<p>Jasmom - The process can be SO stressful, one thing I'd do differently is set up family time when conversations about college/future/applications is completely off limits.......</p>
<p>Jasmom - ABSOLUTELY TRUE!!! the college chase is saturating - need down time thru out the process to recharge and regroup and feel human again - even if only for a little while lol. We actually did do that - it really helped to keep the family more intact during the process.</p>
<p>I think that as pessimistic as we were, we were to optimistic about HYPSM schools and possibly overly focused on them. </p>
<p>What we did right was starting early (freshman year). Junior and senior years were still grueling but D seemed to have less stress than many others simply because she already had a fairly good conceptual map of the terrain that had been slowly built up in 9th and 10th grades.</p>
<p>About visiting before applying, I'm emphatically in the "Pro" camp. Columbia had been her #1 on paper...she didn't even apply. She was a bit dubious about womens colleges...now she says she wouldn't trade Smith for Harvard. The whole LAC thing was a major lightbulb going off for all of us, something that would not have happened had we not visited. Moreover, two very similar schools on paper can have very different feels and, notwithstanding the random "fluke" factor of individual tour guides and such, more information is almost always good and the feel of a place where you're going to spend four years is more important than some may think: student body, attitudes, etc.</p>
<p>I wish I'd found CC a year earlier but compared to now it was thinly populated and the rocks were still cooling.</p>
<p>In retrospect there should have been more focus on finding a "safety" school where my D would still be happy and challenged. She was lucky and ended up not needing one but none of her choices could have been called a sure thing.</p>
<p>I think I will be able to better answer this question in a couple of weeks. We have 2 of 6 decisions in and S doesn't know which college he will choose if we were to get 6/6.</p>
<p>Each student has different needs. For some HYP is possible and a reasonable expectation. For most, there are so many other schools that will provide a quality undergrad education. After all, in today's time isn't it just the start? Of course the school's reputation matters in acceptance to graduate programs,etc....but what if attending a second or third tier with better scholarship offers, more attention by being at the top of the school's student percentages, potential to get the great study abroad offers,etc would lead to a greater portfolio for the next step? I just think it should be "all about the ivy's".</p>
<p>sorry correction...that is should NOT be "all about the Ivy's".</p>
<p>Are there examples of overdoing? I do not think that there is an universal answer for everyone. If I had to cite one, it would mention the submission of an excessive number of applications to schools one would not attend anyhow. I have seen a few of those reports, and I have never really understood why the application was sent in the first place. For instance, candidates who do not like a rural setting won't gain much much from sending applications to a Williamsnesque school. Yet, it happens! </p>
<p>I think that one cannot overdo the pure research in the schools. That is why CC is so valuable, and especially the real life reports of students and parents. I think it is also important to pay special attention to the posts with which we tend to disagree -on the surface. People who are 100% in support of large research universities should pay attention to the opinions of the pro-LAC crowd, and vice versa. </p>
<p>While everyone approach has to be different and tailored to specific needs, I do NOT regret having started from the bottom up, in the sense that I started by lining up my safeties. I considered the selection of my safeties to be the most important step, and I would have been happy to attend any of the so-called safeties. Armed with the satisfaction and peace of mind of having been accepted at SOME school, I ONLY added schools that were harder to be accepted and that would still provide a good fit. I think that, by starting at the bottom, I was able to keep the list quite short. I think that starting at the top yields TOO MANY wonderful choices and TOO many disappointments or TOO MANY hard choices (in case of multiple acceptances). </p>
<p>Again, I understand that, for some, it is realistic to compile a list of the so-called top 15 or 20 schools that include all Ivies and play the odds. I still think that in the end most students end up at a school that provides the best match. The problem we all face(d) is to recognize that it is not necessarily the most prestigious or better known school.</p>
<p>jeepmom, thanks for your good wishes.</p>
<p>I am really very fortunate. I am attending a wonderful high school in Northern VA, have managed to get a good GPA and excellent SAT scores. I think the rest of my profile should also aid me - though with the competition being what it is, one never knows what willl transpire with the other college applications. I am also fortunate that my parents have told me that they will finance me for the best college that I am able to get into. I feel badly for those who have the academic credentials to get into selective colleges - but are not able to attend because they are unable to afford it.</p>
<p>I am sure that there are colleges where the "feel" is not right for some. For my part, I know based on my academic experience to date, any college that offers a challenging academic environment will be a good fit for me. The only other criteria for me was that I did not want to be in a college that was in a totally urban setting eg Columbia or in a location that was miles away from an urban setting eg Dartmouth.</p>
<p>Note for The Dad: my sister went to Smith and she loved it. Her only regret was that Northampton is a little isolated. Had she had the choice again, she would have chosen Wellesley over Smith - because if its location close to Boston. She feels that going to a womens' college was one of the best decisions that she ever made.</p>
<p>For us, it would have saved us a lot of time if we hadn't listened to all the Negative Neds & Nervous Nellies. Even with recent postings about rejections from Safeties, etc., there was no 4-alarm fire for my own D. The hysteria surrounding the prognoses of Doom were just excessive, esp. for students who have really excelled or are exceptional. I'm far too gullible when it comes to exaggerations in books & from people "in the know" (uh-huh).</p>
<p>I think each student's record & ability has to be looked at separately when it comes to the college search. I actually think the 'tweeners (those who are not off the charts but who are also not just average students) are those with the greatest challenges right now: finding a stimulating enough atmosphere, equal to their abilities, but one which will accept their stats. For a student like that, more prep/research/visiting may be in order, & more diversity in the college list. But as long as the family has prepared reasonably for contingencies, anxiety even then is not helpful.</p>
<p>Outside of my own family, those who have had the most trouble -- or are hurting the most right now from rejections, deferrals, & waiting -- are those who did not go through enough steps to determine features which they would want in a college, AND colleges which would value them (because of the kinds of students they seem to seek, or their admissions processes). Their searches were all over the place in terms of type, style, curriculum, etc., with no pattern, no direction. The "fit" question was never really addressed, & therefore so far has not been answered.</p>
<p>Fit is everything, & it's two-way.</p>
<p>Just as an aside, I posted this in response to someone else on another thread.</p>
<p>The school that I go to is Thomas Jefferson High School for Science and Technology in Northern Virginia. It is a public school, though admission is limited to about 420 students each year to its freshman class. Just about any 8th grader who attends any public or private school, in Northern Virginia, can apply for admission which is determined based on a standardized test, recommendations, grades, etc.</p>
<p>In 2005, there were 153 National Merit Semifinalists from about 420 seniors. The median SAT score for the school is over 1480!</p>
<p>The irony is that it actually makes it more difficult to get into some of the more selective colleges because there are so many extremely well-qualified applicants from TJHSST and colleges obviously look to limit the number that they admit from a single school in order to achieve diversity. However, I would not trade the education that I got at TJHSST for anything.</p>
<p>Back to the preapplication visit issue. For #1, given his record and the schools to which he applied, it was highly likely that he would be admitted to almost all of the schools. The problem with waiting til after admissions came in was that it was impossible to schedule the post-admissions visits to all of the schools (5) in April because of their locations (from west coast to east coast and in between) and because of the limited amount of time available to take off from school. He never did visit one of the schools he was admitted to (Carleton).</p>
<p>The first time around S applied to 4 medium to big schools in big East/West coast cities. 1 reach 2 matches 1 safety. S2 will stick with that strategy, maybe adding a reach or two. </p>
<p>The second time around we will;</p>
<p>Seriously consider UK schools, the 3 year BA and the single/dual subject concentration. </p>
<p>Book S and laptop/printer in out of town hotel to complete apps in September.</p>
<p>For my son, I was way too involved and emotionally stressed out by the process... in part because my son is a procrastinator... once he got his UC apps in on time (due at the end of November), I really should have let go, and let him manage the rest. All that nagging and hair pulling wasn't worth it. I mean, my son did decide that maybe he ought to consider Swarthmore the day after the deadline for applying... and the world didn't come to an end when I told him it was too late already. He probably would have gotten most of the apps in on time without my nagging, and if not... well, maybe it wasn't meant to be (see next paragraph).</p>
<p>I was also too emotionally tied up in the process of selecting a college --- as if that was going to be the most momentous decision of my son's life. It wasn't. At this point I would say that the college he chose is going to end up being a footnote in his life story (he dropped out after 2 years, and I don't think he's kept up with his friends from college, or that any particular course he took or experience he had has much impact on his life right now.). </p>
<p>With my daughter I am going to back off and let her control the process, and I'm not going to stress over it. Whatever will happen, will happen. [Of course, the fact that my d. is super-organized with a system of files and binders already in place for her college stuff, and made her own arrangements to visit U. of Chicago earlier this year is part of the reason I'm not losing sleep over this kid. This one definitely can and will figure it all out without me ;) ]</p>
<p>Wouldbemd: brag much? :) ;)</p>
<p>Re the visit thing (lderochi, post #8).
I can't say what I would recommend, but I can say what I issues I had with #1 and how that affects my view with #2. </p>
<p>My son visited 2 colleges before acceptance, one after - doing overnights at each. The problem is that he used the visits to decide on his first choice, but could not attend that school because the did not offer financial aid. So in hindsight it might have been better to defer visiting -- once the award packages were in, the choices were more clear. Looking for "fit" and comparison shopping is not such a good idea when the colleges you are looking at may very well be out of reach financially. </p>
<p>So I think I will encourage my daughter to take a lighter approach to campus visiting -- to visit a few, but with the idea of developing a sense of what she might like in a college, rather than trying to pick out the best fit or a first choice. It's better in the end if she makes her choices from available options. So she will visit - she already has visited one college with a friend, which she liked very much -- but I think that we are not going to make a point of visiting any particular college.</p>
<p>I guess the financial thing really does change perspective. It is not a financial hardship for us to visit the colleges - so money isn't a barrier in that sense. But it's hard to do serious shopping when you don't know whether or not you will be able to afford what you are looking at.</p>
<p>Congratulations to all of you who have gotten good news, and hang in there to those who are still biting nails. </p>
<p>My comment is to whoever characterized someone's entry as "bragging." If that was bragging, I missed it. </p>
<p>Everyone is requested to be quite honest in this forum. Please continue to be, and please continue to allow others to speak frankly about their own good fortune (and hard work). I'm sure folks say things here they wouldn't say at a cocktail party, and that's as it should be.</p>
<p>That said, we looked at lots of schools with my first D, and are looking at lots with my second D. The advantage was that my D ended up being familiar with lots of schools, so that all of the schools (including safeties) that she applied to were ones she'd be quite comfortable attending. Life is looking up now, since she got into 3/4. (She's still waiting for a few other letters.)</p>
<p>nedad, re your comment on bragging - there were smileys after the comment so perhaps, your comment was tongue in cheek.</p>
<p>However, as I re-read my post, I can see why it might come across that way if examined in isolation. But if you look at my earlier posts on this thread, you will see I stated that the "feel" of a school that would be gained from visiting the campus is of far less importance to me than the academic/intellectual challenge that would be provided by the right college. If you ask most students at TJHSST, they would probably tell you that what they like best about the school is the environment that fosters open discussion, an intellectually demanding curriculum and peers who are as motivated to do well as they are. </p>
<p>I refrained from any specifics about my own achievements. </p>
<p>I will state categorically, that being accepted to TJHSST was perhaps that best thing that has happened to me from an academic standpoint. Four years from now, I hope that I can say the same about the college that I end up attending.</p>
<p>Calmom,
Regarding your post #35, I think your 3rd paragraph is an important insight. I think that many students and parents place too much emphasis on falling in love with a college early on, even indirectly/secondarily, & with the best intentions relative to the subject of "fit," as well as to the related "interest" factor that a fit implies & results in -- given that both fit & interest can be elements in admission & selection.</p>
<p>I think your approach is prudent, if not as "sexy," and will become very important for those of us with younger 'uns still coming through the process in the next 3-5 yrs of that population peak curve. Yes, "available options" is an imp. phrase -- whether that's financial, academic, geographic, etc. I think visiting a representative selection becomes more important when an applicant is somewhat clueless as to his or her own preferences in a campus or a geography. That in itself can eliminate excessive applications & narrow the options -- helping to fashion an appropriate list within realistic bounds.</p>
<p>It can be a blessing in disguise to have limited finances & time to visit many colleges prior to admission & application.</p>
<p>Focusing too much on the Love Affair has resulted in a lot of trauma among some I know, & know of. They're still recovering from being jilted, which has colored their resultant searches for a mate.</p>
<p>We learned a few things from S's college search four years ago that we applied to D's search:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Start visiting earlier, if even just pairing a visit with a weekend getaway. First true visits with S weren't until February of junior year. With D, we started looking in August before junior year.</p></li>
<li><p>With each college visited, be optimistic and receptive but remain neutral. S was overwhelmed with his college visits so he couldn't think straight, but D would get emotional about hers. We tried to be open but not feed into premature dreams.</p></li>
<li><p>Do the parental searching first and present information for child to review to determine which schools to visit. With S, it was pretty overwhelming since he needed to schedule portfolio reviews as well, whereas it was less stressful with D.</p></li>
<li><p>Keep parental anxiety under control. This is a hard one. We were pretty anxious with S since his major was specialized, so there were fewer schools from which to choose. With D, we tried to stay focused on deadlines while waiting for her ED decision.</p></li>
<li><p>Organize the apps and score-sending deadlines to minimize costs. This time around, we figured out to which schools we should send D's first SATI scores and to which ones her second batch would benefit her and saved some money that way. We continued to do the Excel spreadsheet that we used with S to keep us on track with deadlines.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Even though we felt we handled it better this time around, D still felt we were a little too intrusive about the process, but in the end, it all worked out well.</p>
<p>WouldbeMD - very well said. You sound as tho you have chosen well and will be very able to adjust to whatever enviornment you end up in - many kids have difficulty doing that - especially if it is not where they want to be. You have a very mature attitude about your future and how you will get there. Hang on to that - it will take you far. Being adaptable in any given situation is a trait that I really do admire. You sound as tho you have made very good choice - you are intelligent and well presented - I have NO doubt that you will do well and go far. Good luck with your final choice - I am sure you will be happy where ever you are.</p>