<p>This really has been an interesting discussion. Much as I love MT, I certainly agree that MT performers have often had a bad reputation. When I was in college (in the last century!!), there was very little acting training available for MT performers. I was definitely guilty of mugging and overacting in the early years, and it wasn't until I moved to NYC and started working professionally that I was able to get the additional training necessary.</p>
<p>I do think that there's been a positive change in many college curriculums in recent years, however, with a much better emphasis on good acting methods. There is a BIG difference between schools, however; which is why I recommend that my students see at least one on-campus production whenever possible, and carefully study degree requirements to see which schools "mix" acting and MT students. You really have to do your homework.</p>
<p>My D is currently attending Syracuse, and we are very happy with their strong acting emphasis. Here's a quick break-down of their curriculum:</p>
<pre><code> 35 credits are mixed classes -- both Acting & MT majors.
28 credits are specifically MT credits -- i.e., instead of
"History of Theater", they would take "History of MT"; or
"MT Scene Study" instead of "Scene Study." Most of the
MT credits are acting classes, but are focused on MT
repertoire rather than non-musicals.
</code></pre>
<p>I haven't included academic electives & requirements, which are the same.</p>
<p>My D felt this program was a good mix of acting training and MT technique, which was right for her. Every student is different, and you really need to do some research on what program is a good fit, and gives you the training you need.</p>
<p>Unless it has changed significantly at Syracuse since I was there, MT students take both Theatre History and MT History (I think I heard that now the MT students may take one semester of Theatre History to leave room in their schedules for MT History, but check the curriculum). MT students also take both MT scene study and acting scene study. As onstage has said above. MT and Acting students are integrated in all acting classes, and if a MT student passes the acting portion of their sophomore evaluation they would be permitted to take all upper level acting classes with the Acting students.</p>
<p>Many programs (Like Syracuse. CMU, UARTS, and others) offer strong acting classes for the MT students. For students that want this kind of training there are schools out there.</p>
<p>Other students may find it preferable to go to an Acting program and take voice and dance outside of their major... if this is the course you are following make sure that you will be ALLOWED to take these courses outside of the major. The policy will differ at each school. Some BFA Acting programs will tell you that you will not have time to take additional course work outside of your major.... Some Dance and/ or Music departments will not permit non-majors to take dance classes with majors or to take private voice lessons for credit.</p>
<p>KatMT -- I'm not sure if this is different than when you were at Syracuse, but just to clarify -- yes, Syracuse MT students take both a MT History course and a Theater History course -- the latter, however, is NOT the same as the history courses that Acting majors take. The acting scene study class you mentioned IS one of the "mixed" courses in the sophomore year -- with both acting and MT students. Juniors and seniors who have passed their soph evals do have room in their schedules to take theater electives, which could include the upper level acting classes with acting majors.</p>
<p>I think you're right on the money when you say students may not have time to take additional course work outside your major. On paper it may look like students may have room in their schedule for extra credits -- but in reality a BFA requires lots of additional hours spent rehearsing -- either for full productions or just class work. The schedule is unbelievable -- sometimes my D (a sophomore) literally doesn't have time to eat lunch or dinner until after 11 pm. </p>
<p>Again, I'm sure it varies according to the school, but I'm not sure how realistic it is to try to do an acting BFA in addition to private study, at least during the school year. Maybe summer programs could be a better option.</p>
<p>Elon has good acting training for MT majors, and the acting classes are mixed - BFA Acting and BFA MT students, similar to many of the other schools.</p>
<p>In addition to other schools already discussed above, I also believe that Ithaca and Webster have good acting training for MT students.</p>
<p>Onstage -- I think the only change is with the Theatre History course work... we took both semesters of Theatre History with the Theatre Majors PLUS MT History. They most likely changed that in order to make more room for performance based classes?</p>
<p>Because as MT majors we took all of our acting classes with the acting majors, and could take upper level acting classes with the majors (if we passed evaluations) I felt that the acting training we recieved as MT majors at Syracuse was a strength of the program.</p>
<p>My monologue coach (who played in the original Anne Frank on Broadway) says very few people truly have the skills to make it in musical theatre. You may be able to get into the college program, but that definitly doesn't mean you will not spend a lot of your life waiting at casting calls. The best choice is to major in acting or general theatre so you have a well-rounded theatre education instead of an intense concentration in performance. Of course, that's just the most practical thing to do. There's a lot to be said for simply following your dreams instead, though!</p>
<p>Patsygirl (& others) - this thread was bound to bring up the inevitable, there really is no black/white evidence and "better" way of training that will turn out the most successful performer. </p>
<p>Patsygirl - although I respect your monologue coach's opinion, I also believe that there is an abundance of people who lack the acting chops to deliver a believeable performance in a straight play (even after years of training). </p>
<p>I don't think that an "intense concentration in performance" is just merely following your dream, and that "the best choice is to major in acting or general theatre so you have a well-rounded theatre education". </p>
<p>It may work for some, but not for everybody. As a totally academic person I have come to greatly admire the passion that my MT oriented D has and the drive and determination she exhibits to become the very best performer she can be, taking acting classes, dance classes & voice lessons, late night rehearsals and crazy show schedules on top of a heavy academic load. </p>
<p>I would definitely refrain far from even trying to determine what is most practical, as "in my other world" people are eager to point out theatre in any shape or form would not be considered the most practical of career choices
:-). </p>
<p>After reading this board for several years now, I do find it to be less confusing if people steer clear from telling others without knowing them what is best for them. On the other hand, this forum is a great place to share what has proven to work for you, so other may learn from your experiences. </p>
<p>Rereading my post it definitly din't sound as good in writing as it did in my head. MTgrlsmom, I know what you mean with the decription of your daughter (it pretty much is the same as I'd describe myself). I guess a better way to put it would be that before going into a major like musical theatre, you really have to do a hardcore self-evaluation. Most colleges have a BFA in MT, meaning it reallyis all you do from morning til night. If one suddenly decides they don't feel up to the pressure, it can be difficult to transfer into another major, and you canmt minor in anything. If you are positive that is what you want to do, if you are willing to work and work and suffer lots of dissapointments mixed in with successes, yes, MT might be the best choice. I suggested general theatre because you get the benefits of musical theatre like voice and movement, but you also get to explore other things- directing, costuming, stage managing- things that aren;t so easy to take private lessons in. Thus the 'well-rounded' portion.
Honestly, I would have loved to go into musical theatre. But I know my singing isn't strong enough to ever really take me places. With a gen. theatre program, I will be able to stay in theater, and acting, but I will have other options; not to fall back on if acting doesn't work, but to figure out where I really fit in in the world of theatre. That is where the practicality aspect came from.
Sorry if my words put anybody off... hopefully this explains my train of thought better...:), and of course, break a leg to everyone who's auditions are coming up soon (December 1st at Emerson anyone? I'll see you there!)</p>
<p>i'm such a musical theatre nerd, but i'm planning on majoring in straight theatre. musicals are just a part of the spectrum of theatre, so i don't think it makes sense to spend so much of my energy on one slice of it. i really don't know what i want to do with theatre yet, and with an MT program it doesn't seem like i'd have the opportunity (time-wise) to explore other possibilities beyond being onstage. and i know wherever i end up at school, if i really want to make it happen, i can get the dance and voice lessons either through school or nearby.</p>
<p>deenierah -- there are some BA Musical Theatre programs (I am sure some BFA musical theatre programs as well -- CMU sounds like one in terms of performance -- Syracuse too (I dont know if students are still able to do this, but I stage managed, designed costumes, helped produced shows, took directing while I was there as a Musical Theatre major... check with current students though) -- where you can get the MT training with voice and dance and musical theatre performance and a well-rounded theatre education. If you look closely at a programs curriculum you can get a sense of the training in the program, and the time you may have to take things and participate in areas other than performance. I know at JMU we have musical theatre students who double major with School of Media Arts and Design (film), as well as other programs. We also have Musical Theatre students who have designed costumes, make-up, scenery for student directed shows... choreographed, directed, etc... too, and taken classes in those areas as additional electives. This is not an endorsement for studying musical theatre rather than theatre in college -- just an example that there are schools where you might be able to get the well rounded experience you are looking for AND the musical theatre training if you are looking for that.</p>
<p>As far as studying voice and dance either through the school or nearby. Make sure that you ask about this when you are visiting a school. At many schools it can be difficult or impossible to get into dance classes and private voice lessons if you are not a musical theatre, dance, or voice major. And depending on the size of the town or city in which you attend college, high quality instruction in those areas may or may not be available in the community at large. Obviously if you are in a city it wil be easy to find lessons and classes. But in a smaller town you may have more difficulty.</p>
<p>All that being said -- I believe that there are many ways to train for a career in the performing arts... I know I sound like a broken record on this board! :) It is just important to make sure that you really ask questions (of both faculty and students) and look to make sure that you will be able to do everything that you want to do while you are in college. </p>
<p>
[quote]
I believe that there are many ways to train for a career in the performing arts... I know I sound like a broken record on this board!
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Kat, I agree and, to some extent, disagree. I suppose it can be said that there are many ways to train for a career in the National Basketball Association (NBA). One can start on the local playgrounds or in city leagues. And I suppose that skills can be developed in different sequences and still lead to a good final result.</p>
<p>Having said that, there are certain high schools and colleges (and coaching staffs) that consistently seem to do a better job than others of taking whatever basketball talent they get and developing it to its full potential. They obviously have ways of training both the mind and the body to produce peak performance. I suspect that most of them have systematic approaches.</p>
<p>I think training actors has many similarities to training athletes.</p>
<p>When I visit London, I always like to see the second and third-tier theaters, and have even visited performances at some of the training programs. In my opinion, the Brits (and maybe the Irish, but I'm less familiar with them) just know how to train actors in a way that produces a better result (overall) that the US does. This is not to say that all UK actors are better than all US ones. But if one could overlay UK and US actor skill curves over each other, I would bet that the UK curve would be substantially to the right of the US one.</p>
<p>I guess what I'm saying is that the quest for the best approach is not a futile one. Some approaches appear to work better than others. Yes, I know that not every person responds to the same training techniques in the same way, but I would also submit that some of the US training techniques to which I was subjected, and to which young actors are still subjected, worked for darn near no one (if even that).</p>
<p>Tarhunt - Yay for sharing this with us. I have begun to grasp the different program offerings in the US through my D's search for the "right college" (for her), but the UK is still unfamiliar territory. That said my D has been saving money to hopefully study acting in London for a semester, assuming that the college she eventually will attend offers this, otherwise she plans to do this after she graduates from college. Even though she is an "MT girl" she loves acting and creating believeable characters and feels that a UK take can be helpful...</p>
<p>Please remember that this is just my opinion, and that I have never been trained in the UK and have no close acquaintances who have been. For all I know, UK and US training techniques aren't even compatible (though I suspect they are).</p>
<p>There used to be a rumor that UK actors would spend a class learning 35 ways to take off a hat. I don't know if that's true or not, but it may well be that they focus more on this sort of technique than US training programs, which seem to focus more on sense memory.</p>
<p>Tarhunt - I don't know that I even knew there were 35 ways to take off a hat :). In any event, D has some "straight acting" friends who have gone and seemed to have had a productive time. We will see how things work out in the future. And yes, I totally "get" that you were just posting your opinion.</p>
<p>Tarhut -- I wonder if there are many paths to a career in the NBA? I know NOTHING about basketball, but it seems like there are fewer paths to a career in the NBA than there are to a career in the performing arts. Although I may think this because I have never even made a basket :) so a career in the NBA seems like it is something magical and completely unattainable.... But I see the connection you are tryng to make. </p>
<p>It does seem that many programs do seem to have a high rate for thier graduates being successful in the profession. I just worry about people at a young age getting hung up on the idea that there is only one way to have a career in the arts... or one school that they have to get into, when it seems that there are many different paths to this end. Also (alas) it seems that in the performing arts business sometimes that "best" actor (if it is even possible to judge one as the best) is not always the one with the "best" career... This does not make the quest for high quality training futile.... just that there are different timelines, training methods, and journeys for everyone. As you said -- this is just my opinion.</p>
<p>PS. How do you get the special quote box to show up in a thread? I can't figure it out...</p>
<p>I think the NBA analogy is a good one. All the kiddies who hold an NBA dream won't make it, but many will still gain plenty from their years playing basketball, such as fitness, teamwork skills, tenacity. Some may become sports writers & follow the NBA. Some may be inspired to become physical therapists or trainers. Some may become high school basketball coaches. And some will just have a lifelong love of watching the games on tv, enjoying the sport with the perspective of someone who has played the game. Their paths may have been different -- AAU leagues for some, urban street ball for others, playing for Duke, or playing for the Cinderella surprise program.</p>
<p>The way you make a quotebox is this: [ quote] text [ /quote]. Just take out the spaces. I had to ask just like you did. The regular html code is different.</p>
<p>I was struck by this quote of yours:</p>
<p>
[quote]
so a career in the NBA seems like it is something magical and completely unattainable
[/quote]
</p>
<p>By my admittedly imprecise count, there are actually more, and maybe many more, jobs for athletes in the NBA than there are in musical theater on Broadway. And if you take the National Football League (NFL), I think there are more jobs that pay a living wage for athletes in the NFL than there are for all musical theater actors in the country, but I'd have a hard time proving that.</p>
<p>Following up on the idea that one has to attend a single school in order to have an acting career in any kind of theater, I agree with you that this is not true and that there are many paths. My own path was to attend a school just down the road from you that is not known for turning out great actors. If I hadn't gotten extraordinarily lucky and been cast in a LORT theater right out of school, and then worked with some very, very fine actors and learned from them, I wouldn't have made a living, I'm sure.</p>
<p>So, I think we're agreed that one does not have to attend CMU, CCM, UM, or one of the other top programs to become a good actor and make a living as an actor.</p>
<p>Thanks for the instructions on the quotes... </p>
<p>maybe the NBA seems so far for me because I don't know anyone in the NBA and I do know people making a living in the performing arts industry :) </p>
<p>... and yeah - excellent training, wherever one may find it, sure does help!</p>
<p>Yeah. It's hard to think of your friends as being as close to the top of the pyramid as pro athletes, but they are. Strange, isn't it? Too bad the pay isn't as good.</p>