However, it is common (and commonly advised) for pre-meds to retake in college the courses that they could use AP credit for (rather than taking more advanced courses in the same subject area to fulfill pre-med course requirements).
But would the “Repeat” notations on the pre-med’s medical school application course list appear to application readers as obvious red flags of grade-grubbing?
With the colleges with which I am most familiar, should one choose the AP credit (and one can simply forgo the credit from the outset), but later take the corresponding course, the AP credited is forfeited.
But if there are colleges where one can get both course credit and AP credit, I see no reason why the course would not be considered a repeat.
Then would it depend on whether the college completely removes any indication of AP score from the transcript, or retains the AP score but listed as no credit after taking the similar college course (similar to what happens if a student repeats a college course)?
So a pre-med at a college that completely removes any indication of AP score after retaking the course would be able to hide the fact that s/he repeated his/her AP credit from medical schools?
I’m not seeing how this is different from a student who opts not to send in an AP score report or from a college that doesn’t grant AP credit for that subject. But then I also don’t know of an example of a college that lists AP exams on the transcript for which credit is not given.
@skieurope In my D’s college AP credits are listed in transcript. It will have ‘S’ in grade and will not include for GPA calculation. It will list the equivalent course name and number of that college.
I feel AMCAS decision to consider that as a repeat is weird. But I assume they know what they are doing and should not have a negative effect on viewing the student.
Classes that are listed on one’s transcript, but for which no credit or grade has been awarded or grade assigned are listed under Supplemental Hours. (p.4) These courses are not included in GPA calculations. AP credit is specifically listed as type of class that is recorded underSupplemental Hours–whether or not credit has been granted.
Any course a student has taken before (or received AP credit previously) is marked as a repeated class. (p. 73)
A course entry must be created (on the application) for any course that has been completed (did not receive a W or I grade). This is true regardless of whether credit for the class was awarded or not. This include ALL courses, even if they no longer appear on one’s transcript due to institutional policies.
(p.33)
My interpretation of this is that if a student originally received credit for an AP class, but later decided to retake the class and surrender the credits–the AP class must still be reported since students are required to report all classes even if they have been removed from their transcripts.
In other words, for a pre-med with AP credit that the college accepts for advanced placement in BCPM subject(s), the most desirable course selection to medical school admission readers would be to take the advanced placement, take sufficient upper level courses and labs in those BCPM subject(s), and earn A grades in them.
I.e. the opposite of the common recommendation and practice of repeating one’s AP credit (and later having to mark “Repeat” on those courses).
I think common usage is to just not use AP credit at all (and not even send AP scores to Colleges) and then just repeat the class for easy or easier A. That way there is no way it would appear as repeat on college transcript as you never claimed credit for AP.
Our (school) common recommendation is similar to @seemasp. The kids don’t even take the AP test or DE credit. They just get the info from those classes to make them better prepared for their college classes. It’s very helpful when one is trying for a 4.0.
My lad did the same thing for Calc and Bio. I had him take the Psych and Stats AP. Psych he got credit for and went on to do more minoring in the subject. However, one of his majors (BCS or Bio) also made him take a similar Stats college class not allowing the AP credit even though his college did give credit for it. I have no idea how that showed up on his application, but he made it into med school.
May be I am missing some point from the above 2 posts. If the recommendation is ‘not to use AP credit’, then to start with, why did the students take AP exam?
May be it differs in different regions (west and east). In CA, at least in top schools, it is so prevalent any student has anywhere from 5 to 12 AP taken. It is not just for MD admission, even to get in to Ivy/Top colleges for UG and also for any special programs (BS/MD or top Merit scholarship). So invariably all students who take AP, do submit the AP report to college and hence it will be in college transcript. Also it helps students (especially in CA) to satisfy pre-req so that they can do some courses earlier (for example OChem when you have done AP Chem). Otherwise in CA it is taking 5 years to complete and it costs money and it hurts many parents finance.
Agree, college even if they give credit with some course, Pre-req or any specific program may have a different course number. My D got AP Stat credit but Pre-req had different stat course and hence have to take that. AP credit will come as grade S and the other had actual grade and is used for GPA calculation by school and AMCAS.
The students take the AP exam to show proficiency on their UG apps. In no way did my daughter’s AP classes mirror the class at her top LAC. She needed the college class to build the foundation for upper division classes, then onto med school classes. In addition, her LAC didn’t grant credit for AP or IB classes, so there was no financial incentive.
To great extent it depends on student objective and capability and progression through high school…
In One scenario, Student takes AP classes to get exposure and can also take AP exams if trying for top colleges that needs them. You get into top colleges and you have 5s in APs then you use APs, need not repeat the courses and should go for advanced courses. After all then you are academic champion striving for the best…
However during high school you find out that you get 3 and 4 in AP and only 1400s in SATs, then you have to accept that you are not academic topper (but above average) and then you aim for state schools. In that case AP results need not be sent to all colleges that you are trying for as those schools will probably admit you without AP scores.
Also in some schools, you get a choice about whether to claim AP credit or not and student can opt for not claiming credits (in case they sent AP scores to them).
Cleanest is to have proper target school in mind and accordingly take AP and use it or not take AP and just use the knowledge gained…
Could be that the college considered AP statistics to be equivalent to a lower level statistics course, but not equivalent to the one required for that major, so it would technically not be a repeat.
^^That is exactly what happened with @Creekland 's son. D2 graduated from the same undergrad. The university does not award graduation credit toward major requirements for AP scores in bio, chem, physics B or stats for physical/biological science majors and engineering majors as a matter of policy.
The stats class required for BCMP majors is MTH 211 (Applied Statistics for Biological and Physical Sciences I) or MTH 212 (Biostatistics).
AP stats gives credit for MTH 203 (Introduction to Statistics).
MTH 211 and 212 require one or more semesters of calculus as a pre-req. Math 203 does not.
@WayOutWestMom (& @ucbalumnus ) Interesting the way the U does it because my lad told me there was absolutely nothing new he learned in their stats class that he hadn’t learned from his AP version. He was rather annoyed at the waste of time. With Bio and Calc that he did at the AP level even though he didn’t take the tests he said the U’s classes were more in depth - more difficult problems, etc.
@GoldenRock Kids at our school do not often have oodles of AP. They may have a couple, they may have DE, or they may just have regular classes. If we know they are heading into a math heavy major like Engineering we often tell them to repeat Calc and/or Physics so it’s not worth it to take the test in those cases. If they are heading Pre-med it’s turned out to be far better for them to skip AP tests and just have the knowledge from the courses for Chem, Bio, and Calc. The transition to college coupled with the need for a high GPA just has it work out better that way even if a few might be bored with the repeat. It hasn’t seemed to hurt admissions or merit scholarships at all. We don’t have many going to tippy top schools though a few head to U Penn or Cornell. More head to places like Franklin & Marshall, Pitt, or Penn St.
@Creekland there is no guarantee that every AP Statistics class at every high school around the nation is equivalent to that class he was required to take. The class at his school was equivalent, and that’s great, but if most are not then it is a disservice to students to give credit toward the degree program. Credit is given, which can be used as elective credit, but the college wants to ensure that all students in those majors start with the same foundation. For this same reason, MIT doesn’t offer AP credit for much of anything - they want students to learn the material their way. If they want to skip classes, they have to take institutional exams. Otherwise instructors will assume that all students were exposed to certain concepts, only to discover many were not.
As for why someone might take AP exams, even with no intention of accepting the credit, there are a variety of reasons. My daughter’s school requires students to take the exam, or they don’t get AP credit on their transcript, which would impact both GPA and perceived rigor. I took AP Physics C, got a 5 on both parts of the exam, was comfortable that I understood the material covered in Physics I, but not Physics II so I opted for take Physics II for a stronger foundation even though I was offered credit for both.
Perhaps more specifically, the college can only assume that the student knows what the AP statistics exam covers. If the high school covered more material or in more depth, the college will not assume that just from the AP statistics score.
@CTScoutmom True, but in his case he looked at the syllabus and compared prior to taking the stats class when he asked if he could be exempt from it. He’d have loved the option for an institutional test to test out, but there wasn’t one.
Such is life. I don’t believe he’s emotionally scarred over it. It’s not like he had to devote much time to the class studying so he got permission to take more hours than is allowed instead and took what he wanted in addition to the class. It was just an annoyance.
I’m reading this thread with interest because I’m curious how the AP/repeat will play out - keep my mind fresh for pre-college advising for future pre-med wannabes.
Reporting the AP scores to the admissions office is not the same thing as reporting them to the registrar. We’re talking about over 13 years ago at this point, but I had to resend all my AP scores to Brown after matriculating.