<p>One can find a fair amount of information about Point Park, good and not so good, on College Confidential, but there also tends to be plenty of confusing and inconsistent information. I plan to address this topic directly with performing arts faculty/staff at PPU, but it never hurts to get input from CC parents and students. My concern is very specific to the audition required to "advance" from BA Acting (where everyone starts) to BFA Acting. When is the first opportunity to have that audition (believe it or not I have heard different answers to that question even from current students)? Approximately, what percentage of Acting students even audition for the BFA? And, finally, of the number that do audition, what percentage are approved for the BFA program? Thanks to all who reply!</p>
<p>Whatever they tell you, get it in writing!</p>
<p>Interestingly (but not surprisingly), we have heard two different answers on the when you audition from BA to BFA. In December in Atlanta, we were told end of freshman year. Then, at PPU two weeks ago, the answer was during sophomore year. I do love the school for my D, but I see the vague and conflicting answers that are being given to performance kids.</p>
<p>On their own website it says the auditions occur second semester sophomore year, meaning a student who desires a BFA runs the genuine risk of having invested, financially and emotionally, almost two years in the program, only to be prevented from earning that degree.</p>
<p>That sounds an awful lot like Emerson, OddDad. In Emerson’s case, they “reassign” people the second semester of sophomore year, if need be. And they, too, have invested a lot by then. Emerson will let them go to another major but if they want MT or whatever, they need to change mid-stream.</p>
<p>Marbleheader, it may be a distinction without a difference, but at Emerson, you, at least, enter as a freshman on that BFA track.</p>
<p>It is a major concern to me. For both schools…</p>
<p>Yes I agree there is conflicting information about this. But as Ugadog99 says, I asked specifically about this in Atlanta at a regional audition - the director of recruiting said auditions occur at end of freshman year (at a jury). He indicated most freshmen go into the BFA track and that the ones who do not probably would not progress in any program. For what it’s worth.</p>
<p>That is exactly what he told me in Atlanta as well…but it is directly contradicted with the other materials I have read. Sigh.</p>
<p>My S is seeking a BFA in MT and not Acting, but it seems to me that even the schools who will publicly say they do not have “cut system” – actually do. Comprehensive juries at the end of each year (or each semester) of BFA study can result in a study being re-directed to another major. The way I see it, PPU’s version is a reverse cut system. I do believe they offer great training and have a great artistic reputation.</p>
<p>Juries at the end are different from cuts. And it is tough to commit to a program knowing that not all will be able to go for a BFA, especially if you have no interest in a BA…</p>
<p>To all, thanks for your comments. I plan to call the director of recruiting to discuss the issue. Photomom5, what other materials are you referring to that contain contradictory information, other than the website, of course? On the plus side, the conservatory itself seems to offer superb training.</p>
<p>I recall receiving the curriculum while at auditions, I think they were on blue paper and it seemed that the first two years were a BA program and then the kids auditioned. I just remember my warning bells went off but of course, I cannot find these sheets to save my life! We have a short time to make a decision and I am kicking myself for not putting them right into the folder…</p>
<p>I know I sound like a broken record with PPU, but I seriously LOVE this program! Now, I know my D is tech and not performance, so for her there is no BA to BFA track. That fact may have some influence on how I feel about the conservatory. However, having seen two shows at PPU, I can tell you that I am just in awe of their talent, both on the stage and in their tech work! It is just that good! Their technical work is just mind-blowingly good! :)</p>
<p>To me the underlying question is, will they value and nourish a student’s artistic ambition. Will a student feel free to experiment, fail, try again? Or will a hypercompetitive atmosphere squelch that freedom? That puts a place like Emerson, where they cut to a certain number every year, out of the running. But a BA->BFA could work well if there’s a sense that the faculty really care about the students, and are committed to helping them grow as artists. After all they did accept these students into the program already.</p>
<p>So the question to me is-- what does the tone feel like to you? If you call today and your questions are answered fully and openly, you’ll get a deeper sense of the place and how much trust you can put in them. BFA programs have a natural attrition–kids find they don’t want to do so much work, or they’re not comfortable in situation where they’re drawing on their own feelings all the time. They didn’t know what they were getting into and they get out (sometimes with a gentle push from the department). A BA to BFA gets around that problem, which might be good for all concerned. But if it makes a chill in the atmosphere, it’s counterproductive. I’m hoping you’ll hear a lot in the voice of whoever you talk to today, OddDad.</p>
<p>And UGAdog-- for tech it sounds like slam dunk!</p>
<p>Ok - I’m not trying to be oppositional, I’m really not. As a college professor, I am trying to understand a point of common academic practice in selective degree programs. Everyone admitted to such a program would be expected to meet the ongoing standards and requirements. Failure to do so would result in a change of program (at a minimum). I do understand this is very different from a CUT SYSTEM, with a pre-determined quota of people who will remain after a specified period of time. In that scenario, it does not matter what your work ethic, talent level, etc. - a certain number WILL BE cut. It seems to me that with PPU, we are talking about something entirely different. EVERYONE goes into this program with the expectation on the part of the faculty that they will move into the BFA program. From what I was told, EVERYONE receives the same training and preparation for the audition, and MOST move into the BFA. I have to say that being in higher education, I do not see this as being substantively different from the expectation any reputable program would have. Just because one is admitted to a BFA program does not guarantee one remains in that program, if they cannot meet the expectations.
Again, not trying to be argumentative. I am only trying to understand the anxiety I sense about such an expectation. This is only the reverse of what most schools do (whether they fully disclose it or not). It certainly seems an appropriate question to ask what percentage of the last class did not go into the BFA program, with that percentage adjusted for natural attrition that will occur. I would also submit however, that this is a question that needs to be asked of ANY program - what percentage remain in the BFA program after the first one or two years. And yes, PPU training is outstanding.</p>
<p>mcpcwhite—yours is a great post! This is a topic that has been discussed and debated on several occasions on CC. Your comments help to explain how truly confusing this matter is, to both parents and students. I have even received different perspectives from students currently at PPU. In fact, I have a feeling I’m likely to receive contrasting information from PPU faculty. I’ll soon find out. And, that is why there is anxiety attached to this issue. Are there very specific and consistent criteria attached to the decision to enable a student to move on to the BFA program at PPU? Is it enough that the student has performed well, satisfying all necessary requirements, and is eager to continue on the BFA track? Or might he/she be torpedoed by one or more faculty members who simply aren’t quite convinced?</p>
<p>I agree, PPU isn’t a cut program, not even close to it. However, I do not yet have any evidence that the faculty expects each student to move into the BFA program. Who told you this was the case? That would certainly make my D feel much better. She really likes the acting program at PPU. But, she also wants the BFA, and the BFA only. Of course, she understands that she must continually measure up to certain standards. I have no doubt she will work extremely hard. She knows there are no guarantees.</p>
<p>I look forward to further discussion on this thread, and I’m eager to talk with a few PPU officials. Thanks again for your perspective!</p>
<p>Having been accepted to PPU, this issue is weighing heavily on me. I’m impressed with the program and everything I’ve read about their actor training. But I’m determined to graduate college with a BFA, so the second audition for the BFA track makes me uncomfortable. If it’s a matter of giving your all, and constantly pushing yourself to do better work each day, I know I can do it. But if it’s about measuring up to your classmates, or showing the PPU faculty something specific that they’re looking for? I don’t know how that makes me feel. What if you have one bad day? One bad performance? Are you out of the running for a BFA? I know I can work hard and stay determined, but I don’t know if that’s all they’re looking for.</p>
<p>Eve, you express the concerns you naturally have about this process really well. I would doubt that having one bad day would nix the BFA for someone - but you are right that little blips (whether in performance, or interpersonal fit, or whatever) could mean the difference between achieving your dream or not. That is scary, and also frustrating.</p>
<p>In many ways, I’ve thought, as mcpc says, that a BA-BFA route sounds very logical. Even the most certain of HS seniors might find when they get to college that they’ve changed their mind, and maybe they want more options - BA, BFA, double major, whatever - and this gives them a year to breathe. Ideally, they will get the BFA if that is what they want most. In one way, it’s a win-win situation.</p>
<p>But in another, it seems like a risk, as several of you have described. Here’s a different example: I know several students who want to pursue nursing degrees. Getting into a nursing program is similar to the auditioned BFA process - some schools will accept you 100% into nursing, some with the condition that you meet certain requirements (including grades, ECs, personal qualities, etc.) during the first year or two. One boy I know chose the school that guaranteed he’d be a nurse - he didn’t want the pressure. Another went to a school that decides later - and due to a few blips, he didn’t make it, even though he works hard and it’s all he’s ever wanted. He has had to transfer to another school, which isn’t the end of the world, but definitely is a hassle, with extra cost, etc., and the ego hit seems unfair, especially since the second school is very happy to let him become a nurse. A third example is a girl who chose a BS-BSN route very deliberately - she’s working her butt off to make it into nursing, and probably will. But she enjoyed the opportunity to take a year and find out what she really wants, and she enjoyed the challenge, too.</p>
<p>I think as a parent I would advise a student who has a BFA acceptance that they really love, and can afford, to go with that over the BA-BFA route. BA-BFA is great for someone who otherwise has no BFA options, or who really is excited about the idea of several different pathways. We’ve heard many stories here about kids who went to schools that offered both degrees, and how surprised some people were that they did decide to stay with the BA, or switch from one to the other at some other point. </p>
<p>When my D was deciding, she did have a strong pull to certain BA programs. she ended up not having a BA-BFA option (she’d considered several schools with them, but didn’t apply, for reasons of fit, not the degree question). Because she had to choose between them before going to college, she finally decided that ultimately the most important factor was that she wanted a BFA, or at least wanted to be in a BFA program that first year. She was more willing to take the chance that she might transfer out of a BFA to a BA than to try it the other way around. I wonder if she’d had a really great BA-BFA school whether she might have felt that gave her a year to see how she felt - considering how much she was willing to consider a BA. Although now after the fact I think she would have gone for the BFA there, too, she didn’t know that 100% during her decision phase. She did have a gut feeling that she did want the BFA, and she was grateful that she had the option at the time.</p>
<p>Using your gut is probably the best way for anyone to make this choice. I would say from what Eve is saying she feels, she should go with the BFA school(s) she is fortunate to have acceptances at (if all other factors are positive), and leave the BA-BFA options for kids where they can have more options and a more exploratory path. You would have to feel you could very happy with the idea of getting a BA - which is not at all a bad thing - to take this chance.</p>
<p>Eve, can you visit? If you can possibly spend a day on campus I think you will find that either your fears are allayed, or not. My D felt exactly as you do–didn’t apply to BA-BFA programs for that reason. I think most BA-BFAs are as mcpcwhite describes-- but most of them are at universities that offer a lot of other choices of major for those who decide a BFA isn’t for them. If you visit, take classes, meet professors, talk to other students, you will very quickly get a sense of the fit for yourself. </p>
<p>You’re a young artist, you want an atmosphere you can work well in. PPU has accepted you, now it’s your turn to evaluate them. You need to decide whether you think the experience is worth the money you’ll be paying. It’s all about fit and none of us can know that except you. There are just so many nuances you can’t know until you’re there.</p>