I'm just not good enough.

Pre-Med & Medical School Pre-Med Topics
1

<p>These past two months have brought back the feelings of last year: depression, anger, and worst of all hopelessness. I cry myself to sleep every night these days because I have no control over what is going wrong in my life, but I don't like it and I want to change it. It sucks.</p>

<p>Last year I was a near 4.0 and 25-27 MCAT student who was rejected everywhere. This year I am 31-33 and near 4.0 applicant and I'm heading the similar (wrong) direction again. Rejections and no interview invites. Each rejection feels like a kick in the gut.</p>

<p>It's not my ECs or my letters because Mayo told me last year that they were fantastic and that if my MCAT had been 31+ I would have gotten accepted. I have that now, I didn't even apply to Mayo this year because I was too late. No one else wants me. I just don't understand and I'm afraid my dream of becoming a doctor is pretty much over.</p>

<p>Is it because schools think my undergrad was too easy? I went to a top 40...
Is it because I have 5 years of research experience and no publications? I only have 2 national presentations...
Is it still my MCAT score?
Is it because I took the MCAT multiple times?
Is it because my application was in sort of late?
Is it because I am a re-applicant?
Is it because I raised $10,000 in funds toward a medical mission...and they want more?
Are three national awards not enough...do I need more?
Was I over sentimental in my PS?</p>

<p>I'm lost and badly beaten up. I have a lot of great experience, ECs, and awards. It seems like in the grand scheme of things none of this matters and it's all about the MCAT. I thought I fixed that, but I guess it's not fixed yet. I need a hug.</p>

<p>I wish I was more like all of you and your children who aced the MCAT the first time with a 36+. I guess the people out there with the most potential in life do the best on the MCAT and they deserve to get into the top medical schools.</p>

2

<p>Which schools did you apply to? Maybe you’re not applying to the right schools</p>

3

<p>Are your MCAT scores sort of balanced? If they are, I do not think MCAT is your problem.</p>

<p>Do you apply relatively widely? Have you applied to too many top schools? I know an applicant with 3.95/40 from a top-5 college applied to mostly top med schools and got into a single med school very late in the application cycle. (even though she had many interview invites.) You only mentioned Mayo, but Mayo is hit or miss for everyone, including extremely qualified applicants.</p>

<p>Have you ever considered DO schools? (even though your stats is good for MD schools.)</p>

<p>Taking MCAT too many times could hurt. Two times should be fine.</p>

<p>Depending on the schools, some schools admit students mostly during the Spring. An extreme case I heard of: A student got pulled out of the waitlist in July, one day before the school starts! Hanging there. Let the schools know you are very interested in hearing from them, and attending the school if accepted.</p>

4

<p>Maybe that’s it. My verbal is only a 9 but my sciences are well into the double digits. Maybe that is still holding me back?</p>

<p>I’m applying to mostly top 40 schools and my state school. It’s depressing to have not heard back from even my state school yet. I did not apply to Mayo because I was too late this year (wasn’t verified until late September and they have aggressive rolling so I didn’t chance it).</p>

<p>I’d much rather stay away from D.O.</p>

5

<p>Sending you a hug Omni. You worked hard and something good will come out of this. Hang in there: the whole medical school application process is only half over.</p>

6

<p>Well, getting verified in late Sept is the main problem (this is your 2nd time applying, why did you make this mistake?). Applying to top 40 schools only is another one. Need to apply more broadly. If you really want to go to med school, might have to consider DO as well. 3rd time applying will be another hump you will have to overcome next cycle. Nothing is wrong with your stats, ECs. It’s your approach.</p>

7

<p>First off, getting into medical school is tough and even if you don’t get in it doesn’t mean you’re not good enough. Sure, you might not end up with an MD, but you sound like you’re definitely good enough to be a doctor (DO, NP, PA, caribbean MD still options easily) and honestly, it sounds like your approach to applying to med schools (which is a skill unto itself) is the real problem more so than you don’t have what it takes to get in.</p>

<p>I can’t tell if you want any sort of straight answers or not but I’ll give my personal take.</p>

<p>Top 40 undergrad holding you back - No, 100% no.</p>

<p>5 years of research with no pubs - depends on the field and how much blame your PI takes for the lack of pubs in his/her LOR for you. Unless you’re on a clinical trial, 5 years is a long time to not have a single publication unless these are multiple shorter stints in labs. If so, how many labs and how long each? What exactly does “national presentation” mean? Were you the first author on the submission of those? Overall though, I don’t think this is your issue anyway but as an MD/PhD student I always want to hear the details of anyone’s research experience before I weigh in on it. That being said, usually at the undergraduate stage it’s about participation much more so than results.</p>

<p>MCAT score - depending on how many retakes we’re talking, and especially if you’re mainly applying to top 40 schools, then yes. These schools represent the top 3rd of medical schools and are above average schools. Someone with a low 30-33 after multiple retakes can easily get in to a top school, but they can very easily not. Schools lower down in the rankings would have classes where your MCAT score would be above the class average and you’d have a great chance of being admitted given that the rest of your application seems pretty solid.</p>

<p>AMCAS Verified in late september is REALLY REALLY REALLY late and drastically hurts your chances. Our advisor told us if you hadn’t submitted by August 1st to abort that cycle and wait because the only thing worse than a late application is a … reapplicant</p>

<p>The $10,000 thing sounds impressive but did you do any clinical exposure other than this (i.e. something in the US and more longitudinal)
3 national awards sounds plenty</p>

<p>Doubt you were overly-sentimental in PS but did you glorify and hero-worship being a doctor too much to the point where it sounded like you didn’t really know what being a doctor is like? That’s me looking for a reason to think your PS was bad so I may be totally off base.</p>

<p>EDIT: my epically long post made me cross post with above, note that we said the same thing for our main points.</p>

8

<p>There’s still some time left. Hang on a bit longer before you throw the towel in. </p>

<p>But I think probably there are many contributory factors to your lack of sucess: the multiple MCATs, the unbalanced MCAT score, being a re-applicant, applying only to reach-y schools, applying late. All these little dings add up.</p>

<p>I assume you have the requisite medical ECs like shadowing and clinical volunteering–but you don’t mention any. Do you?</p>

<p>But please remember that sometimes people get rejected for no good reason other than there are way too many applicants for too few seats. </p>

<p>This is going to sound odd and perhaps a bit callous, but try not to take the med school admissions process personally. It’s not a judgment on you as a person.</p>

9

<p>My vote is that you applied too late and didn’t apply to the right mix of schools. It sounds like you have a competitive profile based on what you’ve described.</p>

<p>You mentioned feelings of anger, hopelessness, and depression. You wrote that you cry yourself to sleep and that you have no control over your life. You also wrote that you don’t like it and that you want to change it. I think it takes a lot of guts to admit your feelings about this process, especially when they seem to be affecting you so profoundly. I’m glad you recognize that you don’t like the direction you’re headed right now and have enough insight to want to change it. If you were my friend in real life, and you were coming to me with these feelings, I would encourage you to talk about them with someone who is much more an expert in these areas than I am. I think talking about your feelings, mood, and fears with someone you trust and respect could help steer you in the right direction to really allow some permanent change to occur. They might point you to more resources that could help you even more. </p>

<p>It sounds like this is a frustrating and dark place for you, perhaps compounded by your peers seeing success in areas you haven’t yet. I think coming here is a great start, but really, there’s only so much a bunch of random strangers can do. I encourage you to reach out to someone who cares about you; give them the opportunity to help you through this tough time and take care of you.</p>

10

<p>Thank you lima beans, same to you.</p>

<p>Yes, the no publications issue is 100% my fault. I put every spare minute away from class and clinical ECs into my research and failed to publish, as I have failed to do just about anything right these past 3-4 years of my life. The posters were first author and I can speak about my research intellectually if anyone ever gave me the chance to. Same lab for 4 years. New lab since I graduated. The postdoc in my old lab still has all the data and is sitting on it for some reason…I wish she would get going but she started a new job and she won’t let me write it up. I know it looks really bad to have that much research experience and nothing to show for it. </p>

<p>The reason I applied late is that I had to take an August MCAT (another grand mistake) so I applied right after taking the MCAT and was complete around when I got my score in. Without that score, my application was not significantly different that last year’s failed attempt.</p>

<p>I know the Sept submission is crushing me, but my parents want me to move on with my life and I thought maybe things might have worked out. </p>

<p>Personally, I think this is what is turning my life upside down (which I think you all are picking up on).</p>

<p>1) Took MCAT unprepared first time and bombed it
2) Applied 1st time in October with a very low MCAT score and got rejected everywhere
3) As a re applicant I still took a late MCAT and applied late in late September
4) My MCAT is not the 35+ needed to compensate for #3</p>

<p>It just pangs me to see kids still getting interviews to these schools right now. I mean if they really wanted me, they still had my application for like 2 months now…they had to have read it and just thought I wasn’t good enough. Even if I applied in June, maybe they still would have thought I was uncompetitive applicant.</p>

<p>Last year’s cycle really hurt me emotionally, and this year is just taking the air right out of me.</p>

11

<p>Taking MCAT late and therefore applying late really hurt your chance. I knew an applicant with 35 MCAT and good enough GPA did not fare well just because he applied almost as late as you. (He also had the California schools to deal with though.) – Somehow I feel that your personality comes out as a perfectionist. My guess is that you were not willing to take MCAT the second time until you felt you were very well prepared. But this is just my wild guess. You spent well too much time on research when you should divert some of your time to MCAT. (You were like one of DS’s friends who was not good at verbal, and spent well too much time on research only to find it could not compensate his less than ideal MCAT score…)</p>

<p>DS had much better stats than yours. And his list of schools still includes many schools out of the top 40. (I really do not think there is much difference between a school ranked 30 and one ranked, say, 60 or 70, for MD-only programs.)</p>

<p>BTW, I think your 9 in verbal could be good enough for many schools if you applied promptly and widely. In Texas, I think that score is likely good enough for one thirds of in-state schools. Please do not tell me that you are so unlucky that you need to deal with “crazy” California schools with a 9 in verbal! (Since you applies to Mayo, it is likely you are not from California – They can not stand the cold there :))</p>

<p>Hang in there. There are still about 3 months of interview time (?)</p>

12

<p>OP, you really need to take a step back, take a deep breath and stop personalizing the situation so much. Medical schools are not passing judgement on you as person or an applicant other than to say that at this particular time you are not a good match this year for those particular schools. </p>

<p>In your posts here, you come off as desperate, immature, unjustifiably envious of others and in need of validation. If you’re presenting that same image to medical schools, then that could be part of your problem also. You need to step back and uncouple your ego /identity/self-worth from medical school admission. You as a person are not the sum total of your application.</p>

<p>If you are half as unhappy and angry (and, yes, desperate) as you seem to be expressing here, then kristin’s advice is spot on. Please seek help from someone who can help you reframe and refocus, and to find a more balanced way to deal with this stressful period.</p>

13

<p>I guess you are right. If this application season turns out to end like I think it will, that will be all for me. I’m going to find my way over to the hilltowns of Tuscany and Umbria and become a monk for the rest of my life (I’m not really Jewish as my name would suggest). I don’t think God is mad at me, or else I wouldn’t have made it this far. I just think maybe this wasn’t meant to be after all. I am angry and bitter at this process and I don’t want to be anymore…I’ve now placed myself outside any judgements that others will make on me as a person (yes, I take rejection and failure personally). I’ll give it until March and then I’m changing gears.</p>

<p>And as to whether I am desperate. I am desperate…I want to become a doctor and the door is shutting in my face and I have little to no control over it (I honestly did everything to the best of my ability except getting my stuff in in a timely manner).</p>

<p>I did put too much emphasis on my research and outreach projects…I thought I was doing something good for the community. Apparently, that doesn’t matter to people in power anymore. Ok, I’m done talking about this now because it’s starting to agitate me again.</p>

14

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<p>Sad to say, we hear stories every year of people who did not fully grasp the finer points of the process and who believed the due dates in December were real due dates.</p>

<p>I would highly suggest you NOT accept these two bad cycles as necessarily indicative of your future as a physician. Being a third time reapplicant is worse than applying only once or twice, but if you could actually do everything as recommended, then you could have a shot at getting in.</p>

<p>The questions that come to my mind are:</p>

<p>What state are you in? That is huge, for example TX is way better than CA</p>

<p>Do you have ECs beyond the research? Have you shadowed sufficiently that you actually know what life is like for a doctor, that you know what you are choosing? Do you have other medically related ECs, volunteering in health related situations, etc?</p>

<p>If you choose to apply next year, submit TX apps in May and AMCAS in June. Have new fresh strong LORs and lots of non-research ECs to round out your application.</p>

<p>You posts sound desperate and sad, you cannot apply from that point of view. Nothing wrong with feeling unhappy about it all, but also recognize that you did this to yourself by applying late. Yes, every year we hear about some schools in some states for which August/September is OK, but overall, June is best.</p>

<p>Try to find a way out of feeling like a victim of circumstances and if you choose one more cycle, craft the perfect application.</p>

15

<p>Omni, do you have someone to talk to and advise you? It would be very helpful to have some kind of a sounding board. Did anyone help you put together you school list? I’m not exactly sure what might happen between now and March, but I do suggest you keep yourself busy. Sometimes when I’m waiting for something to happen, and it doesn’t, it’s just excruciatingly painful. Other times, when I’m busy and doing tons of activities and not thinking about waiting, the time flies by. Make plans, keep busy, and if something positive comes from your application: great! If not, at least you’ve been busy and getting on with your life.</p>

16

<p>And if you do make it to med school, you will be facing lots of ups and downs. if you cant handle the application cycle, can you handle the stress and rigor of med school? You will get lost, you will get beaten down. You have to find ways to pick yourself back up. Just food for thought.</p>

17

<p>Are you only applying to Harvard and the likes?</p>

<p>I know a non-URM who got into a MD/PhD program with a 27 MCAT on the first try and a 30 MCAT on the second and so-so ECs.</p>

<p>You don’t need to be a good test taker to get into medical school. A lot of it is due to chance. Fourth tier schools accept almost anyone with a slightly above average MCAT.</p>

18

<p>Are you sure you want to go to medical school? Why are you so miserable already when you have barely begun the process? The MCAT is a joke compared to the Step 1 (the MCAT has high school level physics on it) and undergrad is really easy compared to medical school. Why don’t you take a step back and reexamine why you want to go in the first place? Otherwise, you will be miserable when you get in and when you start working. You shouldn’t spend your life miserable. There are other jobs out there that work you less, make decent money, and won’t put you into massive debt too. If you’re taking out full loans for medical school, you’re probably financially better off NOT going to medical school and pursuing another field.</p>

19

<p>Do you have pre-med advisory at your UG? They are in a best position to discuss what is lacking and they should have done it before hand to prevent all negative events that are happenning. You really need to talk to somebody who knows what is going on, not just pat you on your back, but give you solid advice.
I did not read all above closely, not sure if it was pointed out that your previous MCAT is NOT DEAD, it stays with you. Having 33 would be just fine, having combo of 33 and 27 might not be. But again, only proffessional (pre-med advisor) can steer you in a right direction. Did you discuss your list of schools with anybody? It has to match your stats. Mayo is very hard to get in even for those with very high MCAT score. It is very frustrating when applicant did not match his stats to his list, even the very high stats applicant might end up with no single acceptance if his list is not the right for his application.</p>

20

<p>MiamiDAP, my pre-med advisor is brand new and has no idea what’s going on. I’m on my own and I have been emailing the schools that have rejected me thus far but no one wants to tell me anything. But you’re spot on about the MCAT. Please tell any kid that comes on here to take the MCAT once and only once. Multiple MCATs and reapplications such as mine really crush your application. </p>

<p>Clonetex, I’m sure you are very young. Medical school admissions are very hard. Don’t let anyone fool you about this process, you need a lot more than a pulse to get in. There are too many smart kids to too few spots and people like me get shut out every year. Oh well, I’m almost done with the process and will be moving on with my life.</p>