<p>which candidate gets better recognition/prospects in the usa?</p>
<p>Definitely Cambridge, there's really no comparison.</p>
<p>what if the student did undergrad at mcgill and postgrad at another higher tier university (say stanford)</p>
<p>Let's put it this way. McGill and Cambridge undergrads are considered at a tier below undergrads at top notch American Universities (USNWR top 15 & USNWR LAC top 5). However, Stanford grad students are on the same tier as grad students at Cambridge.</p>
<p>so what are the chances of transferring from mcgill to a top tier ivy; better than the chances of admittance in that ivy for undergraduate in the first place?</p>
<p>Chances are close to zero if top tier Ivies refer to HYP. Princeton doesn't take transfers. Harvard is not taking transfers for at least the next two years. Yale takes about 25 transfers out of about 800 applicants. You do the math. In addition, a lot of those transfer applicants at Yale are ones already at top notch schools such as Harvard, Princeton, Stanford, Dartmouth, Columbia, etc. So transfer chances are much worse than first-year chances. I'm not trying to discourage anyone; but the numbers don't look very good.</p>
<p>i totally disagree with what someone said about mcgill being below the top-tier american schools -- granted, i would say that the comparison to cambridge is tough simply due to age and prestige, but mcgill is "canada's harvard" for a reason...actually if you go to canada they will say harvard is "america's mcgill" haha...look at the world rankings that are compiled and you'll see that mcgill is ranked number 12 (World</a> University Rankings 2007) i know, i know behind some of the ivies, but definitely not a tier-below...</p>
<p>i don't know about actual academic rigors or prospects,</p>
<p>but Cambridge always sounded as prestigious as Harvard to me since I was small. i'm sorry but I never heard of McGill before today.</p>
<p>redwingshockey,
McGill is the safety school for average and some below average students at my old high school in the United States. McGill is definitely a tier below all the Ivies at the undergrad level. McGill's average SAT is a whole 50 points lower than that of Cornell (the Ivy with the lowest average SAT) and 90 points lower than that of Penn (the Ivy with the second lowest average SAT). It's ranked number 12 by World University Rankings because it is a great research university that has some good grad programs. Same case for the University of Toronto. Many people even consider some colleges at Cambridge to be a tier below schools such as Harvard, Princeton, Yale, Stanford, Dartmouth, Columbia, MIT, and Caltech at the undergraduate level.
I agree with RGPanda. Transferring to HYP is extremely difficult, for only Yale accepts transfers. However, transferring to Cornell and Penn are relatively easy; both have transfer admissions rates in the teens.</p>
<p>Cambridge by far</p>
<p>i am from Canada and no one ever called harvard the mcgill of the the America or whatever, nor Mcgill the harvard of Canada. Ivies mean very little in Canada, and Mcgill itself is just another university in Canada. No canadian will be awed that you went there.</p>
<p>redwingshockey,</p>
<p>I'm really skeptical about those "world" rankings you posted. I mean... they have Boston University ahead of Dartmouth, Purdue ahead of Rice. It just doesn't seem very realistic.</p>
<p>NeoEpisteme,
The purpose of that ranking is to rank universities by the qualities and quantities of researches. Although that ranking is not well respected, the fact that Boston University ranks ahead of Dartmouth and Purdue ahead of Rice is reasonable. Although Dartmouth and Rice offer undergraduate educations that only a few universities can match, they don't have many grad and research programs. The fact that redwingshockey uses that ranking to suggest McGill is as good (or better) than the Ivies at the undergraduate level shows ignorance.</p>
<p>When I referred to average SAT scores in post #9, I only used the Critical Reading and Math scores because some universities haven't published their writing averages yet.</p>
<p>Thank you IPbear, your explanation of that ranking system makes much more sense now, although I still think putting Boston U ahead of Dartmouth by that much is a stretch. But as Rice and Dartmouth are both universities that focus more on UG, I can see that they may not be rated well against universities that focus on research.</p>
<p>From post #4: "McGill and Cambridge undergrads are considered at a tier below undergrads at top notch American Universities."</p>
<p>Don't know where you get your info ^^ . Cambridge undergrad and grad are as good as any university in the world. Period. </p>
<p>McGill isn't "just another college" in Canada. Don't know with whom Ivyleaguer has been talking. Toronto and McGill aren't as hard to get into as American universities with faculties of comparable quality because they don't have that "magnet" effect. Whereas the top American schools get loads of applications from all over the country, the bulk of Canadians seem reluctant to leave their home province for undergrad. It's sort of like that in the Midwest, where even plenty of valedictorians are more than happy to go to in-state schools that are close and cheap--even if they aren't the state flagship. Places like Michigan State, Ohio U., and Northern Illinois are viable options for many tip-top in-state students...moreso than places like SUNYs, UMass-Boston, and CalState Whatever.</p>
<p>TourGuide446,
Many colleges at Cambridge are as good as top American schools. However, some colleges at Cambridge are a notch below the top American schools. Since Cambridge and Oxford take so many undergraduates (more than the top eight American schools, based on averages of their USNWR rankings over the years, combined). This is why students who can't get into top schools in the United States are attending colleges at Cambridge and Oxford.
You suggest McGill is on a tier with "Michigan State, Ohio U., and Northern Illinois" at the undergrad level. I would think McGill is a tier higher.</p>
<p>IPBear, reread what Tour Guide said. He didn't suggest that McGill was on a tier with Mich State, Ohio U and NIU. He was commenting that the bulk of anadians are reluctant to leave their home province, much like many midwesterners are happy to go to their in-state schools. And he's right at least from a midwestern perspective - there are plenty of good students who choose UIUC or NIU and people don't blink an eye. It's very different from the northeast, where going to one's own state school just isn't done amongst the better students unless there is a compelling financial issue.</p>
<p>I've totally heard of McGill and understand it to be a very fine school. The Canadians just don't have all the hype that we do about schools.</p>
<p>If we're talking purely about prestige and what your average joe in the US thinks, then Cambridge is equal to, maybe a bit below HYP, but is percieved as better than almost every other US school, and the average joe in the US hasn't heard of McGill.
The people doing the hiring probably have a more realistic handle on which school is good in a given field.</p>
<p>Pizzagirl,
Many people at my high school applied to McGill, and it was their safety in case they don't get into HYP, Caltech, Stanford, Dartmouth, Columbia, Williams, Brown, etc. All the people I knew got in, and none chose to attend McGill even with the price advantage. One of my friend got a full ride at McGill, but she chose to pay $47,000 per year to attend Brown.
McGill and the University of Toronto are like top public universities in the United States in terms of qualities and quantities of undergrads. McGill and the Universtiy of Toronto has over 80,000 undergrads; they have more undergrads than the top 12 American schools combined.</p>
<p>IPBear, I don't know what your point is...the very point Pizzagirl and I were making is that because a lot of Canadians have a Midwest-like disregard for chasing prestige, McGill and Toronto don't have the gaudy prestige stats like they would if Canadians tended to have prestige-lust like New Yorkers. If Canadians were like New Yorkers, a lot of the top students from all provinces would be clammoring to get into McGill and Toronto, and their acceptance rates would rival the top American schools. And since people in the Northeast seem to equate low acceptance percentages with quality and prestige, rather than top-notch faculties, they underestimate Toronto and McGill.</p>