the situation - getting the sister moved and to graduate (achievable), or to get the principal fired (very unlikely). </p>
<p>Private school is harder to deal with sometimes because the administration could ask your kid to leave if you push it too far. It is often smaller, so you don’t want your kid to have a bad reputation. For people who have been on here for a while know I am no push over when it comes to my kids. I am focused when I want optimal outcome of any situation for my kids. No, I wouldn’t have declared a war with the principal over the lunch room seating. </p>
<p>The principal didn’t get to be where she is by being a rookie. If she gets questioned about her actions I am sure she’ll have very good answers for her boss and her boss will most likely support her. Even if the principal were told by her boss to move the sister, I think it’ll be very awkward for the sister while continues to go to the school (would you go to war with your boss’ boss). I would be interested to know how many parents will go with OP’s parents to see the superintendent.</p>
<p>I am going to guess that when OP’s parents asked to have their D moved to another table, the principal said, “I understand how your daughter may feel, but I can’t move her just because she wants to sit some where else, or every parent will be calling me.”</p>
<p>If the principal moved the sister to an all boy table after the petition then I could see it maybe a retaliation.</p>
<p>PTAs are not allowed to address these issues. The PTA charter limits what they can deal with and they can’t deal with school policies. They’re pretty much limited to things like fund raising and other non-school policy issues. </p>
<p>Principals generally will not meet with a “group of parents”. They will claim that it’s because of FERPA, but it’s really because they don’t want to feel outnumbered. Oh, and by meeting with one parent at a time, they can claim, “oh, but you’re the only one with THAT complaint”. lol</p>
<p>The parents need to meet with the principal and INSIST (not ask) that their child be assigned to a mixed group of kids. The dad must be at the meeting too. (I’ve long learned that having the dad there too often tips the scales in the family’s favor. Many principals have no problem ignoring “mom complaints.”) Maybe bring a note from a therapist mentionig how upset the child is.</p>
<p>What the heck does Sandy Hook have to do with this? Is that idiot principal suggesting that this child is going to kill a bunch of people?</p>
<p>And, I must be dense cuz I have no idea of what the R word is. lol</p>
<p>hmmm…are educators on that list in the thread about sociopaths?</p>
<p>I have never felt ignored by the school administrator because I am a mom. I don’t think H has ever called the school or dealt with any of our kids’ teachers.</p>
<p>Lots of good ideas here. Poor little girl.
I can tell you, we had a terrible principal at my kids’ ES. The teachers hated him. We had run ins with him a couple of times, too. We absolutely weren’t alone. When my last child finished at elementary school, we were beyond elated. A whole group of us joked that the kids would get bigger parties for finishing elem school than for their graduations. The guy was a fool. After three years teachers complained he didn’t know their names. He certainly didn’t know the kids.</p>
<p>Working with the principal is futile. You can not reason with an unreasonable person. </p>
<p>Your parents should email the superintendent of schools. You could compose the letter and do the work and do it from your parents email address If they give you permission and they read the letter. I will proofread the letter of you pm me. You should also cc a bunch of people under the superintendent. </p>
<p>You need to go over the head of the principal. </p>
<p>Ps I did not read the more recent posts in the thread.</p>