<p>Its been a while but glad to be back on CollegeConfidential.</p>
<p>I have done my BSE in Industrial & Operations Engineering and after doing a supply chain internship, I was taking the semester off and will now be doing the Integrative Systems + Design M.Eng in Manufacturing Program starting in Winter 2014.</p>
<p>Feel free to ask me anything about Michigan Engineering (especially for the freshman, sophomores and juniors).</p>
<p>Whilst, I may not be able to talk too much about specific classes that I have not taken, I can still give you valuable perspective on my experiences and any questions that you may have.</p>
<p>Thank you for taking time to answer questions - I have a few:
How big were your freshman classes? and when did your classes start to get smaller?</p>
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<li><p>How stressful/manageable did you find the workload?</p></li>
<li><p>Did you feel you had time to enjoy all the fun stuff that the school offers?</p></li>
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The entry level courses such as Math 215, MAth 216, Engr 100, Engr 101, Econ 101 were pretty big in terms of class size and often had many different sections. However, 1 big advantage of large classes is that there are potentially a lot more people wit whom you can study together, do homework and ask for help.
In fact, the beginner level IOE courses such as IOE 201, 202, 265, 333, 373, 474 (if people bothered to turn up…) were all pretty big.
Classes began to get smaller by the time of junior year when I begun to take electives within IOE and economics. To be honest, some of the elective courses were harder than the core courses but a lot were actually easier.</p>
<p>2) Some classes were pretty stressful and did require a significant time commitment in order to do well e.g. Math 215, Engr 101, IOE 373, ME 211, Econ 406, IOE 453. However, some classes were simply a joke and were not treated seriously by many students (including those who did well in them) such as Econ 101, Econ 401, IOE 265, IOE 366, IOE 474 and IOE 441 from my experience. It really depends on your own strengths, weaknesses, study habits and how organized you are. Overall, I don’t think any particular class was impossible as long as you had the right attitude and enough determination to get a decent grade.</p>
<p>3) I definitely did have good time to socialize and enjoy many of the resources that Umich offers including football games, Clubs and events as well as just hanging out with friends and peers. Fridays and Saturdays were usually the days when I had the most time to do other activities and enjoy myself. Again, you have to be organized and start you work early if you want to have free time.</p>
<p>@ThisIsMichigan:
This thread is for the younger CC posters who are doing Michigan Engineering, I am reasonably confident that they will find it useful and gain some good advice!</p>
<p>I’ll throw some answers up as well… Multiple perspectives can help sometimes. Not trying to show you up or anything MSB.</p>
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<p>It depends on what exactly you take. The prerequisite classes mostly range from 90-400 but the honors math classes will be smaller (like 30ish) and Engr100 will usually be 50 or so students. As for major classes, they’ll depend on the department. I can only really speak to IOE and EECS but I’d say IOE major classes are usually 100-150 students and EECS major classes range from about 90-200. In IOE there’s only one section a semester for each course, but for EECS there are often 2 or 3 sections, which keeps EECS classes smaller than you would think based on the number of EECS students. Elective courses range pretty wildly, but I’d say the smallest I’ve had has been about 25 and the largest about 150. </p>
<p>The “average” person will take something looking like this:</p>
<p>Freshman: Mostly prerequisites, maybe 1 or 2 major classes.
Sophomore: Mostly major classes, maybe 1 or 2 prerequisite classes.
Junior: Half major classes, half electives.
Senior: Mostly electives, maybe 1 or 2 major classes.</p>
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<p>It will depend on what you take. Once you get here and talk to people you’ll figure out what a reasonable schedule is and what is too much. In general I’m not very stressed.</p>
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<p>I’ve gotten out of it what I could reasonably expect to get out of it. Anywhere I didn’t, time probably wasn’t the limiting factor.</p>
<p>MSB314 and Vlandenschlutte - that was very helpful.</p>
<p>Classes that size seem a bit overwhelming. Do you ever wish you had gone to a smaller school (that presumably had smaller classes and better student-faculty interaction)?</p>
<p>i.) Is it possible to transfer to CoE as a freshman and still finish school in four years?</p>
<p>ii.) Is there anything an LSA transfer can do, or a freshman course load they can take to heighten the chances of finishing in four years?</p>
<p>iii.) Is social life for transfers tough because most of CoE shared freshman courses and living quarters, and formed cliques?</p>
<p>iv.) How and when do CoE students decide on what they want to focus on, e.g., mechanical, aero, et al.? Do most know what they want to pursue when they apply, get to campus or is it decided sometime freshman?</p>
<p>It’s a pretty common misconception that smaller schools have significantly smaller class sizes. While that can be true, the majority of the time it is not (that wont stop any small university from saying it though). Many small schools still have classes with hundreds of students just like any large university. Even Princeton, the wealthiest university in the world (per student) that also only has 18% the number of undergraduates as Michigan, reported that it has 37 classes with 100+ or more students enrolled. The only schools which can legitimately and honestly claim they don’t have these large classes are the LAC’s, but there are obviously some other disadvantages which LAC’s have to deal with that traditional universities do not.</p>
<p>Anyways professors at Michigan are quite approachable outside of class. They (and their GSI’s) always have scheduled office hours where you can just pop in and start talking to them.</p>
<p>Not really. Honestly, a lot of your classes you’re not going to care about. I’d say I’ve had about 10 classes I really cared about in total (out of 174 credits, so about 50 classes - don’t feel like going through and counting them all). In those classes you can be more active as many of your classmates won’t care about those classes. </p>
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<p>Yes. More than half of CoE freshmen don’t take any engineering classes other than Engr100 and Engr101 (which for LSA->CoE transfers, English 125 and EECS 183 replace). Most CoE students don’t start Engineering courses until Sophomore year.</p>
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<p>Well, first figure out what you want to study in CoE. IOE for instance has slightly different math requirements than other engineering majors (214 instead of 216), ChemE and BME require more Chemistry than other majors, EECS classes are usually open for LSA majors and many majors require or can make use of EECS classes so that’s something to consider. But mostly, get the prerequisites out of the way. So make sure you’re done with math through 215 and 214/216, Physics through 240/241, a Chemistry class (Usually Gen Chem or Orgo I but I think you can take Orgo II or PChem 260 to count for it?), English 125, EECS 183, maybe an econ class depending on the major. If you know specifically the major I can help further.</p>
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<p>Most CoE freshmen don’t share courses or living quarters, so I’d say most likely it’s fine. And either way, there’s no reason why someone transferring to CoE can’t remain friends with the people they became friends with in LSA.</p>
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<p>It varies. Some come in knowing what they want to do or having a good idea of what they want to do, others have no idea and decide freshman year. I think there’s a new rule that CoE students have to declare by the end of their 3rd semester to be allowed to register for classes. </p>
<p>If you don’t know what you want to do coming in, you’ll talk to people when you come and figure it out. I think there’s a CoE majors fair sometime where there are students from each of the majors (maybe save some that don’t really have anybody like AOSS or Engineering Physics or other weird stuff - but all the substantial majors). You can talk to them to maybe get a better idea. There’s also an Engr110 which I VERY HIGHLY DISRECOMMEND (as in, I recommend you DON’T take it), but if you really want to you can check that out. It is designed to show you a little about what all the different majors are.</p>
<p>“Not really. Honestly, a lot of your classes you’re not going to care about. I’d say I’ve had about 10 classes I really cared about in total (out of 174 credits, so about 50 classes - don’t feel like going through and counting them all). In those classes you can be more active as many of your classmates won’t care about those classes.” </p>
<p>Could you please elaborate on this?</p>
<p>Are you saying you only cared about the content of about 10 of your classes (I assume you still cared about your grade)? Also, what were the 10 classes?</p>
<p>More importantly, if you only cared about 1/6 of your classes, isn’t there something wrong with that? I’m not saying there is something wrong with you, but isn’t there something wrong with the education system, what classes are required, electives, etc.?</p>
<p>I’d say the classes I cared about (as in cared about the material) were:</p>
<p>ECON 401
EECS 203
EECS 281
EECS 477
EECS 492
IOE 202
IOE 310
IOE 316
IOE 419 (Was 491 when I took it - but same class)
IOE 510/MATH 561
IOE 518
MATH 451
PHL 443</p>
<p>Which is actually 13 I guess. </p>
<p>Is there something wrong with the required classes? Probably. I think there’s a similar theme between all of those classes I listed, but not a single majors that links them. Perhaps if a major that linked those classes together existed I would have majored in that. Most of the time I was able to tell what I thought was interesting before the class even started with a few exceptions (of the above listed, I liked IOE 316 and MATH 451 better than I thought I would - I liked EECS 280, EECS 475, and MATH 423 less than I thought I would) but I have to take what’s required.</p>
<p>So as long as my daughter takes English 125 and EECS 183 freshman year at LSA, she won’t be behind as a transfer? I assume LSA students can’t take ENGR 100 and 101 or can they? Do you recommend taking them if they’re thinking of transferring? I assume they’d just be electives if she doesn’t transfer.</p>
<p>Are there any clubs or events prospective CoE transfers can get involved with to get a better understanding of CoE?</p>
<p>When do most CoE students fulfill their math pre-reqs? I believe Calc I, II and III are required?</p>
<p>What is a typical freshman class schedule at CoE?</p>
<p>She should take all or as many prerequisites as possible. Ideally she should complete her prerequisites by the end of freshman year but it is fairly common to take some prerequisites sophomore year so it’s not a big problem if she doesn’t.</p>
<p>The prerequisite classes (with a few exceptions - a few majors vary from this by a class or two) are:</p>
<p>-Physics 140, 141, 240, 241 (Can be replaced with 160-260 series)
-Chemistry 130+125+126 or 210+211 (she should do 210+211 if she’s thinking ChemE or BME)
-Some Calc 1, 2, 3, and DiffEq, there are so many different options that can count here for those. However for IOE she needs Linear Algebra instead of DiffEq.
-English 125
-EECS 183</p>
<p>Sometimes LSA students can get into Engr100 or Engr101, I’m not sure the rules regarding this, but English 125 and EECS 183 count for these classes which she can get into.</p>
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<p>A typical first semester might look like:</p>
<p>-A math class
-A physics or chemistry class
-Either Engr100 or Engr101 (in your daughter’s case, either Engl 125 or EECS 183)
-One other class - could be another prerequisite class, could be a humanities class, could be Econ 101 which is required by some majors, could be anything</p>
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<p>As I said earlier, sometime a few weeks into fall, there’s a majors fair where she can talk to different people in different CoE majors and get a better idea of what all the different majors are like. She can sit in on the Engr110 lecture if she wants, which is designed to give you a better idea about the different majors, but I didn’t think it was very useful. Other than that, just talking to people is her best bet. There are also a few classes which can be used by several majors (EECS 280 is one for instance) which she can take while she’s still deciding.</p>
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<p>Usually freshman year or sophomore year. All the CoE majors require an additional math class, DiffEq in the case of everything except IOE and Linear Algebra in the case of IOE.</p>
<p>3) To be honest, I don’t think any transfer student should have any problem socializing in the dorms. I myself wasn’t too involved in the dorm life as I was often outside studying and doing activities throughout the campus. I made most of my friends through classes, common interests and clubs and organizations. Of course, I also got myself acquainted with my dorm mates as well over time. It really is up to you, getting to know your hall mates on a personal level and reaching out to them will make a big difference.</p>
<p>4) Some do and some don’t know what they will major in when they start college. You generally have until sophomore year to declare your major although you can take a few beginner 200 level classes in your freshman/sophomore year to get a ‘feel’ for what a major is like. I myself definitely had no idea that I wanted to do IOE when I started college and also declared in my first semester of my sophomore year. I guess it is better to take your time and think about what you want to do rather than rush it and make a bad decision that you would later regret.</p>
<p>451 was kind of cool because it was math that you could have a conversation about. Perhaps not the best description but it was “conceptual” math. It’s difficult but not insane.</p>