Official Fall '07 Transfer Thread =)

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Virginia
181

<p>Bait&Switch,
Just a clarification on my part. I said that I understand what "people think of those in the military." And I need to explain that. What I meant to say was that I'm aware of the condescending attitude some have for those - particularly in the enlisted ranks - in our military. And I'm truly sorry if that's been your experience...</p>

<p>Having said that, I don't believe that Americans see our service members as somehow "indispensable" - my word, not yours. On the contrary, I think that most Americans - whether they support our continued presence in Iraq or not - are truly sickened by the loss of American life there. Correction: are sickened by the loss of life there, period. And I believe most Americans are truly grateful for the sacrifices of those military personnel serving in Iraq and Afghanistan - and around the world.</p>

<p>My husband and I have been lucky. We have been met with nothing but support and friendship by those civilians we have known in every place we've lived. Do they think we live a strange life? Absolutely. Do they wonder why we continue to do it? Unquestionably. Do they appreciate it? Yes. And they say so.</p>

<p>Not trying to get on another soapbox here...I just needed to clarify what I wrote at 6 AM this morning. And though we may disagree about some things, I think we can agree on this. Military service should entitle one to three things: respect, admiration, and an enormous amount of gratitude. </p>

<p>You have all three from me.</p>

182

<p>Okay, it's obviously still too early for me to be writing. I meant to say dispensable, not indispensable.</p>

183

<p>
[quote]
The Virginia Tech episode perfectly encapsulates my attitude and the issue I take with your perspective: 33 students were killed, and the entire nation stopped to mourn, and is still mourning, and will be mourning for some time. In April, 104 U.S. servicemen and women were killed, and no one batted an eye. There is this quietly prevalent idea that our military are a group of human beings that are somehow less human- and less important - then, say, a group of college students (I cannot begin to recount the number of times I was in the company of college students who were under the impression that I was also one, and who, upon discovering I had enlisted instead, treated me with indirect contempt as an inferior).

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<p>Some people do care. I do not support the war in Iraq for various reasons, but I am extremely upset every day about the people dying there, suffering in 120 degree heat, dying because they don't have the right equipment. But this is a very different situation than Virginia Tech. Unfortunately, people die in wars. I feel people have unnecessarily died for what will be an unsatisfactory end in this war, and that makes me all the more incensed about their deaths, but that is only my opinion. A war is not treated exactly the same way as a national tragedy, because frankly IMO most people have never developed the empathy to be really affected by things they don't perceive as a potential direct threat to them. They expect people to die in war, and they aren't going to Iraq. No one ever expects someone to walk into a building in a quiet town in Southwest Virginia and unload hundreds of bullets into people. Just like on the morning of Sept 11th no one expected three planes to fly into buildings, the event that precipitated this war. We went into a period of national mourning then. Things of a random nature inspire "there but for the grace of God goes I" thoughts. </p>

<p>However I would like to assure you that some of the people who died on April 16th were not apathetic to the plight of our soldiers. They had devoted their lives, in class and out, to international studies and international relations. They wanted to change the world. They raised awareness and they selflessly gave to others. This story doesn't seem to have come out much, but one was a junior, in his first year at Tech, out of the VCCS. He had immigrated in high school, and after Sept 11th, he was inspired to the path of international diplomacy. He was not a child of privilege - his mother is a maid and they came here several years back from Peru. He spoke five languages fluently. I realize that you are hurting now, but making broad statements about what "college students" are like isn't helping anyone feel better or worse. There are people everywhere, who are self absorbed, make poor choices, and do not conduct themselves with respect to others. There have been several scandals in military along this vein. But there are also people everywhere who exhibit altruism, and try their best. I agree that many young people lack a 'real world' perspective for the most part, as I am often painfully aware of (what I consider) the ignorance of peers. But the majority are still basically good, if unaffected, and would not be pretentious towards someone simply because they've served in the military. </p>

<p>I also did everything I felt I could, and got rejected from places I would have liked to attend. It is easy, initially to feel bitter. But think about it, because this is what I thought about: are you usually a person who wants to take the easy way? I don't get that impression of you. Although I had already basically moved on, on the 16th losing two people I know gave me hindsight and I was ashamed by even those brief thoughts. In the few weeks since, I have a different perspective and have handled things better than I would have before. This is not worth it. I could have died the day after wasting time being bitter and upset about colleges that didn't want me, instead of enjoying life and doing something constructive. And they didn't want me. That's the truth. Honestly elite college admissions inspire so many bitter feelings because people who have never faced rejection (in an academic sense anyway) face rejection. So I do not look at anyone else's "stats" and say, well they got this thing I didn't, it must be random. I now think, they must have been a better fit for the program in some way. Resources are limited in life, and that's another lesson that many of us, who have never experienced the unfairness of poverty (in which case we in all likelihood would not have the opportunity to even be bitter about getting rejected from college!), don't learn early. If a lot of people want a slot being selected, and there aren't enough slots, they will select the people best suited, but it doesn't mean everyone else isn't good enough - they were just different. </p>

<p>At the same time, I know you will not like what I say now. I just hope that the pain will be very fleeting for you because I think you have the potential to move on to greater things than this. I also think that if you spend too much time focused on what might have been, you might regret it later. The admissions committee that did not choose to accept you (rejection is rather harsh, you never know, you may be the last application something sadly laid out of the pile because someone else wouldn't approve it) only knew you on a piece of paper. Just like most of the nation only knows the kids who died on the 16th from the paper, but to others, they were so much more. You are so much more to the people in your life than a "UVA rejection." Emerging from something with your dignity intact, not demoralized but inspired to work even harder, is, I think, what may seperate the good from the great. Our actions speak louder than adcom decisions - in the end, I do not know the name of the current president of Exxon, despite their unbelievable profit margin, but I know who Mother Theresa is. And to be honest, if I had to hedge bets on the more personally fulfilling life, I would have to go with the latter. Achievements would be hollow if we never faced rejection. Take this opportunity to rejoice in the positive image that others have of you.</p>

184

<p>Bait&Switch:</p>

<p>Since you have provided additional information, I offer this speculation as to why you were not admitted to UVa at this time. It’s quite possible that the University’s decision had nothing to do with you, your qualifications, or you accomplishments. In fact, if you have taken the appropriate courses, you might want to consider the possibility that the University did not want to reject your application this year, but its hands were tied.</p>

<p>The Virginia General Assembly wants more community college students to transfer after they obtain associate’s degrees. Apparently, the Legislature feels that it is cheaper for THE STATE to educated students at community colleges and, if students stay at community colleges for a full two-years before transferring, more space is freed-up at the state’s universities. </p>

<p>The state has provided UVa with specific targets to meet for enrolling community college transfers with associate’s degrees. The University entered into its guaranteed transfer agreement with VCCS in order to help meet those targets, but UVA finds it difficult to meet the assigned targets:</p>

<p>
[quote]
In particular, UVa has agreed to enroll more students who have completed associate’s degrees at Virginia community colleges. But this year the university missed its target of enrolling 98 such students, bringing in only 72. For the 2007-08 school year, the target number is even more, at 117 students. </p>

<p>“It’s a problem,” said UVa’s dean of admissions, John Blackburn. </p>

<p>But Blackburn said he hopes that the guaranteed admissions agreements UVa has signed will help boost that number in the coming years. He also said UVa admissions officers have taken an aggressive approach to recruiting more community college graduates. </p>

<p>“We’re going there in the morning, in the evening, having open houses here at the university,” he said. “We’ve also set up [Internet] chat rooms, which have been very popular.”</p>

<p>The admissions process for 2007-08 transfer students is still in progress. The target number of transfers with associate’s degrees will only rise further over the next several years, to 139 for the 2008-09 school year and 161 for 2009-10.</p>

<p>“This is going to be a real challenge next year. … We’ll be pulling out all the stops,” said outgoing UVa Provost Gene Block.

[/quote]

<a href="http://www.dailyprogress.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=CDP/MGArticle/CDP_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173350734018%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.dailyprogress.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=CDP/MGArticle/CDP_BasicArticle&c=MGArticle&cid=1173350734018&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>The University does not want to alienate the state legislature as it depends on that body for funding and other matters important to the University. If the Legislature wants UVa to enroll more community college transfers with associates’ degrees, than you can bet the University will do whatever it can to comply. </p>

<p>Obviously, the University can better meet its assigned targets if you, and other community college students like you, transfer with an associate’s degree. If UVa accepted you this year, the University would have more difficulty meeting its target next year. Community college students finding it extremely difficult to transfer to UVa without an associate’s degree is a likely consequence of the new state requirement.</p>

<p>You should not, however, think the University does not want you now or does not value your accomplishments:</p>

<p>
[quote]
One problem UVa officials cite in getting community college transfers is the difference between the way the students traditionally have come to the university and the new state requirements. </p>

<p>“We’ve always found that the earlier students transfer, the better they do here … so we have liked to see students transfer after one year,” said UVa President John T. Casteen III. “But the state is looking for [the Virginia Community College System] to graduate more students with associate’s degrees.”

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<p>If you think the above offers a plausible explanation for your UVa rejection, the Virginia General Assembly may offer a more effective venue to express your, probably quite justified, frustrations.</p>

<p>On a more positive note, if you continue to do well and take the required classes, you will be at UVa next year – it’s GUARANTEED!</p>

185

<p>hey nik, that monk life you described doesn't sound that bad. Is there a website/ number I can contact to apply?</p>

186

<p>any update on the "spring roll over " candidates? I called and was told that if I sent an email requesting the decision a reply would be sent via email. I did that and several hours later-- after no response from UVa I called and was told that they were too busy today and that a paper response was being mailed so my response would be "forthcoming"-- which means by snail mail so I won't know for several days. Needless to say I don't feel that is fair and I feel a little jerked around.</p>

187

<p>
[quote]
hey nik, that monk life you described doesn't sound that bad. Is there a website/ number I can contact to apply?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>haha that's wishful thinking. I'm too corrupted already for that type of lifestyle now.</p>

188

<p>Princedog-</p>

<p>Some excellent points and thoughts included in your post. I am in thorough agreement with most of the things you have said. And I am hardly "bitter". I have experienced more failure in my young life than I care to reminisce about. You allow yourself a day to be angered by their decision, and then you move on. That's the thing about getting older: you begin to see the big picture much more clearly. This will hardly change the course of my life in the long run... Obviously I dictate my success- not some board adding up grade-point averages. </p>

<p>Secondly, I will reiterate that when I negatively mentioned VT, I was referring to the reaction of the national media, politicians, etc. and their "coffee table talk"- I despise the way in which some people will use another's pain for their own gain, or self-promoting platform. If you are a VT student or are closely connected to the university in some way, you would/should obviously care and be shocked and upset.</p>

189

<p>super.nova-</p>

<p>Thank you for the effort you put in to this seemingly on-point theory. I had made an educated guess that this was likely the case, and I appreciate the headway you made by providing the appropriate facts. I wish that UVA had stated the slim-to-none 2nd year probabilities, and saved me several hours and $50. </p>

<p>This further emphasizes my dislike for all things political. Congratulations are in order for the Virginia State government. Dumbing down the state's premier university is clearly easier than one might imagine. Maybe now we will have the funding to be able to hire a few more bureaucrats, to help figure how to cut more funding, in order to hire a few more bureaucrats...</p>

190

<p>Shoebox,</p>

<p>Just curious-why would you transfer from VT engineering to UVA engineering? The majority of knowledgeable people would agree Tech's engineering IN GENERAL is better than UVA's, while UVA is more famous for its business, political science, etc.</p>

<p>But anyway, please follow your heart and congrats!</p>

191

<p>True, in some ways. Although rankings say VT is better, there's too many differences between the programs to just assume rankings are true. UVA is still in the top 30, while VT is only #17, so the actual difference is small. My major is EE, and when rankings are done by programs, UVA(21) is one spot behind VT(20), so its not a big deal. My main reasons are that UVA's program has a liberal arts side to it, which I've realized I miss so much, in addition to its smaller size, which I like as well. Also, I have academic passions outside of engineering, and want to continue to persue them during my undergrad work. I'm thinking about minoring in economics, business, or something like urban studies or political thought. The first two because i'm considering going to business grad school to earn an MBA, the later two just because they interest me. I feel like I have so many more options in my education at UVA than VT, in addition to the better campus/social feel.</p>

192

<p>Bait&Switch</p>

<p>you have issues, how do you equate requiring students to complete two years which include foreign language requirements, non-western perspective requirement, and a plethora of other gen ed requirements while obtaining an associates degree "Dumbing down the state's premier university." Granted these classes may not be as hard as they are at regular schools but you still need to get at least a 3.4. Oh, and guess what schools like UVA want students that have shown consistency and are ready to move on to a four year school to take up spaces left by those that made it into UVA initially but couldn't hack it because they weren't focused enough, mature enough, or too caught up in the party scene. </p>

<p>I'm glad I got accepted into UVA under the agreement, I’m on a solid consistent path, and like you I have a 4.0, I have an SAT score in the
1300's, I have been in the military, but two differences I have an associates degree, and I have one more year of community college under my belt then you do. </p>

<p>It's funny how a lot of people have been supportive of you on this forum despite your negativity, maybe they just feel like they should be the bigger person, or maybe they are just compassionate. But, man, you got issues that you need to resolve in your head, and understand all this long-winded stuff you spew on this forum really has nothing to do with lowered admission standards, you're running circles around the real issue you're just crying like I used to as a baby when I didn't get what I wanted. Really, YOUR THE ONE THAT WANTS TO GET IN ON LOWER STANDARDS, you’re the one that feels entitled to get in with only one year of CC. What makes you so special? "I just wanted to have three years at UVA." We have similar stats, but you know what, I knew I wasn't going to get into UVA without satisfying those requirements. Bottom line, quit crying, buck up, and know life is hard so you better cross your T's and dot your I's and stop blaming other people for stuff. </p>

<p>On a lighter note I want to share something with you I learned in my DUMBED DOWN history community college course, taught by a DUMBED DOWN PhD history professor who’s written several books and is a Lincoln historian. He told us about this pretentious flowery elaborate French dude during the French revolution, Edmund Genet, this guy was a total tool thought he was entitled to a bunch of stuff, including setting up French courts in the U.S. well this made George Washington furious and had the guy arrested and set to be deported, dude escaped deportation met up with GW at some party and begged him for mercy, you know what GW said you need a good woman to keep you grounded, he pointed at some politicians daughter and said that’s a good women. Well the dude ended up marrying her and moving to a farm and GW never heard from him again. Dude I’ve been in your shoes, degraded, struggling, being let down by the one’s closest to me, but in the end I smartened up and realized I’m the only one that can truly impact my life, I make my own destiny. It also helps that since I’ve been with my current girl friend I’ve been moving forward and not looking back. BUT HEY, what do I know, I’m just a dumb community college graduate, that is getting into Virginia’s premier school on some “BUREAUCRATIC” loop hole. I just followed the simple instructions on the UVA transfer admissions website on the requirements I need to satisfy to get into UVA under this agreement. SIMPLE MINDED me just followed the directions like a fun game of connect the dots, and low and behold I got into UVA. But you know what in the back of my mind I thought this was too good to be true even with a 4.0. However I knew that if I didn’t get in, and I followed the agreement to a T I had solid grounds to appeal the decision. </p>

<p>Well Bait&Switch good luck, with whatever you decide to do now, and unlike the other people on this forum that think you deserve this, that in your life you have the potential to accomplish a lot more, sorry but I don’t agree with them. Unless YOU CHANGE YOUR ATTITUDE, and BUCK UP. But of course many people make a living by blaming others for stuff, you could be one of them too.</p>

193

<p>Anyone get anything in the mail today?</p>

194

<p>Nope, and I live near DC. I bet it'll start reaching people tomorrow through early next week.</p>

195

<p>I've been checking this thread religiously as I awaited decisions and I'd like to say thank you to everybody who provided helpful advice and information (especially DeanJ, what a wonderful resource!). By the way, if only because I've grown so used to reading your posts, I'd like to specifically congratulate shoe- I was honestly rooting for you.</p>

<p>I live pretty close to DC too and I haven't received anything in the mail yet either.</p>

<p>I know there is another thread about housing, but I'm really torn between living on or off campus. I've done the on-campus thing enough and frankly, if I do it again, I refuse to share a room (although a suite is another story). Supposing I do live off-campus, is anybody on here familiar enough with Charlottesville that they could tell me where the "student ghettos" are? In the interest of meeting people, that's obviously where I would like to be.</p>

<p>I'm so totally stoked that I was admitted. I'm not even trying to be respectfully modest- I was shocked that I got in. Congratulations to everyone else that got in and better luck next time to everyone who didn't.</p>

196

<p>I'm from Richmond and my letter came in the mail on Wednesday- so I think your letters should be arriving soon.</p>

197

<p>My stuff came yesterday, and i'm in DC.</p>

198

<p>My things came today - but they were sent to my house in Wa state (when I got to school in Va).</p>

<p>Anyone else wondering if they might turn down the offer? Why, if so?</p>

<p>I applied to Cornell and my letter hasn't come yet. So I am anxiously picking apart both schools and thinking them over.</p>

<p>Also - does anyone know the statistics - how many people got waitlisted, declined, etc...?</p>

199

<p>I might turn it down due to costs. I don't know if its worth taking out 7K of loans per year for.</p>

200

<p>Hey I thought I'd throw this tidbit out:
when sending in your admissions stuff, go to the post office and send it Priority and get a tracking number with it. They cost $0.50 and it lets you go online or call and see where your letter is. All USPS mail goes through different sorting centers when going cross country at different stages, so those farther away from VA can see where it is at times. Then, it alerts you when it is finally delivered. It might save the jitters of wondering if your $250 bucks and the fate of your undergrad career got to the right place or not =P Plus, they stamp your half of the tracking slip with the date and time so you have an official record of when you sent it, just in case.</p>