Nontraditional, Questions

<p>I've recently decided to get back on the medical school track, and I was hoping you folks could provide some insight.</p>

<ol>
<li>I have 12 credits left to finish (OChem 1 & 2 w/ lab, and another Bio); I'll have to take these at night (as I need to work to live, of course).</li>
</ol>

<ul>
<li>Should I take them at my original UG institution? Does it matter?</li>
<li>Can the Biology be anything, or does it require a lab (I already have one Bio w/ lab under my belt, i.e. the standard frosh bio course)? Could I take an anatomy & physiology course online?</li>
</ul>

<ol>
<li>I will likely be relocating soon to fulfill #1 (I cannot continue working in my current position), and I have a BS in Math with a minor in Statistics.</li>
</ol>

<ul>
<li>Do you think I could get a job in a research lab? (if I could get a job at my UG I would get a discount on the credits that I still need to take)</li>
<li>Alternatively, does it really matter where I work, as long as I am working? (with respect to being competitive in the med school admin process)</li>
</ul>

<ol>
<li>MCATs. I still need to take them.</li>
</ol>

<ul>
<li>Should I take them ASAP, or wait until after I finish the aforementioned credits?</li>
<li>If I take them before this summer, would I be able to apply and then interview with schools while I finish up the last 12 credits? (allowing me to matriculate one year earlier, provided that there are no bumps in my road)</li>
</ul>

<ol>
<li>LORs. I feel like I am in a hole as far as this goes--it's been over a year since I graduated.</li>
</ol>

<ul>
<li>Would a LOR from my current employer count for anything?</li>
<li>My UG has a premed committee--do you think they would still be willing to write a letter for me? (I will be contacting them soon, just wondering what to expect)</li>
</ul>

<p>Sorry for all of the questions. I'm glad to be back on track, but I have a lot of hurdles to overcome. Any insight is appreciated.</p>

<p>My D1 is a non-trad. (She has a physics & math degree and decided only right before graduation she wanted to try for med school. 3 years later–she’s now a first year med student.)</p>

<ol>
<li>It doesn’t matter where you take your remaining credits so long as they’re from an accredited and recognized US college. It would be better to take them at a more recognized school–state flagship vs. unknown directional state U–if possible.</li>
</ol>

<p>If you have the required 2 semesters of freshman bio plus 2 semesters of labs–that’s all you need to apply at MOST schools. (Individual school have differing requirements so you’ll need to check specific requirements at the schools you’re most interested, esp ALL your in-state options.)</p>

<p>If you’ve only taken 1 semester of freshman bio, you need to complete the sequence. You MUST have 2 semesters of general bio. You MUST have 2 semesters of lab credits in addition to the lecture classes. D1 found A&P helpful, but it’s not a pre-req at most schools.</p>

<p>Don’t take online courses. They have a poor reputation with med schools, even if offered thru a reputable university. You cannot fulfill lab requirements via an online class.</p>

<ol>
<li>You can certainly try to get a lab job with a uni. These jobs are in high demand, though, and it may be difficult to find one. Consider taking a IT position–you’d still get the tuition remission. (Be aware that tuition remission employee benefits don’t kick in until AFTER you’ve worked 1 full calendar year at most schools.)</li>
</ol>

<p>It doesn’t really matter where you work in terms of its influence on med school admissions. Among D1’s med school classmates are waitpersons, community college tutors, wilderness guides/ski instructors, high school teachers, Best Buy salespersons, truck drivers…Med schools understand you need an income to keep body and soul together.</p>

<p>Be thoughtful in relocating. Since you will become an in-state resident for wherever you move to, take a look at the med schools in your potential new home. California is a bad place to be if want to apply in-state (too many applicants, not enough slots); Texas is a good place to be if you want to apply in state (several strong in-state options to choose from). Other states fall in-between. </p>

<ol>
<li>Do NOT attempt the MCAT until you’ve completed the minimum required courses. The MCAT isn’t at all like the SAT/ACT. MCAT requires extensive specific knowledge of the course material. I’d also strongly suggest you take a MCAT prep course before you attempt the MCAT.</li>
</ol>

<p>While med schools will allow you to apply and interview with required coursework pending, 12 credits is too many. Med schools want to see your grades for critical required classes, esp. 2 completed semesters of OChem.</p>

<ol>
<li>LORs from an employer won’t be looked at. Period. Med schools have specific requirements about who LORs must come from. Generally at least 2 of your 3 LORS must come from your science profs.</li>
</ol>

<p>If your UG offers a committee letter, then you ought to contact the pre-health advising office and see what you need to do to get current with them. Generally most schools will work with alums for up to 5 years after graduation.</p>

<p>~~~~~</p>

<p>Other advice–if you haven’t started doing medically related volunteer work or have not participated in community service before now–get started ASAP. Both of those are critical, esp for non-trads.</p>

<p>And still more advice: the MCAT is changing format starting Jan 2015. The new exam will include more science/math materials (biochem, stats, cellular & molecular bio, genetics) and will have an additional humanities section (psych, soc, ethics, possibly some anthro and philosophy). Because of this entrance requirements for med school are changing. Be sure you check and double check each med school you’re interested in for what courses they require. Some schools have already announced new admission pre-reqs.)</p>

<p>WoWMom–</p>

<p>Thank you for your response. Would you be willing to expand on a few things?</p>

<p>1) What do you mean by state flagship versus unknown directional state U? I will definitely have to put a pretty tight budget together to make this happen, and as such, cost will be a significant factor when choosing where to finish off the prereqs (along with offering what I need at workable time slots). This might not leave me with a plethora of options, but I wouldn’t want to hurt my chances either.</p>

<p>2) Your last comment about the MCAT concerns me. I did check the medical schools in my state and none mention any changes yet, but I will not be able to apply until Summer of 2013 at the earliest, with a definite chance that delays could occur (after all, life happens). It would be extremely troubling to have everything done (as far as I know), only to discover that I have 3-4 more hurdles to jump. It wouldn’t make sense to me if there wasn’t some sort of transitional overlap (i.e. implement new requirements in 2015 but accept old requirements for 2-3 more years), but I do understand that life isn’t always fair and medical school admissions is very competitive. How swift do you think this change will be?</p>

<p>Just wanted to add to number 1 in not so many words; does that mean taking the credits at a community college is out?</p>

<p>1) I understand being on a budget. D1 had to finance her own post-bacc coursework. She worked 2 part-time jobs (more than 40 hrs/wk) and took out student loans to do so. </p>

<p>What I meant was to take your coursework at the best available local option. Med schools want to be able to make meaningful comparisons between applicants. If you have As from a totally unfamiliar school and there’s another candidate with As from a well-regarded school–the other guy will likely get the nod. Adcoms tend to put more faith in LORS and grades from schools they are more familiar with. (It’s a purely human tendency.) Also you will need to explain why you’re taking classes at no-name U if other (better) options are available to you. (It can be interpreted as you’re looking for the easy way to improve your GPA.)</p>

<p>2) No, no transitional period. New MCAT rolls out in Jan. 2015 and new admission requirements will be in effect (at least at those schools who have already announced changes) beginning Fall 2016. From med schools’ POV, they are giving you advance notice of the change—3+ years. Med schools have been known to add pre-reqs at the last minute and still expect incoming students to meet them. (Like announce it in January for those starting that fall. Happens all the time.)</p>

<p>But this is an evolving situation and it’s as yet unclear exactly how this will be implemented at all schools. I do think, though, it’s unlikely that med schools will ever admit students under two different sets of requirements. (Too many possibilities for law suits.)</p>

<p>Community college is definitely out. Pre-reqs need to be taken at a 4 year, degree granting college or university.</p>

<p>BTW, looking at your older threads—you will need to make sure that your previous coursework still falls within the the time parameters set by the schools you’re interested in. Science credits do expire in the eyes of med schools. I think pre-reqs older than 5 years (not 100% sure about that) won’t be considered as current by most schools and may need to be retaken.</p>

<p>The age of my prereqs vary, but the oldest one is Physics I (from Fall 2006). When you say 5 years old, do you mean 5 years from when I took the course, or 5 years from graduation? I will mention this to my UG’s premed office when I contact them (as well as research some of the medical schools I am interested in).</p>

<p>Thanks again for all of the great advice, you’ve given me a lot to think about. Tough road ahead!</p>

<p>ETA: I just wanted to clarify something–it seems pretty clear in your post that you mean the course itself was taken 5 years ago and not that it has been 5 years since graduation, but I asked the question anyway because the prior doesn’t make much sense to me. If I had went straight to medical school from college, my physics prereq would have been 4 years old upon matriculation–if I had taken a year off, it would have been 5 years. If I had taken an extra semester or two to graduate, taken a year off, and then applied, I would fall outside of that barrier. I know that you mentioned you were not 100% sure on that, and that it varies by school, but that would baffle me if it were true. I feel like a recent MCAT is more than enough to verify someone is capable of doing the work, and that 5 year time-frame would easily disqualify more traditional candidates that may have hit a few roadblocks along the way. Sorry, this may be a bit more of a rant than anything–and in no way is meant as an affront to you–I just am having a hard time processing the idea that prereqs can expire.</p>

<p>I’m not 100% sure the timeframe is 5 years. It might be 7. Or longer. I believe the issue is science moves forward; information gets outdated; students forget stuff. </p>

<p>Also grading policies and course contents change over time. Med schools want to able to compare apples to apples when considering applicants.</p>

<p>MCAT scores have a short shelf life: 3 years from the testing date.</p>

<p>If there’s going to be large gap between most of your pre-reqs and your application, you need to email the Dean of Medicine at any med school you’re thinking of applying to and ask for their policy. When you get a reply, KEEP IT. Just in case. </p>

<p>Med school policies were not designed with non-trads in mind and while medical schools have become much, much more open to non-trads in the past 10 years, there are still hoops adcoms will make you jump thru.</p>

<p>I think the 2015 change has already been posted at some heavy research based medical institutions. They give full detail on what is required. In fact, some of them (not all) will begin to NECESSITATE a full year of calc-based physics…so when they mention more math, I guess it meant that it also increased application of the subject in various other areas of sciences. I guess the whole change isn’t being advertised as much as it needs to be but then I believe many schools will begin that at 2012 for the 2016 entering undergrad class since many will take the test during their junior year. :(</p>