Probably because most people here think of HYPSM or AWS or other highly selective and prestigious school with a luxury class student experience (due to their wealth), rather than schools like Mount St. Mary’s University (“drown the bunnies”) when they see the word “private”.
@MWolf…your post reminded me of an ah-ha moment my S20 and I shared the other day. Seems like all we talk about as a family these days involves his college selection and prep. And this knocked us off that crazy train: he is a pretty kind soul (picks up ants in the house and brings them outside). Has always said ‘yes’ when asked to help out. A fellow parent asked if he could help out for a day at a camp for disabled children this summer. His historic response would have been ‘sure.’ Instead he said to me ‘colleges will see right through that. I will pass.’ For one second I accepted that answer and then shot back ‘wait, you can’t make decisions like that based on what (fill in blank with elite college) would want you to do!’ He smacked forehead. Of course he will help out. Lesson learned, for both of us. Sorry if this sways too much from OP’s thesis.
My daughter applied to a mix of private and public schools. They were all excellent. The final decision was based on fit and affordability…private v public was not part of the equation.
@raclut When it comes to Engineering, even USANews accepts that public colleges match and exceed private colleges. Of the engineering schools that THEY name as their T-10, 5 are public, in 5 different states. If we look at their T-25, it is obvious that over half the population of the USA live in a state which has public in-state engineering programs that are not only unquestionably top-notch, but also satisfy anybody’s need for prestige. Some states, like CA and TX, have more than one.
Yes I see the irony that I always play up public colleges, and my kid is going to a private LAC, but, again, it was all about fit and finances. It’s one of the best fits for my D, and it will cost less than any other colleges to which she applied or would have applied, and she receives other benefits, as well.
Here is a harsh reality. Most CC posters are products of public universities and majority sends children to public schools so take every discussion with a big grain of salt considering personal biases and self-defense.
Statistically, very small percentage of students get accepted at top colleges or receive enough financial aid or rare merit/athletic scholarships to make it possible for a middle class family to make it work. It’s not a real option for majority of this nation, just a hypothetical discussion.
@MWolf
“The entire ideology of those “DukeEngage” programs is actually pretty awful. I am sorry, but a bunch of wealthy American colleges student are not qualified to figure out the entire social and cultural set of issues that go into implementing these solutions. In fact, the entire idea absolutely REEKS of privilege, paternalism, and borderline racism. Seriously, what the program is saying is that “At Duke we are SO superior to you benighted peoples, that our 18 year old kids, who have never left their bubble of wealth and privilege, can solve your most difficult issues in 3 hours a week, over 13 weeks”. Gag.”
Interesting perspective. I have never heard anyone claim these programs as “racist”. My BIL is an pediatric anesthesiologist and every year he travels to places like Guatemala to provide free surgical care to patients who cannot afford such procedures. I’m wondering if you consider his work, racist?
Regarding DukeEngage, seems like a win, win. Engineering students work as a team designing and building a new bridge for an impoverished community that needs one.
@Riversider Whose harsh reality is that? I would say that statistically, those on CC have a much higher representation at privates and top schools than the general population given their smaller size. When faced with experiences and evidence counter to your narrow beliefs, you personally become extremely dismissive. Where you stand depends on where you sit.
Both my DH and I are products of well ranked private colleges. DH went on to get advanced degree from a large state school top ranked in his field and I went on to our state Ivy for my graduate degree. I went on to our state directional for more graduate courses. Maybe that is why we realize that the name on the school on the degree doesn’t mean much. Our first (and likely our second) child is at a large public flagship. This idea of self-defense and bias because people “never had it and never will” so they are just sour grapes is condescending.
The privates are not perfect and there is a lot NOT to like for certain students focused on fit. My dd toured top schools as well as other highly ranked privates. She didn’t find what she was looking for and she was not blinded by things that wouldn’t impact her success. To top that off, she did not find anything worth paying the extreme difference in costs. I loved my undergraduate experience but it didn’t provide me with anything magical or unattainable from other schools. There were certainly downsides and by my third year I had “outgrown” the small campus and community. The price difference between it and our state school was nothing like the differences today. In addition, the costs to attend vs. the average salaries were much more in line then compared to now.
For many it has hit a tipping point where people are really starting to question the “prestige surcharge” and the myth of superiority. The world is much smaller now with technology and we are all exposed to so much more. We no longer have to rely on word of mouth and others’ perceptions now that we can do our own research. While the elite schools love to keep to mystery of admissions and an air of superiority, there is much more transparency now in what schools offer.
@Riversider Your narrative doesn’t fit here either. I went to 2 private schools with an average rank of well under 10. I received an excellent education at both. But experience has taught me that not going to one of these schools isn’t going to limit how successful you are. So I never pushed them for my D. They weren’t a good fit for one. And two, since my education enabled me to to have a sufficiently high income and assets that we would get no need-based aid, I don’t see the ROI in spending $80k a year. Instead, we leveraged her academic and other talents to many fabulous full ride offers. Pretty smart if I do say so myself. 
@riversider My siblings and I all attended excellent private colleges for undergrad and grad school. (top tier) I think that is why I said I was pleasantly surprised with my daughter’s experience at a large public university. I’m from VA and we have excellent public universities. For instate residents I think it’s foolish not to consider them.
The public school system here is absolutely great. We even have TJHSST (magnet school) for the brightest students interested in STEM. I relocated to this state intentionally when my D was very small knowing that she would get an excellent education here.
So…having taken classes at both, I agree that unless you are in a flagship honors program, the feel of in-state vs private is very different.
What about the difference between in-state smaller colleges (ie St. Mary’s in MD, William & Mary, Miami of Ohio) and private? Can any of these publics - or any others you name - replicate the special attention that private universities pay to their students?
I enjoy anecdotes as much as the next person but they doesn’t change reality for the majority.
Just because some one attended an elite school but their kid can’t get accepted at one or their is not enough money to not care about the expense and financial aid is not enough, they have to pick public and defend the choice personally and with others too. It’s not a choice, it’s a compromise and can’t be called a choice.
@Riversider Again, just because you believe that to be true does not make it so. Can I afford $80k/year? Yes. Do I think it’s money well spent? No. My kid got into Harvard so it’s not a question of getting admitted. I know many in my field making 7 figures a year who agree with me. Their kids go to the best privates in the state for pre-K to 12 and then public for college. Just because you prize private colleges above all else doesn’t mean everyone thinks like you. There is a reason most flagships have a very large contingent of very wealthy kids. For some reason you aren’t willing to accept that. OK.
@itsgettingreal17 Curious about what state you reside in. After paying years of private school tuition, in-state (MD) schools are very much on the radar. However, it was tough going this year at our flagship. The private high schools tend more towards grade deflation, and as a result, fewer kids are getting in. I think the average this year at UMCP is a 4.3 or so. This is why I’m eager to learn about other in-state or out-of-state public options that do not have the ginormous classes common to flagships. Any thoughts?
“For many it has hit a tipping point where people are really starting to question the “prestige surcharge” and the myth of superiority”
It’s interesting to note that three posters who had the choice of full pay at Stanford vs full rides elsewhere, all turned down Stanford (in two of those cases for a state flagship) despite being able to afford it.
It seems to me that those folks who are most committed to defending the worth of paying a massive money differential for elite American private research U’s are actually those who didn’t attend elite American private research U’s for undergrad.
Our kid considered public all the way til the end, but ultimately chose a private option. As parents, we felt she would get more support for her specific learning style at a smaller school. Who knows what really tipped the final choice for her? Aside from money, which was doable at both, I think prestige for the last month of HS (which is the only time it really matters) played a role. Also knowing that she could enroll at private but transfer to the public if it didn’t really fit, but the other way around was highly unlikely. Other factors felt quite individual… but I think all factors feel idiosyncratic to the individual. My husband and I both attended public universities for undergrad and I think we wanted something different for her.
@socaldad2002 You have a legitimate point, but I disagree. However, since I’m sure that we could spin off an interesting 150-post discussion which would derail the thread, and still not get to any resolution, let us agree to disagree, and get back to the main discussion.
If these colleges are such a rotten deal, why alumni keep sending their children and their money?
This debate has surfaced in many forms on CC. So many protecting their turf. My guess is the answer to “best” is not based on fact and figures, but rather many human factors / variables. At the end of the day, I’m sure everyone is doing what they feel is best, based on their finances, for their kids. That’s the constant. The definition of “best”, however is defined through many lenses.
Full disclosure - we chose full pay to an elite private vs. essentially a full ride, honors to state flagship in a state where that flagship is gaining in the rankings. Rankings are rankings. Our decision was based on what we see happening at the flagship, the overall state of public education in our state, and the fit variables of our kid. He’s at a great place and doing quite well in every regard. Don’t know what would have happened had he stayed in state, but we like the result we’re getting and feel it’s worth the investment.
Had he been accepted OOS to UVA or UNC (both a rather challenging OOS admit), He might have chosen one of them and we would have been happy with that too, as we see them as major upgrades to our in state options. Interesting to note, he was admitted to W&M (OOS) and that felt more like an elite private. Just wasn’t his thing compared to where he landed.
I think it’s quite kid specific. We’ll be going through this process with our D this summer / fall and her situation is quite different (musical theater / acting BFA seeker). She’ll apply to many schools I had never heard of until immersing myself in that world. That decision will be based on where she can obtain the best training and access to position herself for a life on the stage.
Really a pointless debate as you are the only one who knows your kid, your finances, your definition of “best”, And do you really care what others think regarding that decision? Hope not!
@rickle1 I agree. There are pros and cons to both public and private universities. People need to do what is best for their child and their finances.