I am very stuck between Oberlin College and UW-Madison right now. Here is my pros and cons list, financial aid is about the same for both and is not a problem in my situation.
Pros of Madison:
*I can be anyone I want to be since it is such a big school
*Great places to study
*Close to home (1.5 hours away)
*Great professors and research opportunities
*Many things to do in the city, good on and off campus food options
*Many different majors (I don’t know what I want to do so this might help)
*Big football games and school spirit!!
Cons of Madison:
*Big school, so might get lost or overwhelmed in it
*Friends could come and go
*Party school and I don’t like to party (there are plenty of people who don’t though and live in the Lakeshore living community as I plan to)
*Won’t personally know my professors (I am the type of person who likes to ask questions so it is important for me to get those questions answered, preferably right away… maybe sitting in the front row could help?)
*Won’t get as much extensive research opportunities or know professors as well as I’d like to
*Won’t get individual help from professors themselves that are qualified and less personal attention- people aren’t vying to have me come to Madison like I’m getting at Oberlin; wouldn’t know who to go to with my questions about my possibly major
Pros of Oberlin:
*Personalized relationships with professors
*Seems to have genuinely nice people
*Can play collegiate lacrosse (DIII!)
*Personalized research opportunities that can be more long-term and less competitive than at Madison
Cons of Oberlin:
*Super liberal and most are activists (I am more moderate and not outspoken about my opinions as it seems Obies can be)
*I am accepting of LGBT of course but wasn’t raised in such a different environment that Oberlin seems to be that is daunting for me to be completely accepting, so uncomfortable
*Small town and very quirky (I don’t find myself to be quirky as many shops and people are at Oberlin, which is fine, just not my wavelength)
*Far from home (I don’t like being away from home and am pretty attached to my family; I get anxious when I go on trips more than two days away from them and didn’t go to summer camp for that reason, but maybe I could get over it)
*Overall there are a lot of people I don’t see myself being friends with that are very quirky, some describe it as “granolaey”
I am pretty stuck. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!
Oh and I missed lacrosse - I’m sure that’s hugely important to you.
Go to Oberlin (unless $ are an issue), learn and grow. Not everyone is an activist - and you have a better chance of discovering and experiencing your passions. And when you need a city - Cleveland is not far.
College is a leap. Guess what. You’re going to go. You’re going to struggle in class. You’re going to wish you can go home because you’re homesick - but you will be a bit too far to do so. Then you’ll stay, fight through it, and love your life.
This is part of growing up. Being close to home so you can go on weekends is a crutch. Kids need to learn, develop, and grow and see mom at Thanksgiving.
When you’re in that spot at Wisconsin, you won’t have the level of support you’ll need and have at Oberlin. The lacrosse thing - that’s a huge bonus for you - because if you make the team, those kids will be your new family.
Great choices, congrats! I have a UW grad and a LAC kid who went through athletic recruiting at Oberlin and then played in the same conference as Oberlin but at a different school, so we were on Oberlin’s campus a lot.
First, on UW – how well you get to know profs is in your hands. My double major (now in law school) UW grad developed close relationships with a number of professors because he made the effort. He took Honors courses where the discussion section of the large lecture class is taught by the prof rather than TAs (who are Ph.D. students in that field, so not exactly unqualified), took seminar classes, went to office hours etc. When he asked for letters of rec for law school several years after he had graduated, his UW profs remembered all about him and his work and were happy to write for him. So while it is a lot easier to disappear at a large school, a student can also make the decision to approach it differently. My kid liked that he could disappear when he wanted to – for instance in getting the Science requirements done, he did not have to be super engaged if he didn’t want to, he could just do the work and move on. He was not a fan of the super visibility of the student experience at a LAC, he wanted to choose when to be involved and when not to be.
At UW, have you applied for Honors program or the undergrad Research program? Both are great gateways to developing relationships with profs. Honors classes are open to students not in the Honors program, so if you didn’t apply that’s not an obstacle and could get sorted out at SOAR (summer orientation and registration). Honors and the undergrad research program can be applied for during 1st year, it’s not a one-shot thing. My kid found the advising resources were plentiful and helpful – he had advisors in his College of L&S, advisors in each of his majors, and advisors in the Honors program. Again, it’s a question of taking advantage of the resources and opportunities that are there. While my UW kid did join greek life, it is very much a marginal part of the UW experience and easily ignored and avoided – the houses are on Langdon St which is the other side of campus from Lakeshore.
My biggest question – as the parent of a D3 athlete – is how much of your vision of your college experience involves playing your sport? For my D3 kid, he wanted to compete as long as possible and that was one (but not the only) reason he wanted a LAC. My UW kid played the same sport through high school but was content to play intramural sports in college. No one can say which is right or better – it is what is important to you.
Madison is a great college town – for my UW alum, it was the perfect blend of nature and city. He played pond hockey in the winter on Lake Mendota and enjoyed beers on the Terrace in the summer, could run nature trails, live in a high rise dorm, intern at the Capitol, and we could all enjoy amazing farm-to-table restaurants when we visited. We miss our Madison visits!
Academically, it was not what I was seeking. Very difficult to get into overfilled classes which are taught by and graded by unenthused TAs. Crime is on the uptick and I know of several people who were mugged and I felt very unsafe. And, it’s a HUGE party school. That seems to be the priority amongst the students I encountered. Just not my cup of tea all around. Very excited to leave and start the next chapter.
I know both campuses and have a kid who went to Oberlin. @Midwestmomofboys covered pretty much everything. I did want to mention one other thing - if you are committed to playing your sport, I suggest you contact other LAX players on the team. As an athlete, you would be spending most of your down time with your teammates. If they are compatible socially, that will offset the crunchy granola social justice vibe somewhat. If you don’t vibe with them, then Madison might be the better bet socially.
Regarding Madison’s size, I agree with @Midwestmomofboys yet again - you can get personalized attention at a large school - you just have to advocate for yourself more. Only you know how proactive you think you might be.
Completely agree with @mamaedefamilia – for a D3 athlete, the team is your 1st home and your 1st family. If the culture of the team feels like a good fit, then that can put to rest a lot of concerns!
I know the team and think I would fit in with them very well. I don’t know if I’ll regret not having lacrosse at the collegiate level or not…Now I am leaning towards going to Madison because its in my comfort zone, my boyfriend is going there which helps, and there are unlimited options for majors which helps since I don’t know what to do. Not to mention unlimited options for friends too. I think that if I sit in the front of lectures I will be ok… right?
I think the opportunities at UW are unbelievable for a student who is engaged. So yes, sit up front in the lecture hall, go to office hours, look into FIGs – First Year Interest Groups – which are a cluster of 1st year courses related to a theme, with about 20 students who take all those classes together, including one seminar which is just those kids. My kid did a FIG and that group – along with the people on his hallway – were his first group of close friends and study mates. My kid studied with amazing professors at UW, they were legendary truly, the academics at UW is world class. Some kids will sleep through class, party through the semester, and some will transfer out to other UW campuses. But for the students who stay active and engaged – the opportunities are incredible.
I can’t speak for you specifically but you do realize most couples that go to college together end up not couples? They warned us of that in grad school and they were right.
Don’t let fear run your life. If UW Is better then ok. But based on what you just wrote you are giving into fear. Based on your etsonality I think you will do better in a smaller and tighter setting. I don’t know you. This is just my 3rd party, unemotional perception.
I think a few of your pros for Madison are actually stronger pros at Oberlin. I don’t necessarily think it’s easier to figure out what you want to be at a bigger school. A smaller environment with more mentoring and advising and closer professor relationships - that will serve you well in refining your interests. I can’t imagine you feeling like your major options would be limited at a school like Oberlin, no matter what you choose. And although the professors and research opportunities at Madison are top notch, they are also top notch at Oberlin with the additional benefit of being focused on undergraduates.
But I do think you have to feel like the school fits you and you seem to have real reservations about Oberlin. Have you visited in person? What made you apply there in the first place, instead of some of the other LACs that are maybe a bit less overtly liberal? It would be interesting to hear why you singled it out.
My favorite lacrosse coach went to Oberlin, and I decided last minute to apply there because there are such good academics and it is small, which I thought would be best for me based on my learning style. I now realize that I think I want something a little bigger (like 7,000 students) but at the time I was looking for schools that I could play lacrosse at if I wanted and that were also a good academic fit. I applied to Macalester as well- same idea as to why I applied- great academics at a small school. I didn’t realize how quirky small liberal arts schools at that academic caliber could be and I also didn’t realize how liberal Oberlin was until I visited. I applied to Depauw University, but thought that was too conservative, didn’t like the greek life presence, and didn’t like the rural Indiana feel. I am somehow still feeling like I’ll be limited at Oberlin and want to keep my options open and be within my comfort zone by going to Madison.
I mean this nicely, but I honestly think those are exactly the reasons why you should not go to UWM. You can make unlimited friends at all kinds of schools. Not all kids at Oberlin are crunchy granola. How about the kids at Oberlin that you don’t hear about? Kids like @mamaedefamilia ’s D, who is a fantastic student and seems to have thrived without getting herself in the headlines.
I actually think being to close to home is a con. Having your boyfriend at college is definitely a con. Being in big lectures as a freshman when you are a person who wants to be able to talk to profs and clearly enjoys engaged discussion now, not when you’re an upperclassman, is a con. Being in a comfort zone is a con, IMO. I think most CC’ers would agree that you are likely to,have a more satisfying educational experience at Oberlin. And not being able to play lax is a con, because it seems it’s important to you.
Have a look at a site like Niche. See what other students have to say about their schools. You have two good choices, but I wouldn’t let staying in a comfort zone be the deciding factor.
Almost all of my friends went to Madison (Wis high school). They are doctors and nurses and own their own businesses, etc. Sure they liked the football games and tailgates, but they were students first and serious about that. They liked eating gyros on State street and beers at the Union and sailing and all the other things too.
At any school, you have to put out the effort to meet the professors, to get research opportunities, to work for the professors. One daughter went to a bigger school (only 10,000, so not huge) and she had a few classes in her major with 200 students but even at big, huge universities, those 200 person classes are usually first year and then classes shrink to 30-40. She knew the professors. She’s starting a masters program at the school this year (after 2 years in the real world) and had no trouble getting recommendations and guidance from professors when deciding where to get her masters (or if to get a masters). She’ll now be a TA in those 200 student classes and is looking forward to it. I know she’ll be engaged with her students and make the discussion groups interesting for them, so TAs aren’t always the worst thing.
Other child went to a smaller school and was in the smallest department at the school. She never had a class with more than 50 students in it but didn’t always know her professors personally and didn’t always want to know them. When she made the effort, she did and worked for one her senior year so had that personal connection for recommendations and advice. She also played lacrosse and that took a lot of her time. She doesn’t regret playing lacrosse and really feels it played a big part in her getting a job as the interviewers were impressed with her organizational skills.
You don’t have to give up lacrosse at Madison.
I’ll admit I much prefer big schools. When my kids were looking at schools, I felt claustrophobic at the LACs. They didn’t, so we looked, but both wished for bigger schools at least once during their college years. Wished for more class choices, new people to meet, more professors to meet.
I think what several of us - Linda Graf and I and other are saying is - it’s clear from the OPs write up she’d prefer Oberlin - forgetting her last email.
What we see is - she’s gotten a sudden case of fear and discomfort - and we basically are saying, don’t let fear overwhelm you.
Yes, the process of leaving home and going to the unknown is uncomfortable - but it’s such a wonderful opportunity and don’t give it up because of fear.