We are less than 2 weeks away from hearing about DD admissions decisions from the 6 NYC private schools she applied to. I was always the bigger proponent of NYC schools over NJ suburban schools relative to my wife but she is dead set on not living an apartment lifestyle and having a traditional suburban lifestyle with a single family home and large yard. So that pretty much rules out the 4 UES schools she applied to (not that getting in is by any means assured) and leaves only Horace Mann and Riverdale Country as possible options for a suburban commute.
Does anyone know which Westchester suburbs and NJ suburbs are well represented in the student body of these schools? So far our research into which suburbs to move to from our current location across the Hudson (think JC/Hoboken) has been focused on the towns most convenient for the 3 suburban NJ private schools DD has applied to (Pingry, NA, Kent). Don’t know much at all about which towns would make sense for the Hilltop schools.
Appreciate any input people have, the parents on this board have always been very helpful and insightful.
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There is busing from NJ to the Hill schools. I’ve seen kids (in fact, a family of three and the youngest one was young, like 2nd grade or something) from Saddle River. I also know families from Englewood and Edgewater that are at Riverdale. There are many families that commute from way lower Manhattan and Brooklyn on the bus and that’s further away from the Hill Schools than JC. I also know families from various NJ towns that attend the UES schools, so it’s totally do-able. There are also a ton of families from all over Westchester and even CT who go to the Hill schools, so just wait to see how it shakes out. One family we know has older kids and they take the ferry from JC that lands near the Javits Center and the school bus picks them up from there and brings the up to school. Anything is doable and it might be an adjustment, but your kid definitely won’t be the only one. Good luck and I hope it’s great news!
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@parentofnicekid thanks for your response and I am glad to hear that there are families commuting from NJ to Hilltop schools. Surprised to hear that some from N suburbs are commuting to UES schools as I thought even Westchester to UES schools would be a stretch. We are definitely moving out from JC to suburbs though because (1) my wife insists and (2) our girls are old enough that I think they need easier access to athletics and sports and could benefit from the space. We are only a week away from hearing about the NYC schools to which we applied so I will defer the discussion till I know there is something actionable to discuss. Thanks once again for taking the time to respond!
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Great news and I am really excited! The first decision we have received for our older daughter for Grade 6 was Spence and she got in!
She had a ISEE test score of 8/6 in VR/RC and 7/7 in QR/MA so proof that you don’t need all 8s or mix of 8s and 9s to get in to the top schools. Tbf her 6 in RC was not reflective of her true capabilities and she was thrown off by user interface of the test. She had a 9/9 in a CTP test administered last year by ERB for her school and I sent an email with an explanation.
But I need some advice on feasibility of attending Spence if you don’t live in Manhattan. My wife is dead set on a suburban, single family home lifestyle after a decade plus of living in a 2-Br apartment and does not want apartment living in Manhattan.
Do parents with kids at any UES school know which towns in NJ and Westchester suburbs send a decent number of kids to your school and what kind of transportation arrangements are involved? My cut-off is a 45 minute commute each way for my daughter. Longer than that seems too arduous for a kid. Thanks for any help - my wife is set on the NJ private schools (she was even lukewarm on Hilltop schools which I think are easier to get too from NJ or Westchester suburbs) but I think it would be a pity to pass up a Spence admission.
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Congratulations to your DD! Quite an accomplishment.
If I were you , I would reach out directly to the admissions director at Spence. Once they’ve admitted you they will probably bend over backwards giving you information. Ask your specific question…which NJ and Westchester suburbs are most represented at Spence? This will matter for your daughter, not only for her commute (which she won’t mind - trust me) but also for her friend connections, hang-outs, weekend get-togethers, sports, etc.
I have two boys who traveled the reverse commute, from Manhattan to Fordham Prep. It took them 50-60 minutes each way - they didn’t mind (but after 4 years they were ready for a break). More importantly, friend connections, hang-outs, and weekend get-togethers were tough because all their friends lived up in Westchester (we did ALOT of driving). I wouldn’t change anything we did, but its just something you should consider.
Best of luck and congratulations!
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Thank you @STEM2017 that is a great point they might be willing to share more information about where kids commute from at this point. The websites of the schools are always vague and just mention that lots of zipcodes are represented.
Yes my concern is also about her social life outside of school. If she can’t meet her friends outside of school hours and activities then that is a huge bummer. She tends to be a very self-sufficient kid and doesn’t need or make a lot of friends outside of a core group of 2-3 kids (total contrast to her younger sister) but I want her to be more social in middle school.
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After S17 accepted his spot at FP (oh so many years ago), the admissions head actually gave me a contact list of all the parents of the FP kids from Manhattan. It was very useful and helped us to get S17 started with a few new friends even before day 1.
Good luck!
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I think to go to the UES from NJ (from a decent town) will be quite a hike. You’ll take at least 2 trains (NJ transit + subway). I would not recommend doing that.
My DC’s school on UWS has several kids who commute in from NJ (including my own), but all of them are from Jersey City and/or Hoboken. It’s usually about 40 min in the morning, but longer in the afternoon (and that’s PATH + subway).
For the sake of your DD, I’d recommend you take a hard look at wanting both UES school + “home with a lawn” desire, and see if satisfying both is worth it, and or even makes sense.
Is it do-able? Absolutely (some kids travel to Regis from Staten Island, so that bus + ferry + subway) ! Will it be fun? Will the lawn be worth the commute for 6 years? That’s for you to decide.
At a minimum, pick a town (that you’d like to live in), and try to do the commute with your DD for a few times (in the morning, and afternoon, to mimic real commute), and get a feel for yourself how it goes. Perhaps that’ll give you a better grasp whether it’s really do-able.
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Thanks @sonatarhia I think you got to the crux of the matter. I don’t really think a commute less than an hour each way is doable for UES schools from NJ or Westchester suburbs or even Jersey City/Hoboken. So eventually I think it is going to need a reassessment from my wife on how much she values the suburban lifestyle vs attending a school like Spence.
She has concerns around fitting in to the UES culture of parents at these schools. We are what I would describe as mass affluent and not some dual Managing Director Wall Street power couple pulling in millions each year. Ironically she is the one who has grown up in affluent CT suburbs, attended boarding school and gone to a prestigious undergrad. I grew up lower middle class in India and am a first generation immigrant yet have less concerns on this front than she does. The way I see it you don’t need to compete with the Joneses and I am sure there are parents who are down-to-earth and it is not even necessarily a mutually exclusive category with those who might be big hitters in their professional lives.
An update, older DD also got into Riverdale Country. That might be a more feasible commute from a NJ suburb like Englewood Cliffs or Westchester suburbs. If anyone is doing the commute from NJ or Westchester schools to the Hilltop schools would love to have your feedback.
Absolutely! There’s probably more parent involvement for middle school, but I can’t comment on that since my DC joined in 9th. At 9th grade, there’s very little parent interaction (unless you volunteer a ton at school and therefore meet others - but Covid put an end to most in-person interactions). It’s all about the kids in 9th grade.
BTW, Spence and Riverdale are great schools (and hard to get in)! Your girls must be pretty amazing! Congrats!
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Thank you @sonatarhia our elder DD does have a couple of strong EC accomplishment areas but tbh her report cards were not exceptional, merely above average because she tends to only show passion and application in things she really likes and does not put in the effort we would like where she does not engage for whatever reason.
She surprised both parents with her ability to apply to 9 schools and juggle essays, school specific tests, and interviews. She is a quiet but strong and confident kid and I am glad she got some validation from this process and we have told her that starting in 6th Grade perhaps she could show more realization of what we know she is capable of in the classroom and not just do enough to get a reasonably decent assessment from her teachers.
Right now my biggest challenge is getting my wife to look past stereotypes and perceptions. She has a strongly held perception of Spence’s culture as being snooty/mean girls as opposed to say Kent Place school in suburban NJ (where our niece goes to school). My wife is basing this on her knowledge of Spence girls at her alma matter and what her colleagues who attended UES private schools say. I keep telling her that these are possibly quite dated perceptions now (we are late 40s) and subjective stereotypes. Most of these schools are more alike than they are different and I don’t want to fetishize minor cultural differences.
If any parents have feedback on the culture at Spence and Riverdale I would appreciate it. At Nightingale the culture of the school came across very well during the various admissions we attended - it feels like a nurturing and non-cut throat competition place. Our younger daughter could only apply there for Grade 4 and did get in as well. My main concerns with Nightingale are a smaller senior class size which sometimes can have adverse implications for Sports and EC activities.
Happy to report older DD got into Horace Mann as well. So that gives us the option of two Hilltop schools.
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Congratulations @jcparent !
These are very competitive schools.
Is your DD FP for FA applicant?
Which school did you decide to enroll?
Hi @chemsider we are a full-pay family and have no particular hook (not super-powered jobs i.e. likelihood of being a big hitter as a future donor, no alumni or family connections) and as a Asian Indian family not an under-represented minority either. So far my daughter has admits to Grade 6 for Spence, Horace Mann, Riverdale County and Nightingale and was dinged by Dalton and Brearley. We are still awaiting results from three NJ schools (Pingry, Newark Academy and Kent). My preference is for the NYC schools but my wife wants to go to the NJ suburban schools. I think what helped my daughter was strong EC activities for her age (she was a very fast sprinter and won a Piano competition) and her essays turned out to be stronger than I expected (and she wrote them on her own with overall guidance from us on what the questions were really probing for). I have also heard from a couple of people who interviewed her that she was a strong interviewer which again was a surprise to me. I don’t know how strong her reccos were. My point is that it is a overall picture the ad-comm is forming not some formula based on SAT scores and GPAs (of course they have to be good enough to be in the mix and yours are). You have a strong track record of leadership and athletics. I would stress that in your essays. My advice to you would be the same as to my daughter - do not be afraid to let your emotions come through and your personality shine. Evocative and thoughtful essays are how you will be able to stand out. Do the best job you can there and prepare well for interviews and hope for the best. While the Top 10 colleges are always going to be very difficult to get into, why not apply to a few and I believe you have a good shot at # 11-20 as well, don’t let anyone psych you out with the test scores and GPA not being good enough for a “Asian Male”. You are an individual and you can reclaim your humanity and individuality through great essays.
If you have an explanation of how your GPA or SAT score might understate your academic excellence add it as a note to ad-comm or the optional essays. For example my daughter was surprised by the user interface of the Reading Comprehension section of the ISEE (did not allow her to look at passage and questions on same screen, this was the first time ISEE was given online) and only got a 6 (65th percentile among ISEE test takers which might be 85th percentile on national level, 8 is considered excellent, 9 perfection). I sent a note to admissions that just last year she had scored a 9 on RC on a standardized test administered by the same provider.
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Congrats!
The biggest challenge in commuting daily in public transportation (from NJ to UES)in the next couple years is the pandemic especially the vaccination is not yet available for the younger population.
However, if it’s parents driving, then it should be fine.
Thanks @parentken I think that by Sept when she joins most adults who want to take it will have taken the vaccine and certainly the faculty and staff. I think COVID will become endemic like Influenza at that point and we will just return to normal life. Kids are less susceptible to bad outcomes with COVID than the Flu and if schools want to be super cautious I believe they will do weekly testing.
For the UES schools we have come to the conclusion that we need to live in Manhattan or they are not practical. I am trying to have my wife be open to a 3-Br, 2-Ba situation in some place like Sutton Place or even Yorkville on UES but might be difficult as her sister lives in NJ and she has a daughter who us close to our kids. I have just asked her to keep an open mind and see a few apartments.
Great, I think if you have decided to move close to school in Manhattan (if your wife agrees), then you should be all set.
Spence is a great school focusing on more discussion based learning (similar to Brearley) in middle school (compared to other more traditional girl like chapin , nightingale schools). You cannot go wrong with any of these 4 schools in UES.
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I live in suburban NJ. Kids commute on the regular from my suburb and those around to Hill Schools and I commute myself to the upper west side. It is doable but not fun. The commute to the east side is a horror when the world is normal but now is a breeze. We sent my younger one to NJ private school for years and he is now in public and we are thrilled with the opportunities and education available in wealthy suburban NJ public schools, and interestingly our school has had more admits to highly competitive colleges this year than a great deal of the private schools. So commute to all of the schools you mention now doable, will be less so when the world normalizes, and suburban NJ not only gives you space but options for excellent public school education if you choose.
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