<p>It is interesting to read the abstract of the study on the Pediatrics Journal websight. <a href="http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/117/6/1939%5B/url%5D">http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/cgi/content/abstract/117/6/1939</a></p>
<p>Oh, imagine that....Felipe is quite active on the U. Chicago boards. Never would have guessed that. Maybe Chicago will replace Duke as the troll factory?</p>
<p>And collegeparent, just because Cornell and Princeton students actually work and care about their studies, as opposed to sitting around smoking the ganj all day like the kids at Middlebury, Vassar, Kenyon, and the other hippie LAC's whose boards you frequent, doesn't mean that they all cut themselves daily.</p>
<p>your in the wrong forum, goto Cornell college in alphabet list</p>
<p>CNN has much more accurate coverage on the study. It was actually not an expos</p>
<p>Amen, Perro.</p>
<p>Have a great time at the place where fun goes to die, Felipe ;).</p>
<p>Lol Lol Lol</p>
<p>I am currently watching the "Apprentice" show on NBC. Lee, one of the finalists, is a Cornell University alumnus. Isn't that something? I think there should not be any more question asking if Cornell is a good school. It is a <em>great</em> school.</p>
<p>Since all of you consider yourself so brilliant:</p>
<p>All the people here have spent 2 pages giving ME - not the original poster - reasons on why Cornell wasn't as bad as I made it out to be. I guess that's the main problem with Cornell. I can see someone convincing me it isn't a bad school, but I have a hard time seeing how it is a better school than its fellow Ivies or other top research institutions. I realize now that my original post was more of a rant than anything else, so I'll try to sum up what I meant to say to that first individual:</p>
<p>Cornell is indeed a good school. I don't think anyone who's ever heard of it would contest that. But I believe that this would remain true if you substituted Cornell with the name of 50 other American universities. When he asked about Cornell being a "good" school, someone has to immediately assume that he means "good" compared to some other school... and when it comes to Cornell, it is fair to assume that the standard should be set very high. Here, then, is my problem: Compared to its fellow Ivy league schools, or other highly reputable universities, I find little that would attract someone TO Cornell over other top 25 schools. I sincerely have a hard time seeing what makes this school, in any regard, better than some of the schools which this particular kid might also have been admitted to. When I mentioned the comment about the size, I wanted simply to point out that it will prob. not offer the small environment that other colleges in big research universities can provide, and that it also wasn't big enough to provide the atmosphere some people desire when they go to state universities. When I mentioned the WSJ figures (which I think are very good indicators of what happens to a university's graduates - mind you im saying this with my school being ranked 14th) I tried showing that it is very lackluster when it comes to getting kids into top grad programs - most of which are in other Ivy league schools. </p>
<p>When you consider strength of departments, I fail to see a field of study which Cornell is superior to any other university. </p>
<p>When you consider the faculty attention, you will NOT have a 3:1 or 4:1 student:faculty ration like you do at CalTech and Chicago, respectively.</p>
<p>If you do want to talk about prestige, with the exception of Dartmouth, I think most would find all the other Ivy league schools to be more prestigious. (Although I'd personally put Cornell over Penn)</p>
<p>And, again, what I think is most telling is that in all of these pages of discussion, someone is yet to point out a fact which would attract someone to Cornell over other similar schools. Instead, most have just spend their time discussing the results and methodologies of studies regarding depressed college students - and specifically Cornell. Again, I see a general trend towards proving why it isn't bad, whereas it should be "proving why it is so great". On that note, I would also like to point out that I fully realize that the anecdotal evidence of one girl getting depressed and being sent home is truly not very indicative of how the school treats their students. What I think IS indicative is the quote someone from the university offered TIME when asked about why they hadn't contacted the student after she had left the school, not even to see how she was doing. The response, if I remember correctly, went something like: "When she leaves the school grounds, she's no longer our problem." I suffer from Bipolar, and I can assure you that this is extremely unsettling to any student facing any kind of problems of that sort.</p>
<p>Lastly, just cause this irks me a bit, I want to say something to those who truly want to gloat about the fact that Cornell is sooo much more competitive than Chicago. I don't know where all of you get this from. Yes, Chicago gets like 8k applications. Come to think of it, MIT gets like 12k. Does that mean that MIT is less competitive than Harvard (around 22k) simply because it gets less than half of Harvard's applicant pool? No, it simply means that there are more kids who just threw a hail mary at Harvard... and, I'll admit to this: Most kids DON'T throw a hail mary at Chicago... I happen to like that. I wanna go to class with kids who actually looked at the school and liked it, and not because daddy really made them apply. And, if Chicago were soo easy to get into, I'd like someone to explain to me why the entering class has an SAT average above half of the ivies, including <em>gasp</em> your wonderful Cornell University.</p>
<p>P.S.: I'm sorry about the "seeked" incident. I guess that when you've only had 4 years to learn English these foolish things are bound to happen. So, from the outset, I apologize for any grammatical mistakes I have made in this post, especially since I will prob. not proofread it.</p>
<p>I should also point this out: I don't want to offend anyone. I have several friends going to Cornell this year, and few others are already there, and in the most part they really like this school. All im trying to do is to hash out what's actually true of Cornell so that one kid can make his own conclusions. When I was deciding between the two colleges I had applied, Gtown (for poli sci) and Chicago (for econ), I found things like this to be helpful. That's indeed my only motivator for this. I do not intend to hate on Cornell.</p>
<p>"I am currently watching the "Apprentice" show on NBC..." I thought we'd given up on anecdotal evidence? If not: I saw the president's speech this morning - he went to Yale. I watched it on CNN - Ted Turner went to Brown. Afterwards, I played a little bit of Halo - the founders of the studio went to Chicago. I used facebook afterwards - the guy who created it went to Harvard. Come to think of it, the original apprentice winner went to Bradley University. Therefore, Bradley = Cornell? ---- These kinds of anecdotal evidence will take us nowhere....</p>
<p>Who said only you could use anecdotes?</p>
<p>"When you consider strength of departments, I fail to see a field of study which Cornell is superior to any other university"</p>
<p>Was this a joke? This is one of the things that makes Cornell strong! Take a look at Engineering, Hotel, Architecture, and ILR for starters...I mean was that seriously a joke?</p>
<p>Why are you on these forums. I have come to understand what your purpose is (so no offense...), but what made you happen to find this thread on a Cornell forum?</p>
<p>engineering... i think I'd go with MIT... Hotel... ok, I'll give you that one... Architecture, Again MIT..... and when it comes to ILR, I have no idea where I would get info comparing strengths of individual depts. ....so I guess I'll have to give that one to you too.... and no, it was not a joke. I just wasn't thinking along the Hotel and ILR line of departments... I was concentrating more on the kinds of things you'd pretty much find anywhere: math, poli sci, econ, yadda yadda yadda....</p>
<p>and your last question is very good. I have no idea why I wandered over here. It was late at night. And, I dunno... I just happened to be here. And like I mentioned, that thing I read in Time was a bing instigator, cause I was personally very annoyed at how such a widely-known school like Cornell handled such a thing... I was truly appaled... so I think when I was here and saw this theard, I was compelled to contribute. Nevertheless, as I admitted, my initial post was more anger-filled than anything else... but I think im slowly coming around to actually make this a productive thread... after all, in any thread like this, someone has to play the devil's advocate, right?</p>
<p>Engineering = #1 out of all of the Ivies </p>
<p>Hotel = THE best </p>
<p>ILR I'd say #1 cuz I know it was the 1st school to include this major and I know of no others that could compete!</p>
<p>Arch...I donno I'd say we are way up there on the rankings...</p>
<p>But anyways, I know where you are coming from because you can relate to these people and you can't help but imagining that this was you. Just realize that the school did what it thought was best + it has an extremely low suicide rate; it is obviously doing something right. Letting this girl have some time away from college isn't exactly the worst thing ever...'</p>
<p>Just do a little research on Cornell. You can take classes in any of these colleges and you can explore and research more than most other universities. Lets just say Cornell is an amazing place!</p>
<p>and I totally agree with that. I have just recently encountered this problem, and I basically missed the last 2 months of school, and that was positive. Yet, througout that time, the school kept in touch just to see how I was doing, and was all in all very supportive... I guess I hoped that a school like Cornell would come closer to that... and in regards to the engineering thing, NO DOUBT ABOUT YOUR COMMENT. Cornell, by far, has the best engineering dept. out of all the ivies. But would going to the best Ivy engineering dept. justify turning down the "overall" best engineering school simply because it wasn't founded that long ago?</p>
<p>Cornell... an amazing place? NO DOUBT. I think its important to note that we are discussing the difference between a Ferrari, Porsche, Lamborghini, RR...</p>
<p>It's kinda hard to answer the original post since any response would take several pages. He could easily just search through this board for information or ask specific questions; we have no idea how to respond because we don't know anything about him. </p>
<p>
[quote]
Compared to its fellow Ivy league schools, or other highly reputable universities, I find little that would attract someone TO Cornell over other top 25 schools.
[/quote]
So what does Cornell have that the other top schools don't? Are you seriously asking this question? Let's see...theres the best school for hospitality in the world, arguably the best architecture program in the world, one of the best engineering programs in the nation (MIT/Caltech are clearly better but it can be argued that Cornell is as good as or even better than any of the others, especially when specific departments are considered), departments comparable and in some cases superior (though sometimes inferior) to any other top school in Arts and Science, and specialized fields in Human Ecology and Industrial and Labor Relations (schools within Cornell that you'll be hard-pressed to find at other top colleges). Within each of these schools, you'll find specific strengths (and weaknesses) compared to other schools; if those strengths align with what an applicant wants, then it'd be easy to see why he/she would choose Cornell. There is so many unique qualities about Cornell that it would take pages upon pages to address all of them and I doubt you'd actually care anyway.</p>
<p>
[quote]
When I mentioned the comment about the size, I wanted simply to point out that it will prob. not offer the small environment that other colleges in big research universities can provide, and that it also wasn't big enough to provide the atmosphere some people desire when they go to state universities.
[/quote]
That's another reason why Cornell is great. You can either that small school atmosphere at any top LAC and you can find that big research university-ness at any strong state school. Cornell takes the aspects of both of these schools and blends them together. At Cornell, you get the benefits of being able to meet new people all the time, of having diversity both in fields of study and in peoples' backgrounds, yet at the same time vast faculty resourses and research opportunities, a combination you may not get at either end of the "size spectrum." With just a little effort, you can easily find your niche here and get the feeling of a close-knit community while still staying relatively anonymous if you so choose. </p>
<p>
[quote]
When I mentioned the WSJ figures (which I think are very good indicators of what happens to a university's graduates - mind you im saying this with my school being ranked 14th) I tried showing that it is very lackluster when it comes to getting kids into top grad programs - most of which are in other Ivy league schools.
[/quote]
I've already explained why the WSJ rankings should not be taken as seriously with Cornell. To rehash: many Cornellians are majoring in somewhat vocational departments i.e. they PLAN (even before coming to college) to NOT go to any sort of graduate school but rather directly into their respective industries. If you look at the raw numbers going to top grad schools, Cornell is easily comparable with any other school; its just that a smaller percentage of Cornellians would even want to go to these grad schools.</p>
<p>
[quote]
When you consider strength of departments, I fail to see a field of study which Cornell is superior to any other university.
[/quote]
See above. Though I don't know much about most of the departments, I know that Cornell's Applied Physics department is among the best in the nation (I almost went into this major).</p>
<p>
[quote]
What I think IS indicative is the quote someone from the university offered TIME when asked about why they hadn't contacted the student after she had left the school, not even to see how she was doing.
[/quote]
I'll bet you'll find this at almost any other school. Bureaucracy is the same thing everywhere.</p>
<p>
[quote]
I want to say something to those who truly want to gloat about the fact that Cornell is sooo much more competitive than Chicago
[/quote]
I don't recall anyone bashing Chicago's selectivity, at least not in this thread. Even if they did, I'll be one of the first people to call them uninformed; I have a great respect for your university. But now who's the defensive one?</p>
<p>
[quote]
And, if Chicago were soo easy to get into, I'd like someone to explain to me why the entering class has an SAT average above half of the ivies, including <em>gasp</em> your wonderful Cornell University.
[/quote]
This is simple. If you take out the students of specialized programs not offered at most other universities, you'll find Cornell's SAT range around the same as any other college's. Chicago's SAT range is 1350-1530 (princetonreview.com). Cornell Arts is 1320-1510 and Engineering is 1340-1510, not that much lower than Chicago. I'm not going to deny that there are some people here are dumb, but then again I'll bet there are some dumb people at Chicago too.
<a href="http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf</a></p>
<p>
[quote]
I should also point this out: I don't want to offend anyone.
[/quote]
You definitely have offended people. If you're going to talk about a school, mention both the good and the bad, not just the flaws. The tone of your original post is what made people respond the way they did. </p>
<p>
[quote]
All im trying to do is to hash out what's actually true of Cornell so that one kid can make his own conclusions.
[/quote]
You may have mentioned things that, in your mind, were the problems of Cornell, but due to your own ignorance about our beloved school, you also failed to "hash out what's actually true." I've refuted all of those original points. I think that if you're going to criticize a school, you should at least be informed about all of your information.</p>
<p>I realize that this post took too long to type up and I've probably repeated what a bunch of other people have said but oh well...</p>
<p>
[quote]
But would going to the best Ivy engineering dept. justify turning down the "overall" best engineering school simply because it wasn't founded that long ago?
[/quote]
How much better is MIT, though? I'll agree that it definitely is better, but some people just like the environment at Cornell more and would choose to have a happier college experience (for them) instead of slightly more prestige.</p>
<p>Regarding all the "mainstream" departments: they're really all the same. How much more information could you learn at Harvard or Princeton that you couldn't learn at Cornell, especially as an undergraduate? The information is all the same...just go where you'd feel most comfortable.</p>
<p>YES this was a great post... here I think is the first time someone outlined the unique aspects of Cornell:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>The WSJ article: I see where you are going with your analysis, and I think one could accept it without much hesitation. When going through the depts, the ones that stood out were the hospitality and the ILR concentrations, which I'm sure yield very few grad students...</p></li>
<li><p>The SAT scores: this I'm quite confused about this. We did establish that the ILR and Hospitality schools/depts were the ones which were the best in the country... unquestionably so... but how can you use that as a bonus, yet still claim that, when it comes to analyzing student profile data, you should segregate these people from the rest of the university?</p></li>
<li><p>The size: Well, I guess you can look at it that way. I, however, just see it in a no-man's land when it comes to size.. although I can see how a select number of people would find it just right..</p></li>
</ul>
<p>I'd like to go back to the quality/focus of the departments a bit... since the examples you cited were applied phys, ILR, and Hospitality, can we generalize this by saying that Cornell might be a place in which you'd see a higher percentage of people interested in applied sciences rather than an overwhelming focus on theoretical work? (I know I phrased this in an awkward way, but I think you get what I'm saying)</p>