<p>OK, so we all have friends who go to UCLA. </p>
<p>Up here, its our job to rein in UCSF(they tell everyone they’re Berkeley Medical anyways). Down in LA, our southern branch (new name of UCLA) will rein in Cal Tech. </p>
<p>Berkeley, UCSF, UCLA, Cal Tech</p>
<p>The inner council of the California Ivies. Let our California journey to conquer America begin!</p>
<p>No Stanford/USC?</p>
<p>Seriously, Stanford and USC (grudgingly) have to be there.</p>
<p>Why California Ivies? Why not something original instead of mimicing the Eastern Establishment.</p>
<p>i hate the fact that people equate "ivy league" with good school...the ivy league is a freaking athletic conference....thats like east-coasters saying, "we should assemble a pac-10 league for our schools"....makes no sense</p>
<p>^ Yeah, but most people today give crappy ivies like Brown a boost, just for being in an ivy league. We can extend our circle of prestige to do the same for those not so fortunate as well. </p>
<p>Well the 1st stage would be the inner council of UC Berkeley, UCSF, UCLA, and Cal Tech.</p>
<p>2nd stage would incorporate UCSD and USC</p>
<p>3rd stage would incorporate Claremont Colleges</p>
<p>4th stage, we could all vote whether to let Stanfurd in or not. </p>
<p>Last stage, we would incorporate the California Ivies + 4</p>
<p>U of Michigan, U of Chicago, Johns Hopkins, and MIT.</p>
<p>2nd stage for USC and 4th (maybe) for Stanford huh? I don't see how you can relegate USC to the second stage when it's SAT scores are higher than everyone's in your list except CalTech (though yes, even higher than your vaunted Berkeley), and has much more financial resources than any of those schools.</p>
<p>And Stanford? Come on... Stanford's better than all of us.</p>
<p>USC does not have higher SAT's than Berkeley. Berkeley uses the best one sitting method, while USC uses the best verbal + best math method. </p>
<p>75th percentile of SAT at Berkeley is 1500 on the SAT using best math+ best verbal. That means 800-900 incoming students every year has 1500+ on the SAT. Financial resources are overstated in US News, because most schools only use 5% of their endowment per year, and UC's also get a significant amount of revenue from patents, which are not included in financial resources figures. </p>
<p>Also, USC is relegated to the second stage because this is a private public culmination of California. USC must be willing to prove that their representation of Southern California is more genuine than their private school ambitions.</p>
<p>pleeease... does anyone seriously think that USC is a better school than Berkeley? I really doubt it. So what if it has more financial resources? It is a private school after all, and comparing the funds of privates and publics like Berkeley doesn't make any sense. </p>
<p>On another note, though, as much as I hate to say this, Stanfurd should technically be in the 1st tier with us as well. All biasness aside, it is a great school, and we should be big enough to admit this. Doesn't mean we can't still hate them, but any notion of a Californian "Ivy League" would surely include Stanford somewhere at the top of the list (but behind us, of course haha).</p>
<p>The California Ivy League, as determined by me, is as follows:</p>
<p>Berkeley, UCLA, Stanford, Cal Tech, USC, Pomona, and Pepperdine.</p>
<p>Now, I know what you're thinking: Pepperdine?! It's a second or even third-tier school!</p>
<p>Yes, I agree. However, imagine all the Malibu benefits we get by establishing a relationship with them? UCLA credit for studying at Pepperdine? I'd SO be there!</p>
<p>Yes, I'd even drive from USC, which is farther away.</p>
<p>No stanfurd will be added last. They are not to be trusted with status in the California Ivies. They have no loyalty to California or the west coast... they will sell us out...so it has to be 4th stage. With UCSF and Cal Tech, we don't need Stanfurd for now.</p>
<p>What's with this loyalty to the West Coast notion? The Ivies have no bias to their respective states, nor even their respective coast.</p>
<p>And somehow Caltech, a private institution, somehow has more bias and representation of California than the state's other elite private schools?</p>
<p>Cal Tech's loyalty is in Research. And since everyone knows California is the best place for all science research, of course they respect the environment in which such amazing things can flourish. </p>
<p>Actually, USC did a lot in terms of west coast representation in the NCAA Football Rankings. Everyone knows the system is heavily geared to be biased against west coast schools. But USC did retain #1 for two years and made significant headway against the west coast bias.</p>
<p>For this reason, this is why USC should be ahead of Stanfurd for induction into the California Ivies. Stanfurd can never represent against tough regional odds like that.</p>
<p>Haha, okay, well I'm all for anyone's inclusion of USC over Stanford, but in terms of research dollars and output, I'm pretty sure Caltech is 3rd. Obviously, this is mainly due to its small size, but Stanford (especially) and USC are research powerhouses. This is not to say Caltech is 3rd overall of course.</p>
<p>^ California Institute of Technology is quite a good school. They have the highest citations per faculty out of any school in the entire world. And they are far ahead of second place in the citations per faculty category. </p>
<p>I would not call USC a research powerhouse just yet (although it is improving greatly). The recent fall of USC rankings in the MBA department should give you a greater clue of what is going on in the east coast ranking organizations, than this silly private vs. public road that is traveled down too often and is just below the level of California visionaries.</p>
<p>West Sidee why are you so opposed to Stanford being in your 1st tier, I smell a Stanford reject.</p>
<p>My first tier second tier thing has nothing to do with the rankings of the schools. it has to do more with the proper initiation of the Council members.</p>
<p>So far, I think that the California Ivies consist of:</p>
<p>Berkeley, UCLA, UCSF, Cal Tech </p>
<p>USC, UCSD ( alliance of California public and privates)</p>
<p>Claremont Colleges (Harvey Mudd) (alliance of LAC's and Large traditional universities)</p>
<p>Stanfurd.</p>
<p>Once all these steps are complete, then we will be greater than any other league out there. </p>
<p>Then U of Michigan, Johns Hopkins, U of Chicago, and MIT should be asked to join the California Ivies + 4 to give proper recognition to universities with top level research and international prestige.</p>
<p>I do not doubt that there is an east-coast bias in academia. However, one cannot source the drop in USC's MBA program as evidence against its research as the methodologies that go into computing those rankings, which rely most on undergraduate GPA, GMAT, avg. work experience (in years), % employed after (time period) graduation, average starting salaray... have very, very little to do with research.</p>
<p>A better guage is research funding. USC ranks in the top 10 among private research universities in terms of federal funds awarded toweards research and development, and among the top 20 of all universities. Based upon this, how can one disregard that USC is indeed a research powerhouse?</p>
<p>"Then U of Michigan, Johns Hopkins, U of Chicago, and MIT should be asked to join the California Ivies + 4 to give recognition to top level research and international prestige." </p>
<p>These are east coast schools, for gods sake MIT is walking distance from Harvard</p>
<p>USC is certainly improving their engineering and science departments. And their standards are indeed rising. But much of the ranking methodology and weighting systems are arbitrary, they adjust percentages as they please from year to year. Look at ranking methodologies from the early 90's for US News to what it is today. Its vastly different. USC needs to beat out NYU in prestige right now. That should be their national priority. </p>
<p>2bad4u, Yup. That is the last step. To show that research is above regionalism. </p>
<p>All these steps must follow in this order, or else it won't work. This is the California vision.</p>