Other combined degree pgms.

Pre-Med & Medical School Multiple Degree Programs
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Ive spoken to NUMEROUS doctors and med students, and prospective med students...all who stay away from DO schools, and whod rather go to a foreign medical school.</p>

<p>Ive also read NUMEROUS articles about DO students wanting to transfer out of their DO school because its not what they want.</p>

<p>It will limit you TREMENDOUSLY and it isnt accepted. Idk where you live, but maybe you need to see how it works in NYC

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<p>So there you go again - you proving my point over and over. You are basically saying that a Caribbean MD program is always preferable to a DO. </p>

<p>And besides, I would tell you that I have also spoken to NUMEROUS doctors and med students who have all said that they think a DO program is better than a Caribbean MD program, and that the Caribbean MD program actually limits you more. And yes, some of them have practiced in NYC. So you have your anecdotes, and I have mine. What does that prove?</p>

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<p>i want you to show me exactly where I say that a carribbean MD is always preferable to a DO...no reading between the lines BS, cause you are construing what i say to mean what you want it to mean...which is obviously not the case.</p>

<p>Fact is there are caribbean med schools that are reputable and there are some that arent. If you go a decent caribbean medical school, do well, and are able to prove yourself to be a good physician, there is no doubt in my mind you will have more opportunities then a DO in cities such as Boston and NYC.</p>

<p>You can keep debating this with me, but you seem to just be playin devil's advocate because not once have you come up with a valid argument besides just making a generalized statement that all caribbean medical schools are bad (which is not the case...and hmm you seem to be very good with these generalized comments, ive noticed)</p>

<p>The two major hospitals in my area (20 miles outside of NYC) do not have 1 single DO working in them. You like numbers dont you...what does that tell you. And i know at least 2 doctors that are in successful practices, one a pulmonologist, the other a cardiologist, who graduated from caribbean medical schools. </p>

<p>That seems to be a good enough reason for me. I would absolutely not go to a DO school. It is not worth it AT ALL. Many doctors will tell you this. You can deny it as much as you want. But i guarentee you will find more physicians who will rather hire a doctor from a foreign medical school (or a caribbean medical school, IF THEY WERE ABLE TO SHOW THEY WERE CAPABLE) then a DO</p>

<p>Now i know you are gonna come back again and say that im saying all Caribbean med graduates are better then all DO's, and no im not saying that, im sure there are very intelligent DO's out there, i know of 1 actually...(he hates his job btw, he always regrets not goin to an MD school).</p>

<p>All im saying is that as long as you are a capable MD, you will probably have a better chance of being hired then a DO.</p>

<p>But go ahead, u can respond if you want, but you will just be talking to yourself. Go ahead, be a DO, i really could care less.</p>

<p>But as far as im concerned this conversation is over...i will not be responding anymore</p>

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<p>
[quote]
i want you to show me exactly where I say that a carribbean MD is always preferable to a DO...no reading between the lines BS, cause you are construing what i say to mean what you want it to mean...which is obviously not the case.

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<p>Once again:"your quote: "my cousin is a vascular surgeon and has a chair at mt sinai hospital...he himself told me to stay away from DO schools and he would choose a foreign med school over a DO""</p>

<p>What exactly does that mean, except that you are saying that your cousin is telling you to never prefer a DO to a foreign MD? I notice your how quote didn't say anything to the effect that your cousin would take things on a case-by-case basis or that he would weigh the work histories of the DO involved. He stated it categorically. He stated, categorically, that you should stay away from all DO programs. Seems pretty darn comprehensive to me. </p>

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[quote]
Fact is there are caribbean med schools that are reputable and there are some that arent. If you go a decent caribbean medical school, do well, and are able to prove yourself to be a good physician, there is no doubt in my mind you will have more opportunities then a DO in cities such as Boston and NYC.

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<p>That's not what you said before. You never said anything about your cousin differentiating between various Caribbean MD programs. You never said anything about the guy having to prove himself to be a good physician before. You said it categorically. So now you're changing your story. </p>

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just making a generalized statement that all caribbean medical schools are bad

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<p>Now you're just putting words in my mouth. I have always said that you need to take things on a case-by-case basis. Some Caribbean MD's are good. Some DO's are good. Others are bad. Which is why you have to look at things on an individual basis. You cannot categorically state things one way or another. </p>

<p>
[quote]
The two major hospitals in my area (20 miles outside of NYC) do not have 1 single DO working in them. You like numbers dont you...what does that tell you. And i know at least 2 doctors that are in successful practices, one a pulmonologist, the other a cardiologist, who graduated from caribbean medical schools.

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<p>I'll put it to you this way. At Mass General and the Brigham and Women's hospital in Boston, which are two of the most prestigious hospitals in the world (ranked #'s 3 and 12 according to USNews) , I happen to know that both hospitals hire DO's. One DO, I believe, is an oncology faculty member. So you like numbers, don't you? So what does that tell you? We got 2 of the most prestigious hospitals in the country hiring DO's. </p>

<p>
[quote]
That seems to be a good enough reason for me. I would absolutely not go to a DO school. It is not worth it AT ALL. Many doctors will tell you this. You can deny it as much as you want. But i guarentee you will find more physicians who will rather hire a doctor from a foreign medical school (or a caribbean medical school, IF THEY WERE ABLE TO SHOW THEY WERE CAPABLE) then a DO

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<p>So what are you saying, that Mass General and B&W are dumb? Why don't they fire those DO's in favor of some guy with a Caribbean MD? </p>

<p>So you know some hospitals that don't hire any DO's. And I know two highly prestigious hospitals that do. </p>

<p>Or maybe you'd like to contact those guys who are obviously highly successful and tell them that you would absolutely not choose to get a DO. I wonder what they would tell you. Considering their success, I don't think that too many of them regret not getting an MD. Or are you going to say that they aren't able to get clientele because the people in Boston don't want to have DO's treating them?</p>

<p>Look, why don't you just retreat back to a defensible position that we can all agree on - which is that US MD schools tend to be the best. But if you can't get into one of those, then you will need to consider other options, like a DO program or possibly a foreign MD program. If you can do well at a DO program or a foreign MD program, then you will be fine. Some DO's are better than some Caribbean MD's. And vice versa is also true. However, once you become a fully practicing physician, nobody is going to care where you went to school anyway. THAT is a perfectly reasonable and defensible position.</p>

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<p>lets get back to the original topic of BS/MD programs homies!</p>

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<p>US News ranked Michigan State University's College of Osteopathic Medicine 9th when it comes to top medical schools in primary care.</p>

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<p>do seniors (highschool) apply to the dental program at rutgers, or is that for the undergrads.</p>

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<p>^the combined program that is</p>

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<p>DOs are definitely better than a foreign MD...Caribbean schools are so easy to get into its almost a joke...DO schools actually have competition and would therefore be more prestigious</p>

<p>In my area, NJ, I know several DOs (my mom's an MD) and she told me that there is really no prejudice that they get their residency matches/spots...even her private practice doctor was a DO and no one really cared</p>

<p>Seriously...how many regular American citizens even know the difference between DO/MD and Caribbean/American schools...most aren't even aware of those topics in general and would be totally dumbfounded by this discussion</p>

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<p>ok sorry to break the discussion but I applied to bs/md programs, reg undergrad schools, and bs/do programs
how would you rank them- like which would you choose first, second, third</p>

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<p>just out of curiosity, which schools have bs/do programs?</p>

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<p>the only one i know of is the one at pitzer.</p>

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<p>TX tech does...do a google search, and I'm sure there's a lovely list.</p>

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<p>Hello. I am currently a student in the Pitzer's DO/BA Program and honestly, you'll obviously understand why I feel this thread is terrible so I decided to register and post.</p>

<p>I will straight be honest. This program will be easier to get into then USC's 8 year program or UCSD's or most of the other medical programs.</p>

<p>There are many misconceptions about being a DO. Is there prejudice against them? Yes. Do patients care though? Probably 90% of the time they don't. In fact, DOs are seeked out by patients sometimes because of our OMT skills, which is basically the extra portion of your training which is different from MDs.</p>

<p>Will DOs recieve PhDs and teach at big universities? Probably not, but it's not impossible! Most DOs actually go back to DO medical schools to teach.</p>

<p>Other things to think about:
California was almost going to turn into an all MD state by the government because they were going to convert all licensed DOs to MDs. Just one of the things bad happened to DOs.</p>

<p>UC Irvine's Medical School used to be DO until it turned into MD because of the above statement.</p>

<p>The midwest is where DOs are most popular in because that's where it was founded. East coast, not so much. Socal LA (where Pitzer is located in) is slowly balancing out to be both MD and DO area.</p>

<p>I have no take on the Carribean stuff, if it's better or not. But in the end, DOs are recognized as doctors, and if it is your dream to be a doctor, don't listen about how MDs are better. Apply to all of them.</p>

<p>Worried about Residencies? If you study hard, and you take the MD board tests, you can still apply to almost 90% of every residency in the nation. In fact, Western University sends usually 1 student to JHU and a bunch of USC's MD programs every year. They also send some students to some of the big name DO schools like Michigan. However, as people have mentioned before, DOs do face some prejudice and I know UCLA doesn't accept DOs are all. (I think they only accepted like 1 in a long long time from Western)</p>

<p>If you're wondering where Western ranks in terms of DO schools, I do believe they are one of the more highly rated in the nation and probably one of the best in the West Coast. The campus is kind of ugly and the area the school is in is terrible though :(</p>

<p>IN THE END THOUGH: It is all about studying hard. It doesn't matter what program, where or if you're just regular pre-med. Studying is the key. Without studying, you'll never get there. </p>

<p>Here is a link to my program if you are interested still:
Pitzer:
<a href="http://www.pitzer.edu/admission/westernu/westernu.asp%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.pitzer.edu/admission/westernu/westernu.asp&lt;/a>
Western University:
<a href="http://www.westernu.edu/xp/edu/joint_programs/linkage_pitzer.xml%5B/url%5D"&gt;http://www.westernu.edu/xp/edu/joint_programs/linkage_pitzer.xml&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p>

<p>I would leave my email for contacting, but I'm too busy studying for my medical program ^_^.</p>

<p>Good luck if you're interested.</p>

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<p>I was accepted to the Texas A&M 8-year medical program this year (called Partnership for Primary Care). I had a 3.8 unweighted GPA. 8 AP Test credits. Volunteered at hospitals, shadowed doctors, community service...all the basic stuff.</p>

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<p>can someone provide list of Dental combined programs? thank you!</p>

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<p>If you are worrying about not getting into combined programs, good alternative to DO or Caribean could be BA(BS)/MD programs at state schools that are not very well known and still are very solid programs with all perks (special attention, advising and guidenance, QUARANTEED SPOT in Med. School, etc.). Research outside of CC, you might be surprised! GOOGLE is a very good tool. Huge benefits of these is if you are accepted to in-state, you most likely will have either whole tuition paid or better yet a full ride plus you will definately be in small Honors classes with all other priviliges of Honors like registration before upperclassman, free summer classes, etc.</p>

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<p>Does anyone know where I can find the list of combined degree dental programs? BS /DDS or BS /DMD</p>

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<p>hey everyone. NYIT also has a 7 yr BS/DO program that I was recently accepted to. My mom will not allow me to go there until I receive a reply from the two BS/MD programs I applied saying they rejected me. So right now, I am on a hunt to try to figure out if going to NYIT's program would be worthwhile if I don't make it to the BS/MD programs. I read the earlier argument on DO's and MD's. My cousin who had wonderful stats was rejected from all east coast med schools. He got interviews from all schools in the mid west but it will be hard for him to move out there. Now, I am thinking I should stick to the NYIT program if the bs/md doesn't work because there is no guarantee what will happen to me. I might end up waiting 2-3 yrs to get accepted to med school when I could get a head start on a DO with this program which is guaranteed acceptance to NYCOM. Any advice as to what I should do?</p>

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<p>Well, WantingSophie, first off, congrats on getting accepted into the BS/DO program!!</p>

<p>Secondly, the thing about DOs is that they have to take a couple extra classes than the MDs, and they can only do rotations at hospitals that support the DO curriculum, etc., but that is something that the med school will set you up with so you don't really have to worry about that.</p>

<p>There are some employers who prefer the MD over the DO, so you should keep that in mind before comitting to the DO program. Definetly wait to hear from the BS/MD schools first, because the MD is universally accepted.</p>

<p>Also, if you are looking to get into really competitive residencies and fellowships, like most types of surgical fields (for residency and fellowship) and dermatology (for fellowship), it may be easier to get a spot if you have an MD because it is unfairly preferred over the DO by lots of medical centers.</p>

<p>Other than that, both the degrees give you the same education and you won't be "less of a doctor", per se, by getting the DO. There is always that stigmatism in society that people who get DOs are less "smart" than people with MDs, because, traditionally, DO schools are easier to get into than MD schools. You should disreguard this completely, because both types of doctors ultimately get the same education.</p>

<p>One last note: as part of my medically related ECs in HS, i job shadowed ER physicians at a hospital whose ER ONLY employed DOs and I must say that they were definetly great doctors.</p>

<p>I wish you best of luck with whatever you choose to do!</p>

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<p>This is something written by ocwaveoc, which i read in studentdoctornetwork. I find this quote quite true after shadowing some D.O.'s this semester.

[quote]

1) Why do so few DOs use OMM? (some may argue that more than the stats indicate use OMM due to insurance issues etc...but, if OMM is the one of the defining differences between MDs and DOs, I'd think that more would use OMM) I thought of some reasons
* Perhaps most DO students/grads really wanted to goto MD schools and settled on DO schools just to become physicians. After all, a physician is a physician regardless of the letters after one's name. So, the DO students never really had strong interest in OMM anyway....hmm..can this be it?
* Perhaps, OMM really doesn't work in more cases than say pharmacological methods to deal with medical issues. So, students learn it but since it doesn't really work as well unless you are very good at it they end up not using it....could this be one of the reasons?
* Perhaps, it works well if done correctly. But, it's just not taught in ways that encourages/shows the beauty of OMM. I've heard from an OMM specialist that the students don't really see how it works during the 1st 2 yrs when they learn it and rarely get to see it in action (at least not a lot) even in the 3rd and 4th yr unless you do an OMM rotation.
* Perhaps the outcome from OMM txs are not as apparent as say the effects you get from taking meds....could this be the reason why not many use OMM? </p>

<p>I get the feeling the real reason (along with insurance reimbursement issues) is a some combination of some or all of the above. </p>

<p>2) I know why I initially applied to DO schools and the reason was a logical one. But, when I asked myself why someone who's just finishing up a 4 yr college degree without a lot of medical background be interested in a DO degree despite the well known discrimination against DOs by some MDs, I couldn't understand their interest in a DO degree. I know some buy into the "holistic" approach the DO schools advertise. But, I'd think that those people are the minorities of the DO applicants. I'm sure many applicants have had good experiences with DOs and became interested in the degree. But, what is interesting is that for some reason, most of the (note that I said MOST, not ALL) DO applicants have stats significantly lower than typical MD matriculants. </p>

<p>What I really think is that since most with lower stats know they have low chance of an MD admission, they settle for a DO degree. Again, there are, I'm sure who even chose a DO school over an MD school. But, I bet you those are a small/tiny exceptions. I bet that 75% of DO applicants, if given a MD acceptance, they'd forego with the DO acceptance and go the MD route. You may argue with me on this. But, it is strange that most people gung ho about DO school are the ones with low stats who likely couldn't get into an MD school (again not ALL, I'm sure. I'm sure some of you have stats good enough for MD schools and preferred DO over MD). </p>

<p>But, it is unfortunate that there is a "stigma" against DOs that may make some DO applicants feel they'd prefer an MD degree since the didactic is pretty much the same.....it's just the matter of the letters at the end of the name....and.......</p>

<p>3) The clinical years during the 3rd and 4th yr in DO school. From what I hear, many allo residencies are a bit wary of DO students because the consistency in the quality of education during the rotation years is much more varied than the MD school 3rd and 4th year rotations. So perhaps, places like PCOM and CCOM have good rep due to solid rotation sites and controlled quality of rotation experience compared to some others. I've heard that this aspect of DO education is thought by the MD world as being significantly inferior to the MD counterpart. This isn't my opinion. This was the opinion of an MD residency director. </p>

<p>4) Except for 1 MD I spoke to, I'd say all others didn't have the best opinions about the DO degree. Knowing this I wondered if I became a DO, how I'd feel working with MDs. </p>

<p>I bring these pts up because I really feel that it's unfortunate the MD and DO thing is the way it is. It's unwarranted. A good physician is a good physician no matter what the degree. But, in our world, there are pecking orders, prejudices and other issues. I mean, even in the MD world there are pecking orders.....family med physicians are looked down upon by way the orthopods......physical medicine docs are looked down upon by the neuro surgeons etc...... I've been told about this by numerous MDs. It's too bad. But, what I can control is getting a good education, working hard and servicing my patients the best way I can. </p>

<p>I too have chosen the MD route. Easier obtaining residencies (don't need to feel like I need to take 2 licensing exams!), less discrimination and the perception by the residency directors that my schools' clinical rotation experiences were likely superior to the DO counterparts are the reason I chose to go MD over DO. I wished there weren't such issues because I really wanted to stay in Socal where my DO acceptance was.

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