Isn't college supposed to be about me ?

Parent Cafe
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<p>would you restrict your child from going to a dream school just for "security" reasons (school's in LA--USC),distance reasons or because "undergrad doesn't matter" ?.</p>

<p>My father has shot down my idea/dream of going to a top-notch university, just because it's in LA (parents currently live in Mississippi). he says it's unsafe (he has never even been to the university, nor does he know anything about it), is too far and "undergrad doesn't matter"... My brother went to college also in California (davis) and he was able to handle it, but now he won't let me make my own decisions regarding this...</p>

<p>Isn't college supposed to be about what I want ?, why is he so determined to send me to the crappy state school when I can aspire to a better education ?. He says undergrad doesn't matter, but I'm a business major and usually undergrad DOES matter. A good school will let you get a good job (top-MBA material) and make acquaintances for your future professional plans.</p>

<p>He likes the idea of me working as hard as I do (3.95 GPA in the first 2 years) and getting into a top-notch MBA eventually as is the plan. However, he has the idea of me getting into such programs attending MS state university and then managing the local auto dealer/wal-mart as my work experience. He says I won't stay here in MS after graduation just because I attend the state school, but I have seen it with my brother... He graduated from a good university for his major, came home to visit my parents and stay a couple of months and then couldn't leave afterwards cause all the job offerings gave preference to local people so they wouldn't have to pay relocation fees and all that stuff...</p>

<p>I really don't know what to tell him, or how to deal with all this, since he'll be paying for part of my undergraduate studies...I won't stress out over it yet, since I haven't gotten accepted into the university yet and maybe I won't, but I think he's being extremely selfish in not even listening to my reasons to attend such university. He's just worried about how HE'S going to feel... " i'll be worried", "i won't see you too often", "I" this and "I" that. He hasn't asked me once "how do YOU feel about this..." or "why do YOU want to attend this university", or "what is appealing to YOU from this university..."... I didn't know he was also going to be attending college with me...</p>

<p>Thanks for reading my post and hopefully getting some insight from parents dealing with this issue at the moment.</p>

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<p>Sometimes parents speak in code. It may be that money is a real concern. I'd check that out before anything else.</p>

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<p>"would you restrict your child from going to a dream school just for "security" reasons (school's in LA--USC),distance reasons or because "undergrad doesn't matter" ?."</p>

<p>Not as long as he (the child) were paying for it. Cur also has a good possibility.</p>

4

<p>thanks for the responses so far. I also thought it was due to financial reasons, but I made it clear to him long time ago, I would be applying to plenty of schools, but if the FA package wasn't good or they came up with a lame package, that I wasn't going to take out tons of loans, nor ask him to just to attend that specific university... </p>

<p>I even told him the same thing again that I understood the financial aspect perfectly fine and wasn't going to be into financial hell just to attend a specific university. All his talk was concerning distance and security though, nothing regarding Financial issues...</p>

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<p>
[quote]
nothing regarding Financial issues...

[/quote]
</p>

<p>but

[quote]
because "undergrad doesn't matter"

[/quote]
Herein lies the secret code (maybe). UG doesn't matter ...is what he verbalizes....enough to pay more than an instate school would cost you might be what he means. Distance is also money or it can be, BTW. LA to Mississippi ain't cheap. ($360 from Dallas to Memphis, for us. Ouch.)</p>

<p>Security concerns? There is data on that readily available. Find it and feed it to him , compare it to your state schools.</p>

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<p>I think the ideal is a college selection process in which the family can share their thinking and respect the views of the others. While I might not share your father's concerns about Los Angeles, I think the concerns could be legitimate fodder for discussion.</p>

<p>The issue of finances is complex. There's a question of value. To sell your parents, you would have to make a case that a particular university is enough better than the local option to justify perhaps four times the cost. Can that case be made? Maybe, maybe not.</p>

<p>BTW, how can you be a business major in high school? That statement tells me that perhaps neither you nor your father have gotten to the real nitty gritty of what college is all about, yet!</p>

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<p>enough to pay more than an instate school would cost you might be what he means.</p>

<p>good point, but how can he be so closed-minded when I haven't even gotten the FA package yet ?. If it comes out to be crap and I have to pay 3X or 4X more than the state school, I won't push it. But he hasn't even waited for my acceptance letter before shooting the idea down and getting ****ed off about it...</p>

<p>Distance is also money or it can be, BTW. LA to Mississippi ain't cheap.</p>

<p>agreed too, but that's figured into the budget with which the school determines your package (or so the lady told me when i called them). They consider books, transportation, room and board, tuition, fees, etc. when giving out the financial aid packages. I will also be working for the remainder of this semester and in the summer, so I can help with the misc. expenses that can arise.</p>

<p>I think the ideal is a college selection process in which the family can share their thinking and respect the views of the others. While I might not share your father's concerns about Los Angeles, I think the concerns could be legitimate fodder for discussion.</p>

<p>That's what I've been trying to do, but he just doesn't listen to what I have to say. My mom is much more understanding and easy to talk to. What I don't understand is, if he has so many concerns regarding all these issues, why doesn't he talk to me about it or let me know about it, instead of just shooting down the idea and getting all ****y like that...</p>

<p>BTW, how can you be a business major in high school?</p>

<p>i'm not in HS, i'm in a CC as he wished when I graduated high school.</p>

<p>That statement tells me that perhaps neither you nor your father have gotten to the real nitty gritty of what college is all about, yet!</p>

<p>what do you mean ?, could you elaborate on this?</p>

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<p>Here are a few parent-management suggestions:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Ask in advance to have a conversation about it when everyone feels like talking it over. Include your Mom if she's part of your family. Tell them you want to present your ideas to them in a mature way at that time, after which you'll just leave them to think about it all. It'll be like a business presentation of a new concept. Assure them they only need to listen and they don't have to come "armed and ready." It's not to argue, it's to present. Your maturity will stun them, I hope. Tell them it'll be like coming to see you in a school play, but in your living room.</p></li>
<li><p>Bring some info with you (research ahead-of-time) on the cost of plane fares to and from Mississipi to LA. Use Expedia, look waaay in advance for best fares b/c you'd know well ahead when you're flying (them, too, for visits!) so you'd get good fares.</p></li>
<li><p>Pick some professions on the US Dept of Labor website and research the stats on median incomes. THen try to compare what you could be earning in Missisippi vs. LA for the same professions. Pick a few you might do someday.</p></li>
<li><p>Show them that, with the better salary earned out-of-state and plane fares, you'd be able to visit each other more often than they now imagine.
Heck, you could even send them tickets sometimes. </p></li>
<li><p>Look up threads on CC about USC; I know it's been said to be in or near a rough neighborhood, but find out from the insider view of students what that really means to them when they live on campus. If what you read troubles YOU, look at UCLA or other places where the neighborhoods are different than USC. (I'm not from there so I don't know what's real. I know sometimes it's the parents who object more to a neighborhood than the kids. My own son lives at the edge of Harlem on near Columbia U. in NYC and handles things just fine, even though it took ME awhile to get used to it. After I spent a weekend with him at his apartment, though, I decided 125th St. was a very good place to live for reasons I hadn't previously understood but make sense to a local citizen of NY, for example, "proximity to an express subway station" linking him to the entire city in l0 minutes time. You have to understand a city's safety factor from the insider view. Try to research that.)</p></li>
<li><p>With plane travel, it's not about how many miles away you live but how much time it takes & money to get there. This is VERY hard for parents to understand if they live a life based on car travel within rural or small-city states. Instead of talking about miles to LA, express it in how much TIME it'll take to be at each others' doorstep. Tell them that's the way it is today with air travel. Also, it's based on market (many users=lower costs) and not miles, how much they charge for tickets. </p></li>
<li><p>Tell them that you love them, many times, and that you don't want to get away from them but hope to have a big canvas on which to paint your life, which will INCLUDE them always. Promise to come home for Christmas, to work summers at home. Promise that whenever they come to visit you, you'll sleep over at a friend's house and they can stay in your dorm or apt if that helps them save motel money. (They'll probably never take you up on it, but at least they know you're thinking of them inclusively in your plans.)</p></li>
<li><p>YOu said they "live in Missisippi now." Did that mean they moved there from somewhere? Remind them if it's appropriate that they also needed geographic mobility in their lives, probably job-related. That's why most people move. And the time has come for you to assess your life and find the best life and job, so a bit of mobility to the coast would give you those optiions. Remind them how they felt when they needed to move for the economics of it; you have come to that same crossroads in your thinking as a young man considering his future.</p></li>
<li><p>Then let them go away and think about it; if they want to talk right then, fine, but agree ahead of time that neither of you-all will argue or whine while discussing.</p></li>
<li><p>I don't know your folks. If it degenerates into a fight, after all your effort, don't get upset, just say, "I am trying to bring some information to the table, that's all. Let's not fight. Let's stop for now." And end the meeting. Don't try to win at one meeting. Remember, you called it so you can adjourn it. </p></li>
<li><p>See if they want to pick a time for a second conversation about what you've brought them, after they've thought about it. Point out that you're doing your very best to be mature and considerate of their feelings.</p></li>
<li><p>I'm hoping that your folks will see you in a new, mature, considerate light and will open up a bit to your ideas. Understand that they don't want to see their boys all over the country, wish they had grandchildren nearby, and have money issues you don't know about. So love them for that, but still try to make your case. </p></li>
<li><p>If this doesn't sound like it can happen in your household, maybe you can adapt a few of the ideas. In our home, we do this for important decisions(call a family meeting).</p></li>
</ol>

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<p>It seems to me that the time to make your case, since it doesn't seem to be going well at the moment, is after your acceptances and you see what the finaid is. ( I'm assuming you have already applied?) USC may come through with a good deal, and if so, you may find his objections soften a bit. </p>

<p>It's hard on parents when their kids are leaving the nest - especially so far away. Try to be calm and understanding. There may be emotional reasons that even he hasn't dealt with yet. These may be surfacing as "safety issues" when he might feel that way even if you wanted to go to Dartmouth. Los Angeles is far away and very different from your hometown, and has had a lot of negative publicity, but when you know the area, it really isn't bad. Westwood is a very upscale, safe area, and nothing at all like L.A. Confidential! The area around USC may have more crime, but I think it's manageable and not such a bad thing to learn how negotiate and be safe in city environments. But then I've lived in the greater L.A area most of my life. </p>

<p>Assuming apps are in the mail,it sounds like you should take a step back and wait until you can objectively asses your options. If you haven't actually applied yet, then you need to look into some schools that you might both agree are safe, financially feasible with aid, and still attractive to you. There are so many good colleges- it's hard for me to imagine that you can't find common ground.</p>

<p>And I second paying3 tuitions ideas.</p>

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<p>Great ideas from paying3tuitions. One more thought, though - leave the "it's all about ME" attitude at the door. Remember a couple of things: (1) your parents have been in positions much closer to where you are now than you have been to where they are; and (2) as long as your hand is in his pocket, reaching for his wallet, it's not all about you.</p>

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<p>*YOu said they "live in Missisippi now." Did that mean they moved there from somewhere? *</p>

<p>yeah, we actually lived in california up until the summer between my junior and senior year. My dad went to work in LA a couple of times and he'd stay there for a week at times. I think his biggest problem with LA is the size of the city, all the trouble and including the bad rep it gets, obviously. He had to drive to work when he was down there and he always came back with a negative attitude towards LA, (though I didn't have a problem with it). I don't know if his attitude is based on the fact that he didn't like living there, but I won't be driving around Los Angeles to get to school like he has.</p>

<p>We've been to LA plenty of times, in fact my brother visited schools down there too when he was applying for colleges a while back and they didn't have a problem with it apparently. They even took time off of work to drive him down there and check the schools out (we lived about 5 hours away from LA).</p>

<p>Thanks for those tips though, definitely will try them.</p>

<p>If you haven't actually applied yet, then you need to look into some schools that you might both agree are safe, financially feasible with aid, and still attractive to you. There are so many good colleges- it's hard for me to imagine that you can't find common ground.</p>

<p>I will apply to more schools, as soon as he can talk to me about what's on his mind. He keeps asking me what have I looked into ? (regarding schools) and when I tell him, he just mentions the state school and shoots everything else down without hearing anything about what I tell him.</p>

<p>. One more thought, though - leave the "it's all about ME" attitude at the door.</p>

<p>I understand that and will do. But it's also not all about him and he's trying to make it out like that. He doesn't lose a chance to force feed me the state school despite having already visited it and not liked it at all... He wants me to go there no matter what reason I give him not to.</p>

<p>I understand he will be paying for most of it and thus has a right in the decision-making process, but he doesn't listen to everything I tell him to and only says "LA is too dangerous and too far". As if I was going to live in an apartment by myself in the ghetto part of LA and commute everyday to school on my own through the streets of Los Angeles, and it's not like that...</p>

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<p>So you are in the college search process, and not awaiting results. That makes the whole problem a lot better, and less immediate.</p>

<p>Why don't you put Los Angleles on the sidelines for awhile and look into schools that you might like that address his concerns. There are SO MANY GOOD SCHOOLS!! Once he sees that you are taking his objections seriously, he may listen to your ideas. Right now it seems like the choices are Los Angeles or your state school. Broaden your search. UCLA takes very few out of state kids, anyway, so unless you're at the top of your class, it's not a very realistic option. </p>

<p>Is the issue that you enjoyed living in California, and you want to go back? If so, have you had this conversation with your parents?</p>

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<p>Great job posters, and OP you are doing a good job listening. That is sometimes rare around here. Let some of the great suggestions sink in. Don't discount anything offered just yet.</p>

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<p>well, I've been in the search process for a while now. I do have some other options besides those two, but the one in LA is my top choice by far... I am still going to apply to other schools closer to home and in state (so he doesn't say I didn't even bother applying) to see what's the best choice when the acceptance letters get here and the FA information. I already applied to USC because of the deadline, so technically I'm in both processes...</p>

<p>As for UCLA, I'm not interested in the UC system living out of state, even though yes I'm on top of my class (graduated with a near 4.0 and honors)... I picked USC mostly because of the quality of education, the program I'm studying and due to their so-called "great" FA department. I won't lie, I do want to go back to cali desperately and I have some friends @ USC, this is also a very important factor, but i understand it is not a priority when it comes to a decision of this magnitude. It just seems a bit selfish to me, he'd take that position before even knowing anything about the school...</p>

<p>And yes, parents know about me not being happy here (not fun moving cross-country for your senior year and leaving all your plans behind) but at the moment there's nothing that can be done about it and I understand that as well...</p>

<p>Thanks curmudgeon and to all posts so far, great information.</p>

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<p>Good luck, RijeosXeper. </p>

<p>I'm confused a bit about the USC deadline, though. What year are you applying for? Are you looking at a spring transfer?</p>

<p>You might look into Pomona College or Claremont/McKenna. Pomona has very good finaid - and is not far at all from USC for visits, yet it might be in a town your parents would be more comfortable with. They do accept transfers from CC's and other colleges every fall, I think. My son is a freshman at Pomona, but he has a car there and makes trips into LA occassionally for events - he even spent the night at USC once, visiting friends. He loves California too - I know how it is for us natives. We're pretty spoiled, I'm afraid.
Keep us informed with your progress and let us know how it's going. </p>

<p>We're in your corner, but we're parents too, so it's easier for us to understand your dad's concerns. Best of luck to you!</p>

<p>p.s. One more thought: If your parents understand that you want to move back to Cali eventually, maybe they will see the reason for going to college out here. A school like USC, Pomona ,or any Ca school will give you a Cali network that will help you in the future.
It occurs to me that they know this already, which may be why your dad wants you to go to school in-state--so you will work and stay in-state.
I think the California issue needs to be addressed directly.
But gently! They are probably hoping that at least one of their kids will be around. It's just the way parents are, cause they love you.</p>

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<p>I applied for the Fall of 2007. The deadline was on February 2nd according to their website, so I sent it a bit less than a week before that...</p>

<p>Thanks A.S.A.P. for your words, I know how they feel. I love them too, but eventually they have to let go and let me do my own things... there's many things I want to do and I'm a pretty independent person, so them wanting me to stay here so badly and me wanting to leave so badly doesn't bode really well.</p>

<p>California is almost(if not is) like a paradise compared to MS. I just can't fit in here, it's not my thing. I haven't been able to get used to it in almost 3 years, i will always feel weird and different here. This is not where I belong. You're right though, Cali people are pretty spoiled hehe.</p>

<p>As far as the network goes, I have heard it is indeed very good. Job and grad school placement is something I definitely value when looking for colleges. And to my knowledge USC is pretty strong on both of those...</p>

<p>They have 1 child living with them, my brother. He apparently likes it here (free everything basically, can save up his $$). He is not a very independent person though. I think my parents compare me to him and his college experience since they already went through it with him and expect me to be just like him and do things like he did, but I am COMPLETELY different than him so that spells trouble.</p>

<p>I will await the information to talk to them once I have all the details, in the meantime I'll continue applying to other schools as well. I will keep you posted once I know something for sure. Thanks a lot again!</p>

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<p>I just browsed all the replies, so I may be repeating things here but. . .</p>

<p>There may be unspoken issues that your parents are thinking. For example, are your parents planning to live in MS for the rest of their lives? Maybe, they are thinking that they don't want you to go to a school in Calif because you might fall in love and live in calif indefinitely. . .or maybe they moved to MS because they don't like the atmosphere of Calf and that why they don't want you to "move back". </p>

<p>Sometimes parents say a reason, but there are other reasons they haven't said. It could be financial too--if yu were still living in Calif you'd get the Calif resident rate for the UCs, but now since you live in MS, you wouldn't. . .and out-of-state tuition is even more expensive. If USC is your first choice, well tuition there is over $32,000 and once you add living expenses, its about $45000--quite hefty for almost anyone. </p>

<p>Who is paying for your graduate school costs? If your parents are planning to and if you are aiming for an MBA, your undergraduate school is not nearly as important as the MBA program you eventually will go to. Are you planning for your parents to foot the bill for all 6 years of college? Just some thoughts. . .</p>

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<p>I have no idea what their plans are as far as where to live. I doubt they even know themselves... we moved because of my dad's job, but they never loved the cali atmosphere anyways (too much people, too much traffic, bla bla bla) though I had no problem there, in fact I loved it there just fine.</p>

<p>I think it might have some financial reasons behind this as well. Though I work and will put forth all the money I have, it will obviously not be enough to cover it all... They know it though and I have made it clear that if I don't get a good FA package, I won't take out $90k+ in loans...</p>

<p>As far as graduate school, no I don't intend to have them pay for that. I plan on having as little debt as possible while still attending the best school I can, then working and saving up my own money to pay for graduate studies (another reason I need a good job after college). I'm planning (hopefully everything will go according to plan) to just be independent while I'm in my undergraduate years. Once I get out and can make a living, I will pay for my own stuff and hopefully still have some $$ left to repay my parents some of the money they have put forth with my education.</p>

<p>While tuition and living expenses combined does turn out to be quite hefty, I hope the university can come up with a good package that is affordable... my state school would cost roughly $15k I know it's a pretty big jump from 15k to 44k, but they also have a pathetic FA program. The only aid I'm eligible for (from what they've said when I called) was a state grant worth $1k and a small school grant/scholarship (worth about $4-5kish), that leaves me with around $10k to come up out of the blue, so it's not like I'm going to save tons of money anyways...</p>

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<p>Well, if it helps your argument at all, you can tell them that one of the more anti-USC parents on CC says the safety issue about USC is waaaay overblown and that issue wouldn't lead me to be concerned for a son, daughter, relative, or friend attending.</p>

<p>And while I don't think much of the so-called "Trojan family," I think being in LA in general is a much better life-shaping world-broadening experience than being stuck in Mississippi (a state that I had the good fortune to escape when I was very young)...the economic, business, and cultural comparisons all tilt heavily in SoCal's direction imnsvho. </p>

<p>It sounds as if your Dad had some disappointing experiences, didn't like SoCal therefore, and expects you (out of loyalty? projection?) to feel the same way. Ummm.</p>

<p>If your scores/grades are top, USC may very well offer you good Financial Aid....they tend towards excellent aid for top students.</p>

<p>God help me, it's not often that I encourage someone in the direction of USC but this is one of those times. Maybe I should go and light a candle.</p>

<p>And you're quite right: OOS FinAid for UC students sucks in general.</p>

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<p>


This really frightens me. ;) And rivers will run backwards....</p>