<br>
<blockquote> <p>BTW, Bio/Bio med are where her heart is.</p> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>Do you mean Med school? If so, add on four more years of steep tuition & expenses.</p>
<p>xiggi, There was also a young man on CC whose name escapes me who was accepted to Yale, got a full merit ride to Vandy, and is very happy. If someone remembers his user name, Dad II might find reading about his stats and decision making process quite illuminating.</p>
<p>IMO, if one is going to have a hope of getting the big merit awards at UNC, Duke, Emory, etc., one had better have stats in the TOP of the Ivy pool. That's where the competition is -- those schools are trying to lure amazingly talented folks away from the Ivies. Emory requires a school nomination for its scholarship -- check with the GC now, as the number of school recommendations is limited.</p>
<p>evil robot</p>
<p>his name was evilrobot (or something like that)</p>
<p>I was wondering if Dad II meant biomedical engineering by "Bio med". If so, his daughter might be looking at applying directly to the engineering schools at Wash U and Vanderbilt; if so, the chances for a merit award might be better, particularly since she is female.</p>
<p>evil robot. And don't forget the space in between the two words.</p>
<p>evil robot is (still?) a student in the Engineering School at Vanderbilt, majoring in computer science. This year 12 or 13 students accepted the same deal as evil robot to attend Vanderbilt. They turned down schools like MIT, Carnegie Mellon School of Computer Science, Univ. of Chicago (with a merit scholarship), Washington Univ in order to accept the scholarship at Vanderbilt. So yes, the competition is stiff. On the other hand, the one I know who is among them does not walk on water, and did not have a perfect high school record. He did have a very active EC record with a lot of leadership. His SAT I was 2380 and SAT II were all 780 and 800. High test scores are the first step in the selection.</p>
<p>I did not mention Evil Robot because he no longer posts here. His story was however as compelling as well docuumented on our boards. Thanks for bringing it up. </p>
<p>As far as Dad II, we can safely assume that his D's stats are well within the range of successful candidates at the HYPS. Unfortunately, so are thousands of other kids in the country, including thousands who are slighltly favored by race, athletic and musical talent, or by having simply chosen their parents and birth place wisely. As many other middle class families, the quest of balancing admissions and affording the bills plays a part in the overall picture. </p>
<p>My take on Bio is that it is leading to a career in Medical Research not engineering.</p>
<p>Dad II,
What are your plans for your S's college education? Would you be willing to stretch your finances to send him to a college that is the best match for his academic interests and talents or if he's not HPYS material, will he have to go to State U even if he would prefer, the smaller classes and nurturing environment of a tier 2 LAC?</p>
<p>DadII, I just did a quick-and-dirty analysis of the numbers you gave us for acceptance rates:
Your school's history:
Wash U: 31.8%
UVA: 40.5%
UMich: 46.5%
Vandy: 43.2%</p>
<p>2007 Acceptance rates (per <a href="http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=372043&highlight=2007+acceptance+rate%5B/url%5D">http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/showthread.php?t=372043&highlight=2007+acceptance+rate</a>, with updates numbers at the admissions consultants link within the thread)
WashU: 19%
UVA: 28.2%
Michigan: 45.6%
Vandy" 30%</p>
<p>You get some advantage from the prestigious HS, with the odds even at UMich. Nevertheless, these are not safety schools, even for high-scoring OOS kids, and lots of them will be giving these schools a closer look this year than in previous years.</p>
<p>Yes, as CountingDown indicated, due to the large cohort of college-bound seniors (a number that will increase until about 2011), when it comes to college acceptances, this year will be even more competitive than past years were. You and your D should keep this in mind when she applies.</p>
<p>If she's Asian and/or lives in a state like Calif., take those factors into account, too, as she will not be as desireable an applicant as if she were a URM or lived in a state that is underrepresented at the top colleges. Her interest in biology also will count against her at many schools because many top colleges have an overabundance of applicants planning to go to med school and/or major in biology. If she's interested in engineering, however, that would be a plus as there's a scarcity of females interested in engineering.</p>
<p>Dad II</p>
<p>Despite what is said at the numerous info sessions given by HYPS and other "elite schools" they really DO compare and rank student applicants from a given school against each other. That said, your D's strategy of applying to schools as a group can have a significant negative impact on her (them) and many if not all could find themselves seriously disappointed.</p>
<p>This past year we witnessed admissions decisions that were often hard to understand with the number of wait listed students increasing significantly at many schools. This phenomenon is no doubt impacted by the ever growing number of schools that individual students are applying to and the guessing game that admissions counselors have to play in trying to determine just who will matriculate. Among many Asian students (an already self-selecting pool) it is not uncommon to see them applying to ALL 8 Ivies.</p>
<p>I would strongly suggest that you do ALL that you can to get your D to break from her "pack mentality" and to choose several schools that are hers alone and NOT discuss it with her friends. She has the added disadvantage of being female when many top schools are having more trouble finding top male applicants. Safety schools for male applicants can be very different than for female applicants. As example, schools like Bates, Bowdoin,or Colby would hardly be considered true "safety schools" yet for a highly qualified male applicant they can be due to the huge inequity of male to female students in the student body population. This could also be the case for a male out of state applicants to UVA or UNC-Chapel Hill.</p>
<p>Several weeks back the NY Times Education Life section talked about the "new safeties" and mentioned both Emory and U Chicago. She should seriously consider both.</p>
<p>You may not realize it but Wash U's application process is "need aware" not "need blind" and places a high level of importance on "demonstrated interest" which means in essence: have you visited the school, taken a tour and attended an info session? Wash U also has a highly advantaged ED process that really helps them manage their yield. Their RD process/field is actually far more competitive than their ED process/field.</p>
<p>One other thing I didn't notice in your posts and forgive me if I missed it, but geographic diversity can also have a huge impact on admissions. It is far more competitive for a student in the Northeast or metro Atlantic area to gain admission to an Ivy than it is for someone living in Kansas just due to the sheer number of applicants from the Northeast etc. The same applies to Asian students in California</p>
<p>Your D and her GC really need to come down to Earth and prepare a balanced list of schools that will not leave her and her friends sorely disappointed next April 1st.</p>
<p>OOPS double posted the California comment with Northstarmom!</p>
<p>I can see a collective sigh by the Ad Com, "Not another premed!". </p>
<p>Factors that negatively impact prognosis of this disease include: genetic predisposition (asian), anemia (insufficient passion in a defined academic interest), increased white cell counts (inflated EC's) and cranial inflammation (brand name school syndrome).</p>
<p>Dad II,
What your D's ECs like? Is there depth? Leadership? Awards beyond the school level? To be competitive for merit money, one must be MUCH more than grades and numbers.</p>
<p>Emory, like WashU, is another school that wants applicants (esp. for merit money) to "show the love" -- if they think you are applying as an Ivy backup, don't count on merit money, and don't be surprised at the waitlist.</p>
<p>Curmudgeon can speak to this as well, but part of the role of the big merit scholarship winners at colleges is to be representatives for the school -- so that more kids like these will attend. The college is also banking that these kids will go on to do great things and bring honor/glory/money to their campus. However -- don't be fooled -- one needs to have the brains, talent <em>and</em> people skills, for it IS a public relations job. </p>
<p>There aren't too many schools that give out merit money purely by the numbers anymore. Great numbers get you consideration at the table, but a winning personality is what gets you money. Your D might want to think about that as she contemplates interviewing for colleges and scholarship opportunities.</p>
<p>I'm not sure that we are doing anything other than adding to Dad II's stress lilevel at this point. Based on the stats outlined in #78 and the list in #102, we know the following:</p>
<p>D is within the range for Harvard and Yale, but, who knows?</p>
<p>She will almost certainly be admitted to some or all of the other schools on her list.</p>
<p>Merit money is very difficult to obtain at the other schools, but is a possibility with her stats. Again, one should never bet on it but, who knows?</p>
<p>The rub will come if D is a) to Harvard and/or Yale and gets merit money somewhere else or b) doesn't get merit money anywhere. At that point, the question is whether Dad II feels bound to honor his pledge to do whatever it takes to finance the high prestige school. Unlike some of the other posters, I do think there is a strong argument that he should honor the pledge; however, I wouldn't criticize him or suggest that he should feel bad for taking a different position. (Of course, if, as one poster suggests, Dad II's EFC is in fact $10,000, even this might not be such a big issue).</p>
<p>I that there is anything else that can be said about this situation.</p>
<p>"There aren't too many schools that give out merit money purely by the numbers anymore."</p>
<p>This statement is simply not true. Many nonelite schools give out merit aid solely on the numbers.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Emory, like WashU, is another school that wants applicants (esp. for merit money) to "show the love" -- if they think you are applying as an Ivy backup, don't count on merit money, and don't be surprised at the waitlist.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>WashU or WUSTL is a school that is so idiosyncratic that it deserves a its own category. If it is true that the school rewards the "show-me-the-love," its recruiters are surely not stingy to dole the "love" out. No other school comes close to sending more recruiting material and ... attracting high scoring candidates through financial incentives.</p>
<p>
<p>This statement is simply not true. Many nonelite schools give out merit aid solely on the numbers
No doubt. </p>
<p>But , there aren't many top 50 LAC's or Uni's of the type mentioned most often on this thread that give out real big merit money (full tuition or better) purely by the numbers anymore. Certainly not Emory, WashU, Chicago, Duke, ...</p>
<p>The schools that I see giving out big money by the numbers are 3rd and 2nd tier colleges that seem to be trying to improve their rankings. S was offered a virtually full scholarship based on his SAT scores from such a 3rd tier school.</p>
<p>Thank you EMM1, you sum it up better than I could ever.</p>
<p>I turely learnt a lot from these 10 pages of discussions. Things that some scholarship needs GC's recommendations, pick engineering instead of pre-med etc are invaluable.</p>
<p>At the end of the day, I think Harvard or Yale may be the better financial deal regarding my EFC. Other schools that do not meet 100% need may be even more expensive to us, saving the State U.</p>
<p>We are doing something to lower our EFC and that is why we are not sure as right now what is the exact number.</p>
<p>EMM1,
OP has made it pretty clear they are not looking at schools in those tiers --though I think his D should look at Case. Engineering, pre-med programs, merit $$. They are generous with merit $$, and awards seem to be pretty numbers-driven. Among the schools Dad II has mentioned that DO give merit money, it's not just on the numbers.</p>
<p>I am saddened that we have heard so little from OP's D on WHY she wants School X, Y or Z, other than the prestige factor and that her friends are applying there. It could help us give useful suggestions for match/safeties that offer merit $$. There are many great schools from which one can launch into fine (even prestigious) medical schools.</p>