<p>I haven't lost track of anything. I didn't bring up grad rankings. Also, I'm not saying Duke is a bad school and I'm not even saying berkeley is better than duke. What I'm saying is I don't understand why duke is ranked the same as stanford. It just doesn't seem right to me.</p>
<p>Oh. Well that's one of the quirks of the US News ranking, along with Penn being #4 and Notre Dame being top 20. So if you want to say Duke's overrated in US News, then that's fine, but overrated in general? No more than any other elite.</p>
<p>Thanks for the information, warblersrule86.</p>
<p>I seem to have lost track of where this thread was going. :confused: Oh, well. I still say WUStL is the most overrated. :D</p>
<p>Oh yeah, WUSTL definitely gets my vote too. And UMD-CP.</p>
<p>If we're talking undergrad, it's got to be Harvard. There's that old story about how within about 5 minutes of meeting him, a Harvard man will somehow fit it in the conversation that he went to Harvard. If the education was so damn good there, he wouldn't have to TELL you...you'd just know it.</p>
<p>Berkeley is NOT overrated. If anything, like most top state universities, Cal is underrated on this forum. I'd say that few schools are overrated. Most schools who get thumbs up on this forum are worthy of their praise. But some state schools get undeserved criticism.</p>
<p>
[quote]
overrated: berkeley. Everyone thinks it is good 'cause of grad. NOBODY likes it for ugrad. it is a piece of crap for ugrad and most everyone chooses UCLA > Berkeley for undergrad. Berkeley for undergrad is the same as penn state.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I do agree that Berkeley does tend to be somewhat overrated when it comes to undergrad, as the undergrad program does significantly pawn off the greatness of the graduate program.</p>
<p>But to say that most everyone chooses UCLA over Berkeley for undergrad? That's going too far. While I don't have the stats on me, I am fairly confident that Berkeley beats UCLA on the cross-admit battle. Moreover, I would say that Berkeley, despite its problems, still edges out UCLA at the undergraduate level. Let's face it. While I agree that Berkeley undergrad has problems, UCLA undergrad isn't exactly problem-free. </p>
<p>And when you say that Berkeley is the same as Penn State, I have to say "come on". I agree that Berkeley undergrad has problems matching up with the top private schools, simply because all large public schools have problems matching up with the top private schools. But when we're talking about 2 large public schools like Berkeley and Penn State, they tend to share the same problems. Moreover, Berkeley has plenty of advantages that Penn State can't match. </p>
<p>Bottom line, I believe that Berkeley undergrad is among the top public schools in the country, and arguably the best. It's in a class with Virginia and Michigan. UCLA and Penn State, while fine schools, don't belong in that class.</p>
<p>
[quote]
Berkeley is NOT overrated. If anything, like most top state universities, Cal is underrated on this forum. I'd say that few schools are overrated. Most schools who get thumbs up on this forum are worthy of their praise. But some state schools get undeserved criticism
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<p>I think when they say 'overrated', they mean within the context of the general public, not necessarily just this CS forum. At least, that's how I interpreted it. I would say that within that context, Berkeley and Michigan are probably overrated at the undergraduate level, although they definitely deserves their hype at the graduate level. I simply don't believe that the big public schools serve their undergrads particularly well. Too many undergrads fall through the cracks. </p>
<p>However, back to the OP's question, I would say that the most overrated school is probably Harvard, with Yale being a close second. Don't get me wrong. I think that Harvard and Yale are arguably the 2 best undergrad schools in the country. I just don't think that they're way out in front of everybody else, which is what many people in the public think. Many regular people think that there's Harvard, and then there is everybody else. Either that, or they think that there's Harvard, and then there's Yale, and then there's everybody else. I disagree. The top schools are all bunched up closely to each other. Harvard and Yale are not worlds-away better than Stanford or Princeton or MIT, which is what the hype would have you believe.</p>
<p>MIT. CalTech. WUStL. </p>
<p>MIT-it looks hideous, and pretty depressing, especially with Harvard next door. I don't know why anyone would choose to go to MIT. Of all the ivies and other top schools to choose from, WHY MIT? I'd choose Wharton over MIT any day but whatever.</p>
<p>CalTech-see my spiel on MIT, but replace MIT with CalTech.</p>
<p>WUStL-not ACTUALLY a top college: it only got to where USNews put it because it spent tons of money on rejection letters and pretty brochures. If I had the stats for WUStL, I'd choose Brown over WU any day.</p>
<p>a fight! <em>goes to grab the popcorn</em></p>
<p>most overrated school in the country is WashU hands down. their shameless self-promotion and borderline "whoring" to USNWR has paid off in spades for them - no. 11 in the country - anyone who actually believes that, I've got a bridge I want to sell them - it's a bridge to ... YOU'VE BEEN PUNK'D!</p>
<p>as for my thoughts on the Duke vs. Berkeley overrated debate... Duke is more overrated than Cal (though they are both excellent schools in their own right).</p>
<p>my reasoning?</p>
<p>Let's take for instance the dreaded USNWR list (since everyone loves quoting that) Cal is ranked, what, no. 20 on the USNWR list while Duke is ranked no. 5.</p>
<p>Let's consider that apparent gaping difference for a second.</p>
<p>Cal is THE best public U in the US - and yet it barely gets the kind of credit it probably deserves (though Sakky's points re: the coattail riding off of its grad reputation are well taken).</p>
<p>Duke, while a great school, Top 5 in the nation? These are the schools USNWR ranks below Duke:</p>
<pre><code>7 California Institute of Technology
7 Massachusetts Inst. of Technology
9 Columbia University (NY)
9 Dartmouth College (NH)
</code></pre>
<p>12 Northwestern University (IL)
13 Cornell University (NY)
13 Johns Hopkins University (MD)
15 Brown University (RI)
15 University of Chicago</p>
<p>Nearly every school on this list above (perhaps save JHU and Northwestern - which are peers to Duke IMO) are better than Duke. </p>
<p>Caltech, MIT, Columbia, Dartmouth, Brown are no-brainers. Even if you don't agree with that shortlist - Duke > MIT and Caltech! Come on now folks, put down the USNWR Kool-Aid for a moment and sober up. I'll put a pot a coffee on for you. </p>
<p>Duke's not in the Top 10.</p>
<p>iHateCA, how can you say MIT and Caltech are overrated? MIT is #1 in Economics, top 5 in Business and Linguistics and top 10 in Philosophy, Political Science and Psychology. I haven't even touched on the sciences! MIT is #1 or #2 in EVERY single science out there, from Engineering to Geology and from Physics to Mathematics. Add to this its $7 billion endowment, its dozens of Nobel Prize winners, its incredible professional placement rates and what you get is a top 5 university. I actually think MIT is underrated. </p>
<p>Caltech is not overrated, but it is misplaced. I think Caltech should be put in a category along with Harvey Mudd and other small speciality elites. But how can anybody say that Caltech is "overrated"? It is an amazing institute.</p>
<p>Washington University is overrated, but not that much. I mean, it is definitely a top 25 university. Ok, so ranking it in the top 10 is a stretch, but it isn't that bad.</p>
<p>One vote for Duke.</p>
<p>Duke over CalTech and MIT?</p>
<p>Even though other schools may have been over rated, nothing beats Duke.</p>
<p>onyl thing i have against caltech and MIT is the housing.</p>
<p>they've got crap dorms.</p>
<p>PS: how good are the harvey mudd dorms? i'd like to visit them before i choose where i go to college.</p>
<p>oh, and i think berkeley is overrated. the student body just lowers berkeley's level. too many students get in. and since they get most of their students from CA public schools, most students are stupid and unmotivated. and the top students are like geniuses who pwn everyone. then there are the gpa whores.</p>
<p>its like high school all over again</p>
<p>hereiam, mudd dorms range from really ghetto (where i live) to really extremely nice. there are no triples (unless it is a suite) and there is no segregation based upon year. if you want a really nice dorm, you'll probably get it. those dorms are a little too quite for me. i'm currently in west, the crazy loud dorm. the people here are the trade-off for ghettoness...but still, i have one roommate, my own sink and share a bathroom/shower with 2 other students.</p>
<p>nicer dorms have lounges as common rooms between suites with tvs, sofas, and sometimes kitchens.</p>
<p>at west, we destroy stuff (computers/washing machines) in our quad and have bonfires....so we kinda make it ghetto - we like it that way.</p>
<p>NYU is the most overrated school in the country. It's really only good for the Arts and Business. No real college feel, no campus, no division 1 sports, and its EXPENSIVE!</p>
<p>O ya I agree about NYU. My cuz went there and her parents considered a total waste!</p>
<p>nyu.
runner up: notre dame, smith</p>
<p>
[quote]
Nearly every school on this list above (perhaps save JHU and Northwestern - which are peers to Duke IMO) are better than Duke.</p>
<p>Caltech, MIT, Columbia, Dartmouth, Brown are no-brainers.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Sorry Ivy, the only no-brainers are Caltech and MIT. ;) With the possible exception of Columbia, there's no way you can make an objective argument for the others schools on that list being definitively better than Duke.</p>
<p>And why am I not surprised Penn's ranking did not draw the same ire. :p At least Duke isn't ranked above 2/5 of HYPSM.</p>
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And why am I not surprised Penn's ranking did not draw the same ire
[/quote]
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<p>UPenn is ranked too high in USNWR as well. Well noted. (that said, I've always maintained that the yearly USNWR list is about as useful as a role of toilet paper - which is to say there is a "use" for it, but not what its creators meant it for)</p>
<p>Duke / Penn should not be receiving Top 5 rankings - everyone agrees that HYPSM already gets you to an undisputable 5. As for a Top 10 spot, UPenn deserves one while Duke does not and therefore, Duke rather than Penn is more overrated from that perspective.</p>
<p>As for UNDERRATED, Brown IMO is the most underrated college in USNWR (see my previous post on this in the other long thread discussing rankings)</p>