<p>Kids self-select their friendship groups at school. In my experience, the kids who are participating in honors and AP classes at our public school tend to be a much more serious and academically-oriented group than the general population at area private schools. A mature and self-motivated high school student need not be “protected” from sharing hallways and classroom with kids who can’t afford private schools. Primarily it’s only parents of less mature and more easily led students who really need to worry about their kids partying with or being distracted by the “problem” kids. </p>
<p>@EllieMom I agree. But there’s really no way to guarantee which your child will be. So why take the risk if you can afford not to? There’s no reset button on life. If your daughter starts sneaking off with some slacker petty drug dealer, you can’t rewind two years and not put her in the algebra II course she met him in.</p>
<p>“Primarily it’s only parents of less mature and more easily led students who really need to worry about their kids partying with or being distracted by the “problem” kids.”</p>
<p>But what if that slacker kid is your neighbor in the suburbs who is stealing mommy & daddy’s prescription narcotics & buying heroine to share with your child? Often times, it’s the sheep that we must be careful of. </p>
<p>DD grew up/went to catholic school with several kids who live in the suburbs and go to fine schools. They are the biggest drinkers/druggies, slackers while the kids from the inner city are great kids and going on to do wonderful things in the fall. My daughter included.</p>
<p>@ellen3 - That’s the whole point. They aren’t religious nuts! Catholic schools are about handing down our faith, values and traditions to the next generation.These parents couldn’t care less about all that - some of them are even highly critical of it. All they care about is the fact that it’s the “in” thing at our local country club. So-called “riff-raff” doesn’t enter into the equation, since these parents live in wealty attendance areas and even if they didn’t, our distract has an open transfer policy under which parents can send their children to the public school of their choice as long as they provide transportation and both principals agree to the transfer. </p>
<p>Lots of good points here. First and foremost, not all private/public schools fit into anyone’s box. In general, I wouls say the average private is going to result in a better overall experience than the average public, but your results may and most likely will vary.</p>
<p>My kids have all done Catholic K-8. S1 just graduated from and D1 is attending our local zoned public HS. We have exemplary (a Texas school rating) public schools, but there is a decided difference between the students who went to the Catholic school and those who went to public. The public school kids are more prepared for music and sports than the Catholic school kids in our case. Academically, the private school kids run circles around most of the public school kids. </p>
<p>Only about 10 kids from S1’s 8th grade class went to this public HS. The HS class is about 650. 2 of the 5 NMF’s from the HS came from the 10 kids that went to private school. </p>
<p>Ultimately to me, the private school is worth it as an investment in our kids both financially and morally. For us in re-inforced our faith and gave the kids a great foundation. (though many of the kids at Catholic school are not Catholic themselves). The kids learned how to learn and work and were held to a high standard of decorum and respect.</p>
<p>All of that being said. Our experience with Catholic HS is quite different. My brother graduated from one. I coached at another. Many relatives through many more. The running joke is that private school kids in HS just have access to better drugs and alcohol than in public school. The same problems persist and given the higher cost of the HS tuition, fewer ‘middle-class’ people send their kids there. The Church is still very charitable despite what some people may think and there tend to be a lot of poor kids and kids from various cultures in the Catholic HSs. Many of the ‘establishment’ families at the Catholic HSs of which I am aware think of the schools as their domain and tend to drive a bit of an elitist culture.</p>
<p>@Bestfriendsgirl We have access to what is a top 5 public school in the state (on every list). There is still riff-raff at the schools. It’s not a high net worth thing, it’s just a valuing education and cultivating a successful ethos thing. If a parent seeks out privates, especially in a good area, it’s because these parents are placing tremendous emphasis on education. The ethos of these families is stronger, on average, than the public. That’s just a fact. I assure you it’s not an “in” thing, it’s about surrounding your children with a higher concentration of ambitious and structured students and caring faculty, period.</p>
<p>“All they care about is the fact that it’s the “in” thing at our local country club. So-called “riff-raff” doesn’t enter into the equation, since these parents live in wealthy attendance areas and even if they didn’t, our distract has an open transfer policy under which parents can send their children to the public school of their choice as long as they provide transportation and both principals agree to the transfer.”</p>
<p>In my experience, if there’s one thing a good education–public or private–will teach your kids is that it’s unwise to make sweeping generalizations about people based on their income levels (rich or poor), religious affiliation, or where they attend school.</p>
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<p>I chose to sacrifice a lot to send my kid to Quaker schools (for a variety of reasons I discussed up-thread), but I was never under the delusion that drugs are only an issue in public schools. We just had a huge scandal in the area over a couple of elite private school-educated drug traffickers setting up shop in the region:</p>
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<p><a href=“Inquirer.com: Philadelphia local news, sports, jobs, cars, homes”>Inquirer.com: Philadelphia local news, sports, jobs, cars, homes;
<p>Haverford School, Haverford College, Lafayette College . . . .Lower Merion, Conestoga and Radnor School Districts . . . all would fit the definition of “elite” in most circles. Don’t kid yourself that you can buy your way away from “riff-raff.”</p>
<p>Ellen – no white collar criminals or trust fund dummies at your school? Cause my kids go to an old and well known private HS and there’s still riff raff of a very dangerous variety – the wealthy kind. Otherwise, I agree with most of your points. In my opinion, thru 12th grade, the main determinant of a public or private schools’ quality is not it’s endowment, facilities or staff; it’s the degree of parental involvement. </p>
<p>I find the assumption that private school kids do not use or deal drugs to be naive in the extreme. I certainly hope no parent is shelling over tuition money in this mistaken belief. There are many reasons to choose private for one’s children but the avoidance of drugs and alcohol is not one of them.</p>
<p>My kids go to well known, very old private and there most certainly are drugs being used and being dealt unfortunately. I went to a less academic private (not by choice exactly, but it was expedient), and while I loved it, I can say there were boatloads of drugs. More money, easier access to drugs. That being said, the kids doing and even dealing the drugs are still very academically oriented. In fact a couple who were just disciplined for drug infractions are in all AP classes, etc with very high SATs. Drug and alcohol use isn’t really confined to a particular type of kid. However, I think in private school, there are very few who aren’t motivated . . .so the atmosphere does feel different in that regard. There’s no perfect answers.</p>
<p>And you’ll see the same exact thing in the very tip top colleges - - plenty of alcohol and drug use and abuse. </p>
<p>I typed but one random example and y’all have blown it out of proportion. Not once did I say there aren’t drug users or pushers at private schools. Fact of the matter is that involved parents produce conditioned teens, more often than not. And parents at privates are generally more involved.</p>
<p>“Cause my kids go to an old and well known private HS and there’s still riff raff of a very dangerous variety – the wealthy kind.”</p>
<p>Yep, so did I. There were and still are plenty of toxic, anti-intellectual values celebrated at my elite private school, if you ask me. Lots of attention paid to personal appearance and displays of wealth, all under a veneer of inclusion and acceptance.</p>
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<p>Apparently, at least one person thinks it is a problem in his own case:
<a href=“The American Scholar: The Disadvantages of an Elite Education - <a href='https://theamericanscholar.org/author/william-deresiewicz/'>William Deresiewicz</a>”>http://theamericanscholar.org/the-disadvantages-of-an-elite-education/</a></p>
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<p>Around here, the academically good private schools are often over $30,000 per year at the high school level (non-boarding). The Catholic ones are less expensive, usually around half of that.</p>
<p>Also, plenty of those $30,000+ a year privates offer generous financial aid. It’s not unlike selective LACs–the most competiive (or “elite” if you prefer) often have the largest endowments and thus can offer generous FA to top students regardless of their family income.</p>
<p>What’s interesting is the reason we moved D1 from our public school to private was the public school lacked diversity. We lived in a rather wealthy town, 90+% students were white. Some students were giving D1 a hard time because she was biracial. D1 felt a lot more at home after she was transferred to the private. The school had a lot more Asians, blacks, and students with different religious background. The school drew students from 30+ miles radius.</p>
<p>Great article, ucbalumnus! Thanks for sharing. I think his observations were fascinating and persuasive though I don’t really “get” the inability to talk to people from a different background. I would suggest that has more to do with having a low EQ to go with that high IQ. However, I do think the current educational system rewards a very particular intelligence, probably to some detriment to society. Fascinating editorial that made me think!</p>
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<p>My mother and grandmother always said there are certain types of people you’re better off not associating with, and pretentious, arrogant, narrowminded, judgmental people ranked right up there with liars, cheaters, and backstabbers. Using the word “crappy,” for instance, would have been enough to raise my grandmother’s eyebrow, so perhaps you and your friends are not so refined and above the hoi polloi as you like to imagine.</p>
<p>Children with “unmotivated, uninvolved parents (who do) drugs, (get) crappy grades, (and have) discipline or legal issues” are everywhere; those problems cut across all economic levels. It’s naive to believe otherwise.</p>