@PurpleTitan , @natty1988 I took the quote you both referred to as referencing FA disadvantages not general life disadvantages. And as you so aptly point out those kids didn’t choose which family they were born into so why should they be penalized by the withholding of merit aid recognizing their academic achievements.
@warblersrule but what percentage of those kids stay in California after graduation? Maybe just a question of timing.
And I’m sure the schools those students from $250K families attend welcome them with open arms.
@vpa2019: “I took the quote you both referred to as referencing FA disadvantages not general life disadvantages.”
Why are you separating one from the other?
There are advantages and disadvantages to whatever race, gender, SES, height, various genes you are born in to. Railing about one small disadvantage when not taking in to account the various advantages you have seems a bit lacking in perspective (and gratitude).
“And as you so aptly point out those kids didn’t choose which family they were born into so why should they be penalized by the withholding of merit aid recognizing their academic achievements”
Why should kids be penalized simply by being born poor? Or do you say that being born poor is no disadvantage?
I think with OP’s income, that is about right. Our HS announces all the scholarships kids got, even if they don’t attend the school. I thought that was strange. But, they don’t announce the amount, thankfully.
“I’m surprised that GCs are advising about merit scholarships and FA. In our local HS, the GCs are not involved at all with advising on the financial end of things. The most they’d do is, maybe, drop a line in conversation like,“I’ve seen a lot of students get big merit aid from xxxx.” But they wouldn’t help devise an application strategy based on the financial part of the equation. The school/district thinks it’s too tricky and outside the purview of a GC.”
I’d argue how could you NOT discuss the money part when advising on colleges? Just like posters giving advice here on CC will want to know what a poster/family can afford. Affordability very much needs to be part of a good college discussion and strategy. Any GC NOT taking that into consideration if needed isn’t doing half their job, IMO.
@PurpleTitan the poor shouldn’t be penalized but then why should upper middle class kids be penalized? Only poor kids are deserving of help? The whole concept that families making $250K are some how rich is a joke, especially a family living in California. They also pay taxes which support the public university system. Why shouldn’t they be eligible for merit?
The whole “privilege” thing is overrated and over used. Poor kids receive help everywhere…governments are obsessed with trying to address poverty, huge amounts of tax dollars are earmarked for it, programs like questbridge give them amazing access to elite universities, internships are reserved for them and I could go on and on.
My point was that quote was in reference to FA and you expanded it to include more, which didn’t seem to be the poster’s intent. It wasn’t my post. I full pay so I’m subsidizing those poor kids through my full tuition payment, institutional donations, taxes etc… I’d like a gratitude for that instead of all the complaining about privilege.
People seem to have decidedly odd opinions on what constitutes a livable salary in California. The median household income in California is $67,169. The median household incomes in LA and San Francisco are $54,501 and $96,265 per year, respectively.
A mere 11% of California households earn over $200K per year. Being expected to pay the full $30K COA at the UCs seems pretty reasonable to me.
^I didn’t say many people made that I said those people are unlikely to consider themselves rich.
And none of them can afford to live here anymore @warblersrule . I know that there is a mass exodus going on, from families who have lived here for generations. I don’t think anyone making $200k is looking for a full ride, but the UCs are 20% of our salaries and just because we make that now doesn’t mean we’ve all worked straight through. As for me, I only went back to work when my kids were in High school. Assuming my daughter gets no financial aid because we “make too much”, I’m looking at 40% of our income to send our kids to 1/2 way decent schools. Do people who make less have 40% to give? No, but they receive some financial aid. I know I’ve made choices, and I don’t expect violins, but all they really see is current income and make assumptions.
I was a Pell Grant kid and I’m upper-middle class now, so I’m certainly not complaining about privilege (did you think I was complaining about myself?), but I certainly recognize privilege when I see it. It’s a simple fact that my kids will have resources and advantages that were not available to me or kids who are poor now.
That their chances at merit scholarships at the most elite colleges are nonexistent/low just doesn’t strike me as the greatest injustice in the world. Whether I’d be willing to pay the rather insane amounts that private colleges demand from full-pay families for 4 years of undergrad is still up in the air (from a purely relative ROI perspective, no, it’s not worth it, IMO), but frankly, I don’t think they will be handicapped even if I didn’t. Just coming from a loving supportive 2-parent upper-middle-class family with some resources should put them in good stead. After that, their life will be up to them, in any case.
I have to say, the OP’s post was a bit odd. If they are CA residents, they pay between $25 and $35K for a UC, depending on housing costs. Where does the $85K EFC come from? If the OP’s child’s stats were very high and they wanted merit, why didn’t they apply to schools like USC, Alabama, Ohio State, etc. that offer large merit awards?
The service academies are not free, even if they cost $500K/student. That’s probably because they are training on planes, helicopters, ships, boats, and tanks part time. And calling a 4 year commitment where you put your life on the line every day ‘free’ is just shameful.
@overbearingmom , I left CA quite awhile ago for the midwest, and some of my family is still in CA, but fortunately somewhat shielded by Prop13. Taxes and crime keep going up and the education system gets worse every year. The younger ones have all left, the older and retired ones are toughing it out. It’s not so bad in LaJolla and Santa Barbara. Lots of very happy refugees from CA, IL, NY etc. in the Midwest enjoying the low taxes and cost of living.
When I took my youngest son to Cal for college visits he looked at the peeling paint, crumbling concrete, and panhandling homeless and immediately scratched it off his list. So sad to see what has happened to CA.
@TooOld4School My daughter is looking in the Midwest and East Coast and my son is at UCONN and as soon as they both graduate, we are out of here (want to let them have their breaks where they’ve grown up so they can hang with their friends).
[quoye]I’d argue how could you NOT discuss the money part when advising on colleges?
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@doschicos our public school counselors can tell a student the cost of the colleges. They can suggest that the families review the costs to attend…but they are absolutely forbidden to discuss family finances with students.
And you know…I agree with this. Frankly, it’s none of the GCs business what our family income and assets are.
@doschicos @thumper1 Yeah, the GCs here can of course refer to finances, as in, “Make sure you run the NPCs.” They can point families toward sources of information on need-based and merit aid. But they can’t give tailored advice, as in, “I see your family’s EFC is $10k, so let’s talk about options you can afford.” It is the family’s responsibility to research and understand the financial part of it.
Our guidance counselor would only know the family’s income if they mentioned it to them…
@TooOld4School not to sound rude, but that is just one UC campus. We’ve toured plenty of UC and CSU campuses that are perfectly well kept. And I’ve seen rough around the edges state schools in other states.
@natty1988 , I’m sure you are correct, but it’s still pretty lame. S2 was only interested in Cal in the UC system because of his major. There is no excuse for the UC flagship to be in that condition. The homeless problem seems to be ubiquitous in CA, and that can’t be limited to a single campus.
I’m confused about this post. If the income is at that level, what happened to the college savings?
Is there a reason that a 529 account was not considered before the budget and college applications were discussed?
Are people assuming that the families now do not need to save money for college?
@“aunt bea” some people do not have college savings despite having incomes to support college savings.
Our financial advisor told us to fully fund retirement…not college. And that is what we did. BUT we also were both working parents and were able to pay for college out of current earnings.
With a $275,000 a year income…I would hope this family can fund college…their instate publics are likely attainable financially.
Plus the high income could be relatively recent. I think the ones hurt the most with financial aid are the ones who start out lower income and maybe high student loan payments preventing them from saving and then their career and income shoot up just before the college years.