Is there really such a thing as "safety" school these days?

[sevmom]

<p>UVa also is not really a safety for anyone. </p>

[whenhen]

<p>I find it incredibly hard to believe that a 35 ACT 3.9 GPA student was rejected by SLO considering admission there is almost entirely formula based. </p>

[Daddio3]

<p>And worse yet, what if your safety has Case Syndrome (formerly Tufts Syndrome). Case has taken to wait-listing a lot of their high-stat applicants (after soliciting them to apply no less)!</p>

<p><a href=“Thread for Waitlisted Student -- please post a summary of stats and Financial Aid Y/N - Case Western Reserve University - College Confidential Forums”>Thread for Waitlisted Student -- please post a summary of stats and Financial Aid Y/N - Case Western Reserve University - College Confidential Forums;

[blossom]

<p>People, in the age of Internet, how hard is it to show the love? I don’t think you need to shlep to Cleveland or Boston and hang out in front of the admissions office to profess your love of Case or Tufts. But in the space of ten minutes, a kid can bang out an email to the regional adcom to ask a question (make sure it’s not something that appears on the landing page of the college website), follow up with a request for information about the debating team or intramural diving competition, and make sure that their email address isn’t something like “WannagotoHarvard”. It’s not that hard, and although I’m seeing a lot of cases of Tufts syndrome in my neck of the woods (none from Tufts yet- but from other colleges) I really think that a HS senior who can’t be bothered to “show interest” in some low cost, low intensity way probably shouldn’t be getting accepted to these colleges.</p>

<p>And my advice is completely different for a kid who actually lives a city bus ride away from one of these colleges. Get yourself up the steps, pay your $2, and actually show up for an info session if you live in one of these cities. If I were an Adcom at Tufts and saw a kid who lived in Brookline or Newton who couldn’t be bothered to spend an afternoon checking out my campus-- or showed up and didn’t bother to sign in at the admissions office- I would absolutely be questioning the kids interest in my college.</p>

<p>You don’t have to fly from Los Angeles. But get on the damn bus.</p>

[2018dad]

<p>

@whenhen

I find it incredibly hard to believe that a 35 ACT 3.9 GPA student was rejected by SLO considering admission there is almost entirely formula based.

You better believe it. SLO accepts by major and some majors have an acceptance rate of 11-15%. See these rejected kids (in their own words, they were embarrassed and humiliated):</p>

<p><a href=“****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1699 by DogeBoi - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums”>****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1699 by DogeBoi - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums;
<a href=“****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1727 by alphanerd - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums”>****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1727 by alphanerd - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums;
<a href=“****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1670 by parkreation - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums”>****official cal poly slo class of 2018 decisions**** - #1670 by parkreation - Cal Poly San Luis Obispo - College Confidential Forums;

[Pizzagirl]

<p>“PG, is this related to admission to specific majors? Otherwise, I find it unbelievable. Unless the kid has an arrest record or some serious academic infraction.”</p>

<p>Well, I’m sitting here in Illinois, and you’re 1000 miles away - and I’m doubting your friends and acquaintances are applying to UIUC. You’re just going to have to trust me (or not - your choice) that UIUC is not the safety even for the high-stats in-state kid the way it was 15, 20 years ago. There are enough head-scratching how-come-he-didn’t-get-in cases around here, and it’s very clear that they are very interested in upping the under-represented portions of the state, which have to come out of the hides of Chicagoland kids, particularly affluent / North Shore. Whether that’s right or wrong is another topic, but that’s what it is. </p>

<p>As someone who grew up in the East, I didn’t fully understand til I moved out here what a very different role “State Flagship U” plays in the system. </p>

[SlitheyTove]

<p>Showing love isn’t a guarantee either. An anecdote: D2 had Lewis and Clark on her list. Her stats were well in range, we are full pay. She visited (from SoCal, so not just hopping on the bus), loved the school, had an interview during the visit that she thought went very well. She applied EA, regarding the school as her #2 choice. Last year, L&C’s admit rate from EA was IIRC around 80% (!) so I figured this one was in the bag. Yet she was deferred. She was admitted ED to Pitzer so the L&C adcoms got it right </p>

<p>I’m wondering if SLO is taking a lot more kids during ED. Those rejections are pretty jaw-dropping–it’ll be interesting to see how the overall admissions statistics (# of applications, acceptance rate, yield) shake out. </p>

[mathmom]

<p>

I don’t think you need to shlep to Cleveland or Boston and hang out in front of the admissions office to profess your love of Case or Tufts. But in the space of ten minutes, a kid can bang out an email to the regional adcom to ask a question (make sure it’s not something that appears on the landing page of the college website), follow up with a request for information about the debating team or intramural diving competition, and make sure that their email address isn’t something like “WannagotoHarvard”.

And you write your essays talking about active citizenship, and you don’t say you want to major in business or whatever other major the school doesn’t have. I really think this is where kids fall down - they don’t tweak their applications to fit the schools. I do know of one kid who was apparently waitlisted at GW for not visiting. (The GC called assured them it was the first choice and she got off the waitlist.) </p>

[LucieTheLakie]

<p>

A student who insists on a small school may have a harder time finding an academically appropriate safety, since a small school may have too few top-end outliers to be worth offering appropriate courses for those students.

</p>

<p>That’s exactly why finding the Safety You Love is problematic for high-stats STEM students. It makes a lot more sense (to us anyway) to attend an excellent state flagship than opt for a LAC, even a selective one, that isn’t topnotch in STEM fields. But for the handful that are, I would argue they are the best of both worlds for the student who historically has thrived in a smaller school setting. And just today another headline is out suggesting that it’s a not unwise approach:</p>

<p>

A report being released today by the Council of Independent Colleges, “Strengthening the STEM Pipeline: The Contributions of Small and Mid-Sized Independent Colleges,” argues that such colleges make a disproportionate contribution to efforts to build up the American work force in science and technology. The report notes that many people assume research universities are the key sector for promoting STEM education. But on a per capita basis, the report argues, small private colleges deserve more support for STEM education.

</p>

<p>Read more: <a href=“http://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2014/03/17/report-documents-success-small-private-colleges-stem#ixzz2wKu2BvKr”>http://www.insidehighered.com/quicktakes/2014/03/17/report-documents-success-small-private-colleges-stem#ixzz2wKu2BvKr&lt;/a&gt;
Inside Higher Ed </p>

[Data10]

<p>

My D’s friend was accepted at Cornell and waitlisted at: BC, Bowdoin, Bates and Colby, and Lehigh (her safety!), rejected from Brown. Another friend was accepted at NYU, rejected from Syracuse (her safety!). One more friend accepted at Cornell and rejected from Lehigh!</p>

<p>I guess a “safety” is never a guarantee. In the above cases, safeties were determined based on a lot of data including Naviance.One more friend accepted at Cornell and rejected from Lehigh!

Perhaps those students did not play the “level of applicant’s interest” game at Leigh?

</p>

<p>Yes, Lehigh is a poor choice for a safety because they are very concerned about whether the student is likely to attend. This fits with Lehigh marking level of interest as important in the CDS. The article at <a href=“http://articles.philly.com/2013-04-01/news/38165511_1_admissions-placement-courses-high-school-students”>Inquirer.com: Philadelphia local news, sports, jobs, cars, homes; discusses experiences with admissions officers reviewing applications at Lehigh. The quote below mentions rejecting applicants with near perfect SATs (and likely other stats, such as GPA) because they thought the applicants were unlikely to attend. Consistent with this, scattergrams for Lehigh suggest that applicants with near perfect stats seem as likely to be rejected or waitlisted as to be accepted.</p>

<p>

An applicant from Schuylkill County with a 1600 and otherwise stellar record had one flaw - he never visited Lehigh. Students who visit often end up enrolling. Those who don’t rarely do, Washington said.</p>

<p>The university would rather give that spot to someone who genuinely seems interested, which also has the potential to raise the “yield” - the percentage of students offered admission who enroll. For Lehigh, that percentage is typically 33 percent, compared with 38 percent nationally.</p>

<p>The staff offered admission to the 1600 student, but some others with similar scores were cut.

</p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p>

@SlitheyTove

I’m wondering if SLO is taking a lot more kids during ED. Those rejections are pretty jaw-dropping–it’ll be interesting to see how the overall admissions statistics (# of applications, acceptance rate, yield) shake out.

</p>

<p>Looks like the high stats rejects at CPSLO tend to be concentrated in popular majors like biomedical engineering, computer science or engineering, etc…</p>

<p>Overall acceptance rate for CPSLO will be very misleading since admission is by major. Even within engineering, it appears that some like biomedical engineering are much more popular than others like industrial engineering.</p>

[Consolation]

<p>I’ve noticed in those CA rejections there is some controversy whether one kid was a ■■■■■, and some of the others claimed invalid GPAs. </p>

[MamaBear16]

<p>@SlithyTove – your post is a good example of what worries me. I don’t think admission to a “safety” can be considered safe anymore. We are in CA, and the stats needed for STEM kids for CalPolySLO and the UCs (like Davis) make me concerned. </p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p><a href=“http://info.sjsu.edu/static/admission/impaction.html”>http://info.sjsu.edu/static/admission/impaction.html&lt;/a&gt; shows how the admission thresholds for different majors can vary considerably at schools which admit by major.</p>

<p>The CSU eligibility index for frosh admissions is calculated as described here:
<a href=“Cal State Apply | CSU”>Cal State Apply | CSU;
using high school GPA as calculated as described here:
<a href=“Cal State Apply | CSU”>Cal State Apply | CSU;

[MamaBear16]

<p>@ucb – thanks for the link. It says ALL majors are impacted, but at least it does show a tangible number required for admission per major.</p>

[PolarBearVsShark]

<p>I guess there’s nothing wrong with loving your safety school. But what girl is going to choose Scott Speedman over Matthew McConaghhhggheee?</p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p>

@PolarBearVsShark

I guess there’s nothing wrong with loving your safety school.

</p>

<p>There was a thread not too long ago where the OP’s kid’s first choice was a safety for admissions, easily affordable, and an excellent school for his intended major<em>. The OP of that thread was trying to get the kid to consider other schools… and the thread did last a few pages with many other suggestions of other schools, although many did not seem to make much sense (either significantly more expensive, or limited offerings in his intended major</em>). Perhaps the idea of loving one’s safety school is so unusual around these forums that most people who post here do not believe it could possibly be true.</p>

<p>*Student was an intended math major who was very advanced in math already.</p>

[HImom]

<p>Our S had decided as a soph or JR that his safety was USoCal. I told him I didn’t really agree that it was a safety (as we’d be hard-pressed to pay if he was admitted but they offered NO $$$, plus NO guarantee of admission), but we agreed to disagree. Turned out he was right and he happily matriculated there with the generous merit he received and got his BEE. His lab partner who was admitted to UPenn was denied at USC but attended Boston U with good merit & FAid, so figuring out what is a good safety that the student loves and can afford is sometimes a challenge.</p>

[ucbalumnus]

<p>USC is a safety for no one, but he is fortunate that he got in with enough scholarships, sparing him the shut-out experience.</p>

[mathmom]

<p>A STEM student who would prefer a small LAC may have to make some compromises - either in academic level, by doing an honors college in a bigger university, or one of the smaller technical institutes. Both the large university and the tech institute will probably provide the academics they are looking for.</p>