<p>I think a B is just a nice way to tell the student who tough it out all the way thru the final exam: “Nice try. But we don’t think you belong to this sequence… So here’s a B to reward your hard work and not giving up thru the final. But it’s time to exit this sequence after you complete this class.”</p>
<p>Again, different Professors may have slightly different grading system. It’s best to talk to the instructor directly about their policy.</p>
<p>Btw, in order to earn a B in the class, the student must have done some “acceptable” amount of work (different instructors have different guidelines as to what’s acceptable.) Those who don’t or can’t meet them are very likely to drop out by midterm or soon after. So, please don’t think that taking 295 is a sure way of earning at least a B in math.</p>
<p>I’m assuming that by 395, the minimum grade given is probably an “A-” since all the students who don’t belong to this sequence have been weeded out. </p>
<p>What parentOf2018 says is what I’ve ears as well, but my information is also old.</p>
<p>@parentOf2018 @Vladenschlutte
Don’t worry; I’m not planning on taking the class to earn a sure B. I have recently been reading up on proofs, and find that I thoroughly enjoy them. At UM, I plan to take on the available Financial Math concentration with a double major in computer science. Enrolling in the honors sequence will allow me to take an advanced variation of upper-level courses after the end of the sequence, enabling me to have taken as (almost) advanced math coursework as someone with a Master’s in Financial Engineering. Along with a double major in computer science, I believe this will be an important asset. I want to love what I do, so I have to do what I love. ;)</p>
<p>This sequence really prepares one very well in handling advanced math courses, that’s why it’s no brainer that those who finish the sequence successfully will have access to upperUndergrad- and grad-level math courses much sooner than those who don’t. In fact, most taking 395-396 usually also take 493-494 (renumbered from 512-513: Honors Algebra) concurrently.</p>
<p>My general impression is that this very close-knit “elite” bunch of students seems to have much better access to or more special considerations in many other opportunities not available to other undergrads or those from different honors sequence (e.g.: interesting research/work/job opportunities, prestigious scholarships, etc)… all of which are well-earned perks of this specific sequence.</p>
<p>@parentOf2018
Thank you for being as informative of the honors sequence as you have been. You’ve been a great help. :)</p>
<p>If I continue with my current intentions and decide to enroll in the course, I may update this thread before classes begin describing how I prepared for the course, and again at the end of the course detailing my experiences and how helpful my preparation was.</p>
<p>Sleep deprivation is also a common plague amongst the 295ers (yeah, that’s what the students are called 
). So get some good sleep before the Fall term starts. Students will soon figure out that it takes more than just intellectual skills to survive and do well in this sequence.</p>
<p>UPDATE:</p>
<p>I haven’t been studying from the Spivak text recently. I have decided that it might be best to save this text for when I take the class.</p>
<p>I’ve just finished reading the following article: <a href=“http://math.berkeley.edu/~hutching/teach/proofs.pdf”>http://math.berkeley.edu/~hutching/teach/proofs.pdf</a></p>
<p>I believe that it provides a concise introduction on proofs, how to analyze them, and how to write them. I have started reading Elementary Real and Complex Analysis by Georgi E. Shilov, and will, most likely, continue with this text for preparation.</p>
<p>UPDATE:</p>
<p>I have finished the first chapter of Spivak’s text and am looking at the practice problems found at the end of the chapter. I have noticed that I am fluent in understanding basic proofs, but I do not know how to approach a theorem to prove it. I haven’t yet developed the mindset for that, but hope to do so.</p>
<p>I found an entertaining proof done by a previous 295 class. I found it lighthearted and very easy to understand, so I’ll post it below for anyone to have a look. Enjoy! :)</p>
<p>“A ProofThat Professor DeBacker considers us (his Math 295 class) to be more important than his children”: <a href=“http://www.math.lsa.umich.edu/~smdbackr/TESTIMONIALS/kidproof.pdf”>http://www.math.lsa.umich.edu/~smdbackr/TESTIMONIALS/kidproof.pdf</a></p>
<p>UPDATE:</p>
<p>I was able to register for Math 295. Preparation for the course has been progressing steadily. I have been reading through Shilov’s book whenever I have the time to do so. Throughout the majority of this summer, though, I have been working on personal CS projects, and reviewing EECS 280 material from: <a href=“http://www.andrewdeorio.com/teaching/eecs280/”>http://www.andrewdeorio.com/teaching/eecs280/</a>.</p>
<p>I will update this thread once Math 295 begins to give an overview of my experiences adapting in the beginning of the semester, and once more, if I can complete the course as expected, detailing how I found the course to be.</p>
<p>***Also, in the above post(#28), I meant to state that I had “finished the first chapter of Shilov’s text”, not “Spivak’s text”. Some questions at the end of that chapter, similar to the questions at the end of following chapters 
, were unusually difficult for me to correctly start down the path to solve. I believe that a mentor, i.e. a professor, would have been very helpful for me in these situations.</p>
<p>I also plan on taking this sequence during my junior year after I finish some courses. I will be a freshman and hope to complete a proofs transition book (currently working through) by the end of a school year along with the Spivak calculus during the summer. Thanks for updating the thread and good luck. </p>
<p>@Snayyan09</p>
<p>Thanks. Best of luck to you with your studies as well.
I am curious to know, though: why do you plan on taking this sequence during your junior year?</p>
<p>P.S. I don’t know if it’s a coincidence, but you have <em>295</em> posts. :D</p>
<p>Ha, that is really weird. I plan on being on a premed track which requires me to take chemistry, biology, and physics courses during the first two years of college in order to best prepare for the MCAT. I don’t really enjoy premed, but, in a way, I have to enjoy it. Sorry for the ambiguity. I am interested in the sequence because it joins classes such as Calc 1 and Calc 2 (295); multivariable and linear algebra (296) and so on. Also, I have plans on becoming an interdisciplinary physics major which will require me to take physics class during my last two years of college as well. </p>
<p>Some physics classes have Calc 1-3 (and possibly DiffEq) pre-reqs. It just makes more sense to get Math pre-reqs out of the way first in order to better prepare one for physics classes.</p>
<p>@Snayyan09
The premed track does seem strict, especially when considering that many students take the MCAT during their junior year. I agree with @parentOf2018 with this, though. Many physics courses, especially upper-level ones, do have Math(Calc 1-3 and Diff Eq) prerequisites. Why leave the sequence till junior year with the previously mentioned concerns about physics courses?</p>
<p>Are you planning to do the regular Calc Sequence to fulfill the formerly stated prerequisites, then finish the honors one for personal experience?</p>
<p>Yes, ParentOf2018, you are correct. However, when I do take Physics 3, which states that math 295 is a prereq, I believe I may be able to take them concurrently. Please correct me if I am wrong. I looked ahead and most of the upper level classes I plan on taking are satisfied with an understanding of 295 and 296. I was looking at the prerequisites for Physics 3, and they were not enforced- so maybe WolverineTrader can provide more insight on that. I was told that the math involves partial derivatives which I am perfectly adequate at. Perhaps I may be able to get a bipass if I am wrong.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, I will not be able to do that.The standard calculus sequence for me is a waste in my opinion. It is mostly based on the computational aspects of math rather than the theory behind the underlying principles. I am more interested in the theory than whether I know how it find double derivatives or anything else. I am more interested in why you can take a double anti derivative and what does it mean. Catch my point? Computational math can be easily learned by a simple video or google search.</p>
<p>**Update as I was writing this: I just checked, and Physics 3 does not have any math prerequisites. How odd, I thought I saw Calc 215. </p>
<p>I should probably discuss my schedule over with my counselor. </p>
<p>@parentOf2018 Classes such as Quatum Mechanics and Modern Physics do require upper level classes (296). Do you know if I will be able to take them concurrently? </p>
<p>I was actually planning on taking it the summer after sophomore year (MCAT).</p>
<p>@Snayyan09, Modern Physics (390) has the following “enforced” pre-req: MATH 216, 256, 286, 296 or 316; and advisory pre-req: Physics 340. While QM (453) has 390 as its enforced pre-req. </p>
<p>My son took Physics 390/453/etc after he got all his Math requirements out of the way, so he had the right toolset to better understand and focus just on the Physics materials instead of having to struggle through the Math.</p>
<p>I don’t know if you can take Math 216/256/286/296/316 concurrently with Physics 390, for the same reason I mentioned in your other thread:
<a href=“http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/university-michigan-ann-arbor/1661093-physics-340-waves-heat-and-light.html#latest”>http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/university-michigan-ann-arbor/1661093-physics-340-waves-heat-and-light.html#latest</a></p>
<p>Also, Math 295-296 are not required for any Physics, unless you want to go thru the theoretical route. There are many more Math classes that cover similar materials, with little-to-no theoretical components. There are even a few options if you want something somewhat theoretical; it may be best to discuss your options with a Math advisor.</p>
<p>@Snayyan09
If I were in your position, I would meet with a physics advisor, and a math advisor to discuss which math sequence would provide the best preparation for future physics courses and when to begin that sequence.</p>