<p>By the by, have y'all been to Political Compass? It's a two-dimensional political spectrum, with a Social axis (Authoritarian to Libertarian) and Economic axis (Left (Regulation)/Right (Laissez-faire)). So Stalin was extremely authoritarian, but he also tightly regulated the economy. This is called Populism, I think.</p>
<p>Decision: ACCEPTED</p>
<p>Stats:[ul]
[<em>] SAT: 720V, 640M, 740Wr (Essay-11)
[</em>] SAT IIs: 720 Biology-E, 760 US History, 600 Math IIC
[<em>] GPA: 4.0 (unweighted)
[</em>] Rank: Top 10% (110 in class)
[<em>] Other stats: (none)
[/ul]Subjective:[ul]
[</em>] Essays: Focused mainly on biology interest and on my intended pursuits at Princeton. Heavily researched.
[<em>] Teacher Recs: 2/3 are from Princeton Alumni. My teachers wrote incredible recommendations.
[</em>] Counselor Rec: Outstanding
[<em>] Hook (if any): Double legacy status (mother and father), play both French Horn (1st) and Trombone (2nd, for jazz), Princeton alumni recs, appointed Student Council Rep. of Clubs and Organizations at school, know 2 professors at Princeton (who work in Chicago).
[/ul]Location/Person:[ul]
[</em>] State or Country: Illinois
[<em>] School Type: College Prep (boarding, southern-Penn.)
[</em>] Ethnicity: bi-racial
[li] Gender: Male[/li][/ul]Other Factors:
Nothing really, I just made it very clear exactly why I chose Princeton and what I wanted to do and accomplish there (major in Ecology and Evolutionary Biology, and spend a term in Kenya at Mpala Center).
General Comments:
Found out on the phone because I was leaving for vacation in Hawaii before the letter arrived in the mail, and I didn't want the thought hanging over my head all winter break. Luckily, what the admissions official said very cryptically after he checked the computer made my year!</p>
<p>AP Courses - US History (4), Biology, Chemistry, AB Calculus
Hook - Inducted into Cum Laude Society, Mercersburg Chapter; Did independent study on behavioral ecology of mammals</p>
<p>Hey, I'm new here (and not a HS senior yet <em>phew</em>), but I've been following the fortunes of my senior friends closely and was really disappointed/hurt by what happened to one of them. I know that this is semi-irrelevant to this thread and that these kinds of disappointments happen all the time to highly qualified people, but I guess I just wanted more people to commiserate with me :/ Take a look for yourself and see if you are similarly surprised that my friend got waitlisted at HYM and rejected from Stanford and Princeton...
Decision: Rejected</p>
<p>Stats:[ul]
[<em>] Fee Waiver Used?: No
[</em>] SAT I (by section): 2400 (and 1600)
[<em>] SAT IIs: All 800: Math IIC, Writing, Chem, Bio, US History
[</em>] ACT: n/a
[<em>] APs: All 5s: US History, Chem, Bio, Euro History, Calc BC; still to take: Poli Sci, Econ, English Lit, Spanish
[</em>] IBs: n/a
[<em>] GPA, Weighted and Unweighted: ~4.5 W, 4.0 UW
[</em>] Rank: Our school doesn't rank, but ~top 1-2%
[<em>] Senior Yr Courseload: AP Physics, AP Spanish, AP English, Adv Journalism (editor), AP Poli Sci/AP Econ, plus basketball
[</em>] Number of Apps from Your School: not sure; ~20 I'm guessing. Five other people at our school were accepted, two ED and three RD.
[<em>] Common or Princeton App? I don't know
[</em>] Other stats: National Merit Semifinalist, Summa Cum Laude, AIME qualifier, numerous prestigious math/science awards at the state and national level, Bio Olympiad finalist (one of 20 in the U.S.)
[ /list][ b]Subjective:[ /b][ list]
[<em>] ECs listed on app: School newspaper (section editor), Math Club (President, awards at many competitions), Science Club (President), Science Olympiad (Captain, gold medalist), Science Bowl (Captain of A team; team reached semifinal round), violin (orchestra), Tae Kwon Do (2nd-degree black belt), MedClub (board officer), Classical Music Forum (co-founder, secretary), won numerous awards for Model U.N., science fair award winner, summer bio research in Costa Rica
[</em>] Job/Work Experience: Bio research at UC Irvine lab, tutoring
[<em>] Essays (subject and responses): I don't remember/know the exact content, but the essays were extremely thoughtful and well-written. Other people and teachers who saw them agreed.
[</em>] Teacher Recs: Brilliant; "top few in my career"-type
[<em>] Counselor Rec: Probably very good as well, but our counselor writes very generic recs based on a quick scan through stats and a brag sheet (big public school)
[</em>] Interview (feel and general location): Starbucks, very comfortable and interesting--went well overall
[<em>] Hook (if any): Combination of literally perfect (scores-wise) academics, extreme focus/talent in science and math (yet interest/talent in humanities as well), and outstanding recs and ECs...nothing in particular, I suppose, just the whole package.
[/ul]Location/Person:[ul]
[</em>] State or Country: Southern California
[<em>] School Type, Average Stats of School (if available): Large, ultracompetitive public school (one of the best in California and top 100 in US); 62% go to 4-year colleges; 1260 old SAT average
[</em>] Ethnicity: Chinese
[<em>] Income Bracket: I don't know
[</em>] Gender: Male
[<em>] Hooks: See above?
[</em>] Strengths/Weaknesses: Academics, ECs, recs, writing ability/community service?
[li] Why you think you were accepted/deferred/denied: I'm totally aware of how random Ivy decisions are, and I wouldn't be overly surprised if my friend was rejected from just Princeton or Stanford, but I would have thought that he would be accepted to at least one of HYPSM. He was accepted to Caltech, however.[/li][/ul]Other Factors:
General Comments/Congratulations/Venting/Commiserations,etc: Again, I'm just somewhat surprised/disappointed, especially because some of the other Pton/Harvard/Yale/MIT/Stanford acceptees were not nearly as qualified and didn't at all deserve to get in. Right now, I'm just really hoping for my friend to get off HYM waitlists...thoughts?</p>
<p>vivibird~ Your friend should have got in. </p>
<p>I know it isn't fair but it looks like affirmative action stops the more qualified asian and caucasian applicants from getting in. I thought colleges stopped affirmative action. I remember we had a discussion on this in our english class after reading an essay by a hispanic PHD. Though the admissions committee favors these applicants, they actually feel bad. They did not get in the "right" way. The essay I mentioned describes that quite well. </p>
<p>I think race and gender shouldn't be given priority. We can have a black applicant whose father is a judge versus a white applicant who lives in a trailor park competing for the same spot. The black applicant, it looks like, has the better chance. Just because he is black. </p>
<p>However, economic factors should play a major in admissions.
Take two students for example. One comes from a family of four making $100K+ and another from a family of 6 making barely $50 K a year. They take the similar classes in high school: All AP/Honors. Both of them maintain a 4.0 UW GPA. </p>
<p>However, the first student has better E/Cs. He/She has been playing the piano since they were five. Holds many recitals and such. Mother is a housewife and spends 24/7 looking after the kids education. The kid is brilliant, no doubt, but not hardworking. Mother tutors him, looks after his homework, takes him to all his E/C activities and gets him involved in those.</p>
<p>The second student has not been as much fortunate. Parents can barely manage to feed the family. No money to spend on piano, violin, etc. lessons. Mother works to help support the family. Therefore, does not have the energy to make sure that the child does his/her homework, get him involved in E/C activities, etc. The child is very hardworking, not gifted with extraordinary brains. He/She tries to get involved in as many E/C as they can where they can manage without their parents guidance and physical support. However, clearly his E/C activities cannot be as great as the first student. </p>
<p>Who gets accepted if there was a choice between these two only? I am only a highschool junior but I will certainly put my money on the first student.</p>
<p>This is what angers me. Not all students have had the same chances. Sometimes not so brilliant and lazy students will be given enough push (mainly through the availability of money) and will be able to excel more than your brilliant, hardworking student. Although many minorities usually belong to the lower end of the socioeconomic scale, not all of them do. There are poor whites males as well as rich hispanic females. Socioeconomic factors, ie the chances you were given to excel, and how much advantage you took of them should be factor more into the admissions. </p>
<p>When these students enter college, mommies will usually have retired from this 24/7 job. Who will give these students the extra push? A student who has had to struggle to excel will certainly not need it. </p>
<p>I am sorry if I have offended anyone. I have been looking through the ivy league admissions threads to see what chance I have. I have come across this similar problem on most of the threads. I believe affirmative action is somewhat necessary. Not on race or gender basis, but on how much you have taken advantage of your circumstance. I believe the colleges are doing this but they look more on the gender and race factor rather than a students opportunities.</p>
<p>If anyone actually read through this and if it made sense :), please post you opinion.</p>
<p>vivibird~ I think that he put up another "exhausted application" for colleges to see and yes the asian thing hurts- A LOT.</p>
<p>Anyways: AA should be based on economics.</p>
<p>Well it is obvious that from an academic, athletic, and ec status you should have gotten it. I would guess that being a republican is what kept you out. Princeton has a reputation for wanting diversity of appearance but not of thought. In the long run you will probably be better off somewhere else.
J</p>
<p>Sristi,
You have written a well thought out essay on why economics should play a role in college admissions. The only problem is that your conclusion is not necessarily correct. If you look at the people admitted to Princeton, for example, you will see that the white and asian students that match your example did not usually get accepted. It is the white females from NJ and other mixed race or foreign students with lower scores and accomplishments that are accepted. This seems to be a trend in the IVYs. So to carry your thought a little farther, what about students who have different qualifications? Should the student from a poor economic background be given preference if his SATs are 200 points lower, GPA 0.2 lower, and fewer ECs? Where does the discrimination stop? Do you think that you can receive an excellent education in a state school or can that only be attained from an IVY? If an excellent education can be attained either place, why the need to discriminate against asian and whites males who had the unlucky experience of being born to parents who work and have money?
J</p>
<p>whats the chances of a African American kid with a 3.7UW and 4.2 W with a 2050 SAT getting into princeton....hardest courseload also</p>
<p>impressive</p>
<p>According to an admissions official I've met last summer on campus, Princeton DOES practice affirmative action "to a certain extent." She seemed to be very very vague on this rather sensitive topic, and quickly diverted to another topic.</p>
<p>HEY, Does anybadi know LESOTHO, De only country in the world which is landlocked in One Country. Thats where I m at writing AAlevels on my own. I aim too high right, American Prestigious Universities???</p>
<p>nope course not....no aim is ever 2 high!
Im tanzanian (east africa) and i got in!...as long as u have the grades n extracurricular 2 back u up..</p>
<p>this is last years ed decision forum</p>
<p>Then why is still sticked?</p>
<p>
I know it isn't fair but it looks like affirmative action stops the more qualified asian and caucasian applicants from getting in. I thought colleges stopped affirmative action. I remember we had a discussion on this in our english class after reading an essay by a hispanic PHD. Though the admissions committee favors these applicants, they actually feel bad. They did not get in the "right" way. The essay I mentioned describes that quite well.
</p>
<p>I don't have a problem with affirmative action per se as it seeks to remedy the disadvantage that certain ethnic groups/minorities have been historically subject to in the United States. I do take issue however with legacy preference (a sort of "reverse affirmative action" if you will). In fact, I'm sick and tired of seeing students on this board with mediocre SAT scores (in the 600s range) who nevertheless got into Princeton because of family connections while other kids with perfect 800 scores got deferred. </p>
<p>I've always been told that what made America different from the "old countries" ( like England for example) was precisely that the US was supposed to be a meritocracy where one's family name did not matter as long as you were willing to work hard for your goals. Apparently, from what we read on this board, that's not true as far as the Ivies are concerned. In fact, it seems that certain "legacy" kids have a "birth right" to attend Princeton provided that they meet only minimum (much lower) academic requirements. I find that deeply un-American.</p>
<p>I am a major Princeton legacy and currently a junior in high school. My father and uncle went to Princeton, as did my grandfather, as did my great-grandfather (only two years because a rich man paid for his tuition before the depression and then stopped). To this day my father believes he was not qualified enough to attend Princeton when he was accepted in the late 70s. It affects his self-confidence to this day. If I get accepted into Princeton I want it to because of my hard work, not my great-grandfather's hard work.</p>
<p>^^ Well then you know what you have to do</p>
<p>any indian got accepted?</p>