Overwhelmed in Texas

<p>Hello, MT thread community. I have been lurking and reading (and reading and reading) the archived drama school threads for a while now and have just started on the MT threads. There is weeks of reading to do here - and I can get through Gone With The Wind in two days, so even a fast reader has a job to do. I am so grateful to have found such a resource though and thanks in advance for the help.</p>

<p>My d is going into her senior year - is a theater monkey. Many things are still undecided. BA then on to MFA vs BFA, and mt or a more general theater major for starters. Those questions will probably be answered by where she ends up going, because getting in and especially being able to afford it are definitely going to limit her options. In particular, being able to afford it. We make too much money to get a dime from the feds except for loans, and I am vehemently against her taking loans because I firmly believe if she has to start paying them off right away, she could end up with some ordinary old job type job and then end up doing that the rest of her life, because one thing leads to another; you get lulled into the security, or just trapped. If she is loan free, she can take a lot more risks as far as what she wants to try to do, as she will only have to figure out how to keep a roof over her head and eat while she is waiting for her big break. lol. As if that isn't hard enough. But a big old loan too - I just am really against it.</p>

<p>However of course we don't have anywhere close to enough money to fund a private school. In fact even the pricier state schools are going to be a stretch for us if she doesn't bring in some good scholarships or grants.</p>

<p>Sadly, like many fine arts type kids, her academics are not in the top one or two percent. </p>

<p>Goes to a large suburban high school - overall good school; not a famous prep school, nothing special, does have good academic choices and AP/Dual Credit choices. </p>

<p>Drama department is, shall we say, in the midst of building itself back up again. Help there has been sporadic and most of her stage experience so far has been in community theater - where she has had a couple nice roles, was Liesl in SOM and Chava in Fiddler as well as a few smaller roles. :-)</p>

<p>She took the PSAT and did well but not well enough to be a National Merit Scholar.
Her grade point average is 3.62, unweighted. I have no idea what it is weighted, because our high school advising department employs the most singularly uninterested, unknowledgable, and unhelpful people I have ever seen and they do not understand what I mean when I ask "so what is my daughter's weighted GPA on a 4 point scale?" I get some mumblings about a 91. The more questions I ask the less helpful the answers seem to get. So we are on our own, baby.</p>

<p>She was in the top 8% but had a rough year and is only in the top 13% now, though she swears she'll bring that back up in this upcoming 7th semester. She is currently 53 out of 445 students.</p>

<p>She has taken DC Spanish, and is planning on DC English, Algebra, and Sociology this fall. All of these DC classes will transfer to any Texas state school. Generally they are pointless as far the private schools go, so if goes to one, it will have been money wasted. But if she goes to a state school, she could get pretty much an entire semester of general ed credits out of the way. Totally playing craps here, no way to know if it will pay off or not yet.</p>

<p>SAT is not very good; she trained for ACT which is what most midwestern states take and she did better at that, but because she is weak in math and science only has a 28. (her reading is a 32 and writing a 31, though!) We have time for her to retake it once and hopefully bring up her science and raise her composite.</p>

<p>SAT is 1760 out of 2400. Has only taken it once.</p>

<p>She has been dancing since age 4 at a studio whose emphasis is on actual dance as opposed to gymnastics, "dance teams" or cheerleading or other peripheral areas of interest. She has been en pointe for 7 years now :-) and has been in the community ballet Christmas show (usually Nutcracker) several times though she is too busy to do it every year. This is an auditioned show btw. She takes jazz, tap, and Spanish.</p>

<p>She has a trainable voice that needs a lot more training. lol. It's very pretty, and she has a good range (a comfortable 3 octaves) and a pretty good ear, good sense of rhythm (yay for tap lessons!) but needs to work a lot on getting the instrument in good shape. Breath control, where to "put" the note, etc. She has a wonderful voice coach who has improved her vastly the past couple years.</p>

<p>She is a good actress - made everyone cry as Chava - she has "sparkle" on stage, people tell me. </p>

<p>So that is what we have to work with.</p>

<p>Reach or dream schools are no problem figuring out which ones she likes. Big out of state State schools are no problem figuring out which ones she likes. Our issue is safety schools and by safety I mean also financial safety. We need some of those because I am afraid what will happen is that after applications and everything come back, what will happen is she'll probably get accepted to at least a couple but they won't offer enough money that we can comfortably (or at all, really) send her without taking out WAY more loans than she should. Like, we'll have a gap of 24,000 a year or so after scraping up everything we can, and there is NO WAY IN HELL I can personally support a decision for a theater arts or liberal arts major to go out into the world with an undergrad degree and so much as a dime over 20,000 of debt - at the max maybe 30,000. If she were going into petrochemical engineering, or if we were talking about medical school, yeah, sure, but I have unhappy first hand experience with the folly of taking on a debt load that is out of line with the reasonable expectations of the earning potential of that field.</p>

<p>So if she got into Oklahoma City or Oberlin (two of her top choices) but they left too much of a gap for her to go, we are pretty much looking at state schools. </p>

<p>My brother is insisting that UT is the most pedigreed school out there and I have objections to it.</p>

<p>Nobody has probably ever heard of Stephen F Austin, I bet. We went there and it has a lovely theater department actually. Many productions during the year, and a wonderful internship program with five different regional choices including Guthrie, or a European theater experience in London and Madrid or Estonia, that is their entire junior or senior year if they do a BFA. </p>

<p>There is also San Marcos (Texas State University) which has a well developed program.</p>

<p>SMU would be great but it's private and would need to give her a bunch of money. As you can see with her stats, she's not gonna be like Thesbohemian and blow them away with her academics; I have no idea how she will fare at auditions. She's good but so are sooooo many others.</p>

<p>Her drama teacher has never even mentioned (that I know of) Unifieds. She does take her seniors to TETA, and D will be going to that. We don't even have a monolog picked out yet! Gotta get to work!</p>

<p>Sorry so long - what is my question? It is, considering her ability and stats, and our financial restrictions, and our utter lack of any outside help, what schools should we really look at as far as fit/safety, and is there something I might not be aware of in the application/audition process, for a girl in her position?</p>

<p>Does that make any sense? :-) She's very sparkley and outgoing and oh yes. Also she has a very strong costuming talent. She won first place this year (YES!<em>victory dance</em>) in the state at UIL - theater costume design this year (Antigone! which she set in 19th century India!) and last year was a finalist. So she wants to split her concentration between performance and tech/costuming. So...any advice on that one also?</p>

<p>sorry so long. :-(</p>

<p>Hi snapdragonfly. Always glad to see another Texas parent here! For a pretty good discussion of the Texas schools:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/868859-what-best-schools-texas-mt.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/musical-theater-major/868859-what-best-schools-texas-mt.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>You honestly won’t know about talent money until your D auditions and is accepted. At some schools there is a clear range of talent money available and you can find that info on their website. Do you have an amount that you are willing to contribute to her education? I created a spreadsheet and tracked all the schools my D auditioned for. I looked at the COA and then deducted scholarships and then student loans/work study from that to see what we would be out of pocket. It was helpful along the way for us to see if there were any schools that were just not doable so she could move past them so to speak. </p>

<p>My D attended TETA and really enjoyed it. She did get some Acting acceptances directly from her TETA audition but all the MT programs that called her back wanted her to audition on campus or at Unifieds. We attended the LA Unifieds and found them to be pretty laid back.</p>

<p>Can’t help you on the performance/tech/costuming mix. But I am sure there are others out here who can help you with that.</p>

<p>Best of luck to you and your D as she “beings” this journey. It was a wild ride for us with lots of ups and downs but one that ultimately led my D to a program that we are thrilled she will be attending.</p>

<p>Another Texas family!! My daughter will be starting a BA MT program this fall. She really didn’t want to stay in Texas, but we encouraged her to audition for Texas State and TCU, as well as applying to UT-Austin (non-audition). We are also not eligible for financial aid, but she received a large merit scholarship from TCU (based on high school record), as well as a small performance based scholarship. It basically brought the cost down to about the same as UT. Alas, she turned them both down and is going out of state to a private school. But don’t count out private schools, many give substantial merit aid. (You might also check out Sam Houston State in Huntsville - I’ve heard good things about it) And her best friend will be majoring in costume design at LSU.</p>

<p>Sam Houston State has an apprenticeship program with Theatre Under the Stars in Houston, which is a great theatre! My D took classes and did a Miller Ourdoor Musicals show there and loved everything about TUTS!
[Department</a> of Theatre and Dance - Sam Houston State University](<a href=“http://www.shsu.edu/catalog/thr.html]Department”>http://www.shsu.edu/catalog/thr.html)</p>

<p>Thanks for the quick replies, austinmtmom and megpmom!</p>

<p>Actually yes I did some number crunching and I do have a number that I know we can contribute, assuming the creek don’t flood as they say. (some catastrophic situation changer).</p>

<p>I have sort of started a spreadsheet but have been overwhelmed at how to narrow it down and what to put on it but I think I’m starting to get a picture on that, too.</p>

<p>I actually just found that Texas schools thread and was excited to read about what is happening at TSU. Actually last summer it was the very first school that d and I toured, and we thought it was a real nice school but didn’t think the theater department seemed like it got much attention. Either we didn’t really know what to look for and compare (most likely) or our tour guide was uninformed, and this Kaitlyn superstar hadn’t taken it over quite yet. </p>

<p>I am real excited about taking a second look at them. Looks like the chance to get in on the ground floor of a rising star. But! With the MT program being so selective, if she didn’t get accepted into MT, would that hurt her experience just in general theater if she went there?</p>

<p>Texas State offers both BA and BFA degrees. So if she didn’t get in to the MT program she could certainly go the BA route. Or also look at the BFA in Acting degree (also by audition.) But since the BFA program is new, I don’t think anyone can really tell you yet how the performance opportunities and overall BA experience will shake out at TSU.
[Undergraduate</a> Programs : Department of Theatre and Dance : Texas State University](<a href=“http://www.theatreanddance.txstate.edu/TH-DA-Degrees/undergrad.html]Undergraduate”>http://www.theatreanddance.txstate.edu/TH-DA-Degrees/undergrad.html)</p>

<p>I’m not at all familiar with Texas State, so this comment is not directed at that school; however, in general I would advise caution in looking at brand-new programs. It often takes a few years for all the kinks to get ironed out, often to the detriment of the students.
Also – and again, this is not specific – in some schools which have both a BFA and BA program, the BA students get the short end of the stick with regard to casting, scheduling and instructors. This is by no means true at every school, so be sure you do your research.</p>

<p>If you are really interested in combining the performance aspect with the technical side of theatre (costuming), I would think your D would have to get into a BA program to be able to actually do this. Most BFA/MT programs are just too full of required performance classes to be able to fit in even a minor in theatre tech. However, a BA program in many schools may give you the flexibility to add a tech minor. </p>

<p>Also on a different note, although we are not from Texas, we had similar thoughts on how much we could/would spend on college, so it did limit my D’s choices somewhat. Luckily for us we had some very excellent choices of in-state schools that had both wonderful BA and BFA programs. She did apply & audition at a “reach” private school and was offered an excellent academic scholarship there which would have made it “doable” if she had gotten into the BFA program. She did not, but she’s very happy with her choice. I guess I’m trying to say, pick at least one or two reach schools she likes even if you think they might be a little out of your price range (I don’t mean like WAY out of your range by any means) because there’s a chance she could get a good enough scholarship to even things out. Best of luck to you!</p>

<p>Snapdragonfly,
I’m in Austin; 2 Ds in MT…one graduated from OCU, one from SHSU. You mentioned your D is looking seriously at OCU and Oberlin…is she wanting to get a BM?<br>
Texas State is certainly up and coming but I have to agree with onstage that it can be dicey to start with a brand new program. TXState says they auditioned 600 and accepted 14 this year. They have all the right PR going and some big-name faculty but it remains to be seen how they fare overall. I’m hoping to see a couple of their shows this year as I know a few of the new students and I know some of the faculty.
SHSU may be a decent option for your D…very inexpensive! Their BFA allows for a student to ‘concentrate’ in either voice, acting or dance…with most kids choosing dance. Their shows are usually good…and class size small.
My youngest attended UCO (University of Central Oklahoma) for two years before transferring to SHSU…UCO is also a BM.</p>

<p>2DsnMT - She is not a musician, so, no on the BM. She did take piano lessons from the age of 7 or so until around 14, but, does not sight read well and it’s just not her love. ~ironically though I think it led to this whole THEATER business as she auditioned for The Music Man on a whim, and they had the girls play “goodnight my someone” on the piano for the audition - which she did figure out all on her own despite her sketchy sight reading. Well, she got Amaryllis, and it’s been all downhill from there. lol.</p>

<p>We have not looked at Sam Houston yet - not fond of the town, but, that’s in the “I would prefer” category. The two non negotiable qualities are, is it the right program, and, can we afford it. We need to look at SHSU, because you never know till you go. We have been to UNT twice and we just…don’t like it. I don’t know why. But she is just not excited about it and I have to say I agree…it doesn’t “feel” right to either of us. Though I know it’s a great school for a lot of kids. You have to visit, there’s no other way to know!</p>

<p>Her big love is MT but she doesn’t have to go to a school with an MT degree, necessarily. She does need to go someplace that will also support her getting Tech (costuming) experience as I consider Costuming to be her fallback profession. It’s still the arts, and competitive, -though the line for those jobs is waaaay shorter than for roles on stage and looks, age, weight, etc, matter not - but the fact is that this girl is not going to be happy teaching, or adding up numbers, or going into “communications” or “business” (which I think a general theater major prepares a person for those types of things possibly just as well as we all know how amazing are the skills you learn in theater) and if she can’t get that big break to be in the spotlights, she would have a lot more fun still being in theater. She loves the whole collaborative creative thing and has enjoyed her gigs as stage manager and being in the chorus as much as she did her bigger roles. </p>

<p>But she really has a flair, I’m tellin ya, for this costume thing and she needs to not abandon it, even while she works on performance.</p>

<p>Why did your daughter transfer?</p>

<p>Snapdragonfly,
I sent you a PM…</p>

<p>snapdragonfly, in response to your original post, my D has graduated from OCU and all her DC classes were accepted, so don’t assume that they will only count at state schools. Get as many as possible out of the way and that will open up room in her schedule for costuming classes. I would urge you to look at SHSU also. I know a couple of guys who are/will be attending and they are amazingly talented. What part of Texas are you in? I am in the DFW area.</p>

<p>We are not far - 3 hours to the east on I-30. Don’t really want to name the town but if you are in Dallas you will know which it is. :slight_smile: </p>

<p>We are going to look at SHSU. In fact I called the department head today and she was very nice, answered my questions, we are going to go visit. And the more I think about it the more I think that taking the DC classes are the smart thing for her to do - all the Texas schools will take them and I think some of the others might, though I know neither Dartmouth nor Oberlin will, but, those are a real <em>reach</em> for her anyway. Yeah, if she could get a lot of those out of the way it will leave room for what life is all about - more theater stuff!! Yay!</p>

<p>Still think we ought to consider going to Unifieds if nothing else just for the experience. I am thinking the Chicago one. When I talked to SHSU, the BFA is an auditioned program and the requirements look exactly like Unifieds except there is a choreographed dance part which I don’t recall if Unifieds have that. The dance is the part I worry least about with her, she’s very good, can pick up those combinations on the spot. </p>

<p>But it looks like I will be joining the OMG what should she sing discussions about Unifieds. </p>

<p>Her drama teacher will be working with her monologues for TETA, and probably she doesn’t need two cooks on one pot of soup so I guess that unless she is doing something that even I can tell is wrong, I’ll have to leave that one up to her and her teacher.</p>

<p>Everyone that I have talked to who has gone to SFA or lived in Nacogdoches has nothing but nice things to say about it so I’m feeling really good about it being a safety.</p>

<p>Of course when I see thread about people choosing between Tisch and Carnegie and schools in that tier I feel kind of bad but we can only do what we can do for her. I figure she can pick out a few schools that look like a good fit and go to Unifieds with the idea that this IS a long shot for her, and not to be dissappointed, but to just do her best, enjoy the experience, and if something amazing happens, then it does, but not to be crushed if it doesn’t.</p>

<p>Hang in there snapdragonfly! One other spreadsheet I found helpful early on had all of the schools under consideration on it with all the application deadlines. Things like scholarship deadlines and audition deadlines in addition to regular school application deadlines. Helped us a lot…</p>

<p>Snapdragonfly- It’s not in Texas but Indiana University has the most astounding costume shop. One can get an MFA in Costume Design there. When I was there, non majors could be hired to work there by the hour, which for me was a great time of picking up costuming lessons from the best in the business without actually taking a class. So a good question to ask might be, does the costume shop at the schools on your list hire students?</p>

<p>classicalbk, that is a good question. We shall be asking the schools here that one - thanks for the tip!</p>

<p>I wish that out of state tuition did not make most state schools prohibitive (barring an almost full ride scholarship which I’m not counting on) because some of the state schools in other states have some really really nice programs. <em>sigh</em> One thing I am thinking is possibly, if she stayed here and went to her safety, she could pretty much get out with zero loans - then she could go on and get her masters elsewhere and Texas has a better tuition reciprocity agreement for graduate schools, and I would not object so much to some loans for a graduate degree. (for obvious reasons, I have severe misgivings of the wisdom of loans taken out for undergrad degree in liberal arts for a child from a family who could not help her with those debts :-/ )</p>

<p>edit to add: hey, do they pay good? :slight_smile: I might move to Indiana and work for them - I’m an extremely advanced seamstress myself and have costumed as a volunteer for the past 7 community theater productions here (that might be where she gets it from) Costuming is FUN.</p>

<p>You might consider checking out the North Texas Drama Auditions. They are held in mid November. Many schools within Texas and also out-of-state are present. Your daughter’s drama teacher will need to be involved in the registration if you are interested as each school is limited in the number of students they can send. Hope everything goes smoothly for you all!</p>

<p>I just talked to someone at TSU and he mentioned the NTDA’s. So! We do need to check those out.</p>

<p>Her drama teacher may or may not know those exist. She is taking her to TETA but she had not heard of Unifieds until I asked her about it yesterday. Neither had I until I found this board, but I am not a drama teacher. She has not been one for very long and as I may have mentioned our drama department is very much in the building itself up state - her teacher is very very dedicated but to be honest is still learning the ropes in a lot of ways so we have to be a bit tactful about some things and cannot just assume that someone will tell us something we don’t know but should have known. If that makes sense.</p>

<p>So I need to find out about those…the website doesn’t offer very much in depth information.</p>

<p>There is West Texas A&M in Canyon. They have a very good Musical Theater program. My d is a junior. I think of it being a bit of a hidden gem. As with all programs, it may not have everything you want…but it is what YOU make of the time and experience. Good luck!</p>

<p>We are aware of Canyon, my stepfather is an adjunct professor there. :-)</p>

<p>Too close to living at home for d to be her first choice. But, it’s probably a very good safety, (financial safety I mean) and if for some reason the situation warranted it she could live with my mom. I am putting it on my spreadsheet. The only school I am not going to put on it is actually UT-El Paso, due to personal, subjective reasons having to do with growing up close to it and not really liking where I grew up, which are probably silly. But, it is what it is. D is not fond of that area herself - she will reconcile herself to living in small east or panhandle Texas towns instead of the glamourous Austin or NYC but if she has a choice she would rather stay out of that part of the country. Though we are not refusing to examine anything if it’s worth a look.</p>

<p>One thing we have always thought would be fun would be for her to do Neil Hess’s “Texas” some summer. WTAM’s dance program is also strong from what I understand.</p>