<p>My friend is trying to decide which of these two schools to go to. For me the choice is fairly obvious, but she is still having a great deal of trouble trying to choose. There are a number of factors that are making this decision fairly arduous, and as you all know, time is running out.</p>
<p>Williams:
Will cost very little; no financial hardship, no debt.
She is worried about the distance from her home and feels it is too inaccessible and that she will have trouble coming home in case of a family emergency.
She is worried about the isolation and fears missing out on things like concerts, city life, etc.
They do not have a journalism program, although she likes their English program.
Worried about the smallness of the minority population
Worried about all the stuff people on here worry about...domination of atheltics, drinking culture, etc.</p>
<p>UMCP:
Gave her a loan and a renewable grant worth about $3000; she will have to take out loans to pay for the next 3 years though...about $20000 in debt by graduation.
Has a "good" journalism program, access to internships in DC
Near home (she would actually live at home)
More of a comfort zone (most of our graduation class attends)</p>
<p>My friend is very bright, hard-working, and she'd probably do very well at either school. She is relatively quiet and soft-spoken, but becomes much more vociferous when she is involved in a class or activity that she enjoys. She's been in public schools all her life, so she probably doesn't really understand the difference that small class sizes and dedicated teachers make...</p>
<p>She really just wants an unbiased opinion, because she's only been hearing the opinions of her cousin (who is pro-UMCP) and me (pro-LAC) for the past few weeks. She's never visited and only has a few days to make this decision.</p>
<p>Likewise, I’m shocked that your friend would consider UMCP over Williams. The caliber of Williams is superior in almost every regard, including but not limited to faculty attention, quality of classes, personal and financial support from the college, research opportunities, internship opportunities (e.g. great alumni networking and extremely generous grants available to students working non-profit internships), quality of the student body, and perhaps most importantly, the sorts of jobs that will be open to her upon graduation. And to have to borrow a good sum of money to attend a far inferior school? I’m sorry, but this is an easy decision. </p>
<p>I certainly can’t say that mine is an unbiased opinion. I graduated in 2008 and actually just came back from a trip up to Williamstown. But as a (minority) alum who absolutely loved his experience at Williams, I strongly encourage your friend to choose Williams.</p>
<p>In addition, though your friend would obviously think otherwise, I think that attending a school where many of her friends and high school classmates also attend is a drawback, not an advantage. Based on the experiences of high school friends of mine, this makes it way too easy to become cloistered within a rigid, stagnant social scene. On the other hand, purposely pushing herself to live beyond her comfort zone and encounter a whole new set of people will undoubtedly help her to mature and grow in ways she might not have at UMCP.</p>
<p>My first reaction was “What? Is she nuts?” pass up a full ride to Williams in order to live at home, go to a mid-tier university with her high school friends and end up $20,000 in debt? But then after thinking about it I realized that this young person is just not ready to let go and there’s a good chance that her experience at Williams would be a self-fullfilling prophesy. She believes she won’t like it: ergo, she won’t like it. By not bothering to visit Williams she has basically made up her mind. She doesn’t like what she doesn’t know. </p>
<p>I also wonder why any one who prefers an urban environment would even apply to Williams. The sports culture and the drinking culture are arguable. I tend to believe the former is pervasive; the latter is not. But the rural, insular location is simply a fact. If you have to have a city and all its amenities then Williams isn’t what you want.</p>
<p>She should let some one on the waitlist have the opportunity to attend Williams.</p>
<p>I agree with much of what has been said in response to your question on both this and the UMD thread. Students need to feel that they belong and are comfortable where they attend school but unfortunately your friend has no basis for comparison because she has not visited Williams. Our son had considered UMD his top choice for years. We have family in the area and he has been on the UMD campus several times. We are OOS and he visited the UMD campus twice this spring only to realize it was not the place for him. UMD likes to describe itself as a “public ivy” which now seems laughable to us. We were completely unimpressed by both the student body and the staff (There were a couple of exceptions). Compared to his other choices UMD seemed the weakest academically. The students and faculty at the other schools where he was accepted were head and shoulders above UMD’s. Then again, the undergrad experience is what you make of it and UMD offers a lot of choices. BTW, it might make it easier to get into the field and from what I’ve heard UMD’s program is strong, but you don’t need a journalism degree to go into journalism.
Although your friend feels that she might be more comfortable at UMD, the financial burden she will incur is something she must seriously take into account. With the money she is saving by going to Williams, she can travel home more frequently!
Students need to remember that there is no ONE right or perfect school. Williams will offer enormous opportunities to her but she should go in with the mindset that she wants to be there. MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE FOR HER TO DO WHATEVER IT TAKES TO VISIT WILLIAMS. She should also call the school, alumni, other students and discuss her concerns. If I had the same dilemma, I would send in the deposit to both schools and visit Williams before deciding. It would be money well spent if it means making the right decision.</p>
<p>What was the thought process in making choices for acceptance to any academic institution for this person?</p>
<p>Why did this person apply to Williams to begin with?</p>
<p>Clearly, fit, fore-seability never entered this person’s “raison d’etre” in pursuing a post secondary education.</p>
<p>She needs to go to UMCP, for this is her only choice.</p>
<p>Having the academic ability to enter into a great institution is only one aspect of an education. Why waste such an experience on someone who has no idea why they are there. They will only be unhappy here as they cannot appreciate its value.</p>
<p>I knew of a girl who scored 800’s on her SAT’s yet went to a school that was not even within any 4 tier school list. I believe she went to an unaccredited Christian College because of her imagined higher calling from up on high.</p>
<p>No point in putting fools in an extraordinary place, for only those who have a profound appreciation of what Williams has to offer can only avail themselves of its opportunities and thus be a profound credit to its alma mater.</p>
<p>To be honest, Maryland has highly ranked programs in certain disciplines, plus it is a full university in case a student decides to switch fields. For many people the decision would be a slam dunk, especially if the finances are close. However, it isn’t necessarily true for everybody. In our case, we’d be a full pay at Williams vs. Maryland at a fraction of the price, so in that case the $ topic cannot be avoided. </p>
<p>For some people, Williams might indeed be too small and isolated. For some people, Maryland is way too big and close-in suburban. And so on.</p>
<p>HorseRadish - I am disappointed to hear you call someone a “fool” for going to a Christian college because she felt it was right. A bit too much smugness for my taste, and not the kind of attitude that speaks well for Williams.</p>
<p>With NewTerp @5, & I’m sure there are others who would say the same thing-- </p>
<p>I too encourage your friend to visit during the week. It really would be worth the investment in time & money. She should contact the admissions office, especially if she would not be able to get there until soon after May 1.</p>
<p>Although there clearly are personal reasons for leaning toward UM, closing the door on an option without fully considering it with a visit does her/himself a disservice, especially because at some point s/he was interested enough to apply.</p>
<p>To know wisdom and to receive the instruction of wisdom, the fool forfeits.</p>
<p>It is not through intellectual deficiency as in mental powers I refer, but pray tell, what and where was the process that elected this person’s choices to begin with?</p>
<p>People of faith sometimes make choices as observed through their acts of self-righteousness. Perhaps this person feels more comfortable with their choice of UMCP, so be it. </p>
<p>Williams College may not be a better college than UMCP for this person, as it should be. One should not make choices based on ranking, prestige, other than what fits that singular person. Wisdom is not about seeking things or places or institutions, but about knowing what is best for them individually. UMCP may be the best fit for this student.</p>
<p>My reference to that person of faith that chose an unranked school was not made in mock gesture of their faith other than to demonstrate that fools despise wisdom and most assuredly walk in folly. And besides, what attitude did you perceive as uncharacteristic of Williams? I was demonstrating that even Christians with 800’s on their SAT’s choose unaccredited schools because they do not see themselves fit anywhere else. They found what they perceived they needed.</p>
<p>People are defined by the gods they create.</p>
<p>I have a feeling “HorseRadish” does not actually attend Williams (in fact I have a theory about who they really are which I won’t share here). But even if HorseRadish does, PLEASE do not read his/her posts as representative of anyone who actually does attend the school – believe me, they are not. </p>
<p>As for the original question, if she visits Williams and feels she would be unhappy there, she should not go. But otherwise it is a slam dunk, Williams will provide a far better education, among far more intellectually engaged students, with far better post-grad opportunities, without costing more, so it’s not even really a debate. Tell her to replace the word “Harvard” with Williams and ask her if it would even be a decision – if she would still be inclined towards UMD, fine, but if it just a product of not realizing just how good Williams is, she could really be passing up an amazing opportunity. Again, the only reason NOT to choose Williams, given those two choices, is if she really believes she would be unhappy there, socially.</p>
<p>This is why top-tier colleges aren’t successful at reaching out to poorer underrepresented students, for they do not enable those students to make the leap. </p>
<p>I am unimaginably shocked at the lack of understanding showed by some of the above posters.</p>
<p>Fiona, maybe you should elaborate because I am not sure what you mean (I certainly don’t see many “unimaginably shocking” comments on this thread, I think that statement is very unfair). And certainly, your comment does not apply to Williams, which does a HUGE amount of outreach, including participating in Questbridge and a summer pre-college academic program geared towards exactly the population you are talking about, among many other things. </p>
<p>As one example (and I think there is a similar program for humanities as well):</p>
<p>As I mentioned, Fiona, we don’t know who Horseradish is or what his/her agenda is, but whoever he/she is, they are not in any way representative of Williams or its students (and Horseradish has posted lots of other bizarre things in this forum, fyi). As I said, I wouldn’t impute anything to Williams or any other school based on comments of one zany poster, especially when Williams (like many of its peers) invests a lot of resources in outreach. Of course, there is only so much it can do – it is small school, in a rural location, with lots of kids from privileged or at least very academic environments, so not everyone will necessarly feel comfortable in that setting. But the school does what it can (and again, it is hardly unique in that regard) in terms of both admissions preferences and academic suppor both before and during the school year, and I wouldn’t base any sort of opinon on one poster.</p>
<p>But the quotes didn’t suggest “everyone should aspire to an Ivy League education” at all. If someone has no appreciation for the value of a high-quality liberal arts education, it’s indeed a little puzzling why he/she applied in the first place.</p>