<p>It is definitely possible to find a way to address the “no Junior AP” proactively and there definitely are schools that restrict access to AP so colleges will accept that if you explain it well. What you do need to do is demonstrate the capacity to do college level work and motivation to challenge yourself. So that can be done by taking community college classes, summer school college level work, online AP programs, etc. I looked into this because my daughter did a junior year program with a schedule that precluded taking any AP; she did take one AP class as a senior. You just need to start thinking about how he will present himself in a slightly different way that also demonstrates his capacity to do upper level work. AP classes can be great; they can also be drudgerous and unimaginative. They are certainly not a guarantee of admission anywhere so don’t be daunted.</p>
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<p>What it will demonstrate to colleges loud and clear in this case–which does not involve a schedule conflict–is that your son is not considered by his school to be one of their top students. Which, given his grades in honors classes, is ludicrous. It seems unlikely that the GC could, with a straight face, check the “most rigorous” box on the common app if he is shut out of APs. And if he is shut out this year, the likelihood is that he will be shut out next year. </p>
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<p>I agree that, failing the possibility that you can get him into the AP classes, this is the only alternative. And a good one. But it still seems grossly unfair that he can’t get into an AP class with an A+ in the honors precursor. </p>
<p>I’m really appalled by a policy that keeps a kid with an A+ in honors classes out of APs. It seems grossly unfair. There’s always room for one more. </p>
<p>My advice is to make a stink if they won’t listen to reason.</p>
<p>At D’s high school, there is some gatekeeping for AP courses, such as requiring previous honors courses, particular grades or teacher or department head permission. I do not think there are space limitations that would prevent a kid from taking an AP class, though.</p>
<p>Math and science are not necessarily “packaged” at this school. Biology and math are not considered together at all. Chemistry and physics both have math prerequisites. To get into AP Chemistry, you need to have taken honors chemistry, and acceptance into honors chemistry is tied to your math course and grade. On the other hand, anyone who has had chemistry can get into AP Biology.</p>
<p>I would definitely push the administration harder on this. But if that doesn’t work . . . Has your son considered taking an AP class online? How about getting the syllabus for the AP courses at his high school from the teachers and making sure he keeps up with that class even though he’s taking the regular class? Then he might be in a good position to do well on the AP exam, and this might be better than a review book alone.</p>
<p>Wow. I think I would definitely be making a stink. WHY can’t he take biology if he loves it and excels at it? Just how much math is in that class? (Principal, please show me the pages). This is absolutely horrible gatekeeping. I would also ask son if he is truly happy at this school. If the answer is “not really” I’d do whatever driving/busing/hiking necessary to get him into another HS (look for one that would welcome him with open arms)</p>
<p>I truly would be asking questions of the administration along the lines of:
- What is the ethnic makeup of those students allowed into AP? Any offspring of immigrants?
- What is the gender % in AP (any sexual bias?)
- Who evaluates the on-the-spot essays? Do they take into account that males may be more articulate with the spoken response?<br>
- If there is more interest than spots, why aren’t there more classes being opened? It is to the high school’s advantage, reputation wise, to have lots of students in AP</p>
<p>Never agree to an appointment with a narrow time window (such as for the few minutes before class begins). It is too easy for them to meet with you and then brush you off. Wear comfortable clothing and be prepared with a book and a water bottle. If they have to rush off, then announce that you will follow them and wait until they have more time to discuss this further. </p>
<p>My sons have high tolerance for a loud, obnoxious mother. Not every kid is that way. Tell your kid that one path open is for you to wear a large sign on the edge of campus that states “THIS SCHOOL WON’T TEACH THOSE WHO WANT TO LEARN” or some such. Would he be ok with a publicity stunt like that? After all, it could open doors for more students than just he. If he is shy, you can still tell that GC that you are seriously thinking about protesting. You may find that there are lots of parents and students who are tired of this administrations gatekeeping. Good luck!</p>
<p>I doubt that you’re the only parent with concerns about placements in AP classes, and if you can address the issue with other concerned parents and with information about how other schools make AP decisions, that will increase your chances of opening the classes to your son and to other students who are being unfairly excluded. </p>
<p>You can bring the issue to your PTA/PTO as well as to the school superintendent, principal, school board, and local media. The policy doesn’t make any sense.</p>
<p>I have not read the whole thread.</p>
<p>On the issue of Biology, there is no reason to bar a student from a biology course on the grounds that he is “weak” in math. Math is not required for Biology. It is only really needed for Physics, which is why AP-Calc is usually required to be taken before or concurrently with AP Physics. </p>
<p>On the issue of crowded AP classes. The solution is not to exclude excellent students (A+ nacht) but to find alternatives. Students should be allowed to take online AP-classes which are many; some are not terribly expensive. Or they could be allowed to enrol at the local college for dual credit. They would then be in a position to take the AP exam next May (but anyone can take the exam without taking the AP class).</p>
<p>I do think that this is an issue for the board. Are other excellent students also being excluded on account of space? It would be good to get a group of parents to raise a stink with the board.</p>
<p>X-posted with NSM.</p>
<p>There seems to be some transparency issues with the selection process for this class.</p>
<p>Let’s see… They evaluate the grade in the pre-requisite honors class(es) - legitimate. They seem to evaluate teacher recommendations - legitimate. They ask for a student essay explaining “why” the applicant should be admitted to the class - pointless.</p>
<p>School officials are in the business of allocating scarce resources where they will make the most impact. Professional evaluation through measurement of knowlegde (grades) and professionally trained evaluation of a known subject (teacher recommendations) are valid ways to judge whether a student is qualified and motivated to make the best use of a class. Throwing in another subjective measurement on a single data point (kid could have a bad day writing) seems arbitrary and unnecessary. Could give department head arbitrary excuse to favor/disfavor certain students.</p>
<p>The more likely problem with getting the right kids into the AP Classes in this case is a badly inflated grading curve. I wonder how many other kids in hyeonlee’s son’s classes had A+ grades? How many had A grades? How many sections of honors prereqs were feeding a single section of the AP class? You’ve got to set your grading to ensure that an A+ grade absent a poor teacher recommendation (highly unlikely) is an automatic admit. An A- grade should require a strong recommendation. I’d take the B+ student who’s evaluation shows a higher upward trend over the A- student who was underperforming. That is where the teacher recommendations come into play.</p>
<p>If the students are all turning in 100% papers, then you need to make the curriculum a bit more rigorous. Simple solution to the abundance of A grades.</p>
<p>Giving 50% or more A grades in Honors classes does an injustice to the student body as it does not allow for merit based evaluations going forward. Yes we don’t want to punish students for taking an agressive work load. But that is why there are weighted GPAs.</p>
<p>Hyeonlee, when approaching the school on your follow-up, you should ask for a grade point distribution chart for all feeding classes to the AP curriculum both by class and by student. You can then identify whether there is a grade inflation factor here (too many honors kids with perfect GPAs, and whether your son ranks high enough where his admission to the class should be done regardless of his essay (probably in the top 10 to 15 of the candidates). If there are 35 kids with straight A averages and they are using your son’s B in math (unrelated to many APs) to screen him out of appropriate APs, your issue is with the grading policy that rewards more balanced students over (A+) more specialized students.</p>
<p>If nothing else, you can get an answers as to why this happened, which I think you deserve.</p>
<p>This is interesting. My son’s HS does quite a bit of hand-holding concerning course load & selection, and I remember being told that selective colleges did expect to see some AP courses on an applicant’s transcript, but nowhere in the process do I remember being told that it was necessary (or even helpful) to take them before senior year. So when my son’s junior year course schedule turned out not to have a single AP on it, it didn’t raise any red flags for me. Considering that he had struggled a bit in his sophomore year, I thought waiting till senior year for the APs might be just as wise. Certainly no red flags were raised by his GC. Now it sounds like we missed the boat.</p>
<p>Does this mean the three APs he’s got scheduled for senior year aren’t going to do him any good? Or is it just that most kids take APs in both years? </p>
<p>Geez, there’s never any lack of things to worry yourself sick about, is there…?</p>
<p>EDIT: Chelsea0011, I missed your post before. That’s very comforting, especially considering that three out of those four schools are on our short list.</p>
<p>Our school will let anybody take AP’s. </p>
<p>If it turns out that the OP’s S is not allowed to take the AP’s this year, would it make his schedule (on his transcript) “more challenging” if he took a couple of CC classes?</p>
<p>S2 took 2 AP’s his junior yr. and two CC classes his senior yr.</p>
<p>S private school blocked him from 2 APs jr yr b/c of space (& other kids had better grades) . I was beside myself since we were paying huge tuition dollars and I felt they were short changing his chances. At our local HS he could have enrolled in unlimited APs.</p>
<p>I fought for it- didn’t win & then took a holistic approach-- whatever else S you are doing do it REALLY well. EC’s & grades soared & he was happy. Ultimatley he is going to the same if not better school than the kids who had the APs jr year.</p>
<p>BTW-- he & another kid did take the English lit AP exam w/out the class & that became one of his college essays- his friend (now at Notre Dame) scored 5 , mine did not … oh well. 
The AP rigor game is brutal b/c it is measurable but maybe there is a sliver lining.</p>
<p>FYI-- on to the IB Debate–be glad that you do not have the IB program, it penalizes the rest. If a student does not take a full IB Diploma the GC cannot check off that the student took the most rigorous program available.</p>
<p>At our high school, they say the AP classes are open admission. I suppose they would try to do something to talk you out of registering for an AP class if it were absolutely clear you were out of your league, but any student with a reasonably good past in a subject is allowed to give the AP class a try. I think this is a good way to do it. Our students take a lot of AP classes. </p>
<p>Not only isthe policy the OP describes unfair; I think it sounds like a mean-spirited way for “certain people” to pick and choose who is “worthy.” Ugh!</p>
<p>Our D’s prep school (all girls school) did not offer a huge selection of AP classes. They required an application and essay and the Department Chair’s approval before a student could be admitted to an AP class. The same was true for their Honors classes. My D told me that near the end of the year in her Honors PreCalc class, several of the girls were told that they would not be allowed to apply for AP Calc. One of the girls is her best friend and ,in her case, this screening actually turned out correctly. She took the regular Calculus class and ended up failing the final.</p>
<p>That being said, all of the private universities my D applied to said that they evaluate each student in the context of their high school. Did they challenge themselves academically throughout their high school experience? A lack of Honors/AP classes taken in my D’s school could not be considered a most rigorous curriculum.</p>
<p>My D graduated with a 3.997 GPA with 9 AP/Honors classes. Her friend (the one that failed her Calc final) graduated with a 4.1 with 2 AP/Honors and was a National Merit Commended student. In most other areas the girls were similar. They both applied to Stanford and my daughter was the one admitted. A handwritten note from my D’s admissions officer said that her passion, determination and commitment to excellence made her application stand out. (he probably wrote that on every note he sent)</p>
<p>My D used the additional information section of her common app to explain her lack of straight As and anything else she felt needed explaining. Your child can do the same. Look into the online options and other opportunities that will demonstrate his passion. Good luck!</p>
<p>At our school they try to set standards for who gets into AP classes, but if a parent protests the decision the student will usually get in. According to my kids the downside to this that too many weak students end up getting in and it really puts a drag on some of the classes. </p>
<p>I know this doesn’t apply at all to the OP. Just saying that there’s also a downside when access to AP classes doesn’t have enough filters. </p>
<p>Of course, in the OPs case, I think what they’ve done isn’t right at all. Even if it doesn’t become a problem with admissions, it might hurt on the level of being competitive for some scholarships.</p>
<p>At D’s school, you have to have certain prerequisites and a certain grade before you can take an AP. They do make it incredibly difficult for anyone other than juniors and seniors to take AP classes with all the requirements/scheduling etc. D couldn’t take one till junior year. Most AP classes are not open to juniors - this year, they had several juniors apply for AP Bio only to be turned away (class was only open to seniors) We did protest - and thankfully, they added a second AP Bio class and let juniors take that class.</p>
<p>It does appear that in the past few years, more and more kids are opting to take AP classes leading to the crowding/no space issues. Our school is also pretty rigid with scheduling/requirements - my friend’s S at a different school tool AP Physics in his freshman year - would never have happened at our school.</p>