My kids did not have an IB program, but did take 7-9 APs, older son had an excellent GPA, less than fabulous essay, nearly perfect scores, younger son had a math score just shy of 700, but a stellar CR score and excellent subject test scores, less than perfect GPA. Older son got into safeties, Harvard and Carnegie Mellon but didn’t have any schools that were either shoe-ins or lotteries. (Even at CMU he only applied to the Computer Science School which has the lowest admissions rate.) For younger son every school with an admissions rate of 20% or better accepted him (and Chicago’s EA rate was over 20%), everyone that was under rejected him. I don’t know if Vassar would have accepted him if he had been female, though he was a good fit. We found Naviance was really quite an accurate predictor as to where he was unlikely to be accepted, he applied to some of those schools since he wasn’t far out of the green zone, but he didn’t get into any of them.</p>
<p>Our school doesn’t seem to have any acceptance data on Naviance. It tells me “insufficient data” no matter which school I try to look at (including our state U). I think maybe our school doesn’t input results into it.</p>
<p>That’s a shame, mathmomvt. Our naviance data only goes back a few years, so many scattergrams won’t display if there was only one acceptance, but there is a tab that says “acceptance history” that lists how many kids were accepted and enrolled at each school. At our HS, the students input that data for their own results in the “my colleges section”, so it is not completely accurate but gives some idea at least.</p>
<p>I was wondering if the data came from the kids’ own entries. Our school has never really encouraged or taught the kids how to use it for keeping track of their colleges, applications, acceptances, etc. so I doubt anyone ever enters that data.</p>
<p>@counting and mathmom, that eases my worries. I’ve been concerned that his list is too top-heavy and he’ll have nothing but his safety in April. He’s applied to 8 schools and all but one, to which he’s been admitted, have acceptance rates under 50%. But only one of those is less than 20%, so maybe I shouldn’t worry so much. His guidance counselor isn’t worried, and neither is S.</p>
<h1>*“I don’t think it is always reasonable to find a safety one loves …”</h1>
<p>Why have them to apply to schools they don’t care for? *</p>
<p>Because all students aren’t the same. Those with good stats and who are well-funded can hold out for the safeties that they love.</p>
<p>Most kids in the US do NOT have that luxury. Most kids have sub-merit stats and financial limitations. Those kids may only have their local public or CC as a safety…whether they like it or not.</p>
<p>For the child who does not have the means (stats wise or funding) to go away to school, what do you suggest that they do if they don’t like their local state school? Do you think that they shouldn’t go to college at all?</p>
<p>^I’d suggest they look closely at the list of private schools that offer merit aid. My younger son (not a perfect student by any means) got merit aid at American that would have made the cost of attendance less than our state universities.</p>
<p>Kids I know did the following: My nephew took a full athletic scholarship at a school where his academics are FAR above the mean of the student body. The school has an excellent placement of transfers to D-I programs with athletic scholarships. Has two offers to play semi-pro this coming summer. One niece joined the National Guard nine days after graduation, spent what would have been her freshman year doing Basis Training and AIT, and now is in the Corps of Cadets at a state college – will graduate with her bachelor’s degree and an officer’s commission. Was honor graduate from summer training, a finalist for freshman of the semester, and has developed an incredible work ethic from her time in the military (not that she didn’t have one already). Another niece already has a full tuition ride at her flagship and will live in her late grandmother’s townhouse in the college town along with a couple of friends who will pay rent.</p>
<p>Three kids, no parental contributions being made, family incomes all under $50k, all going to college and living away from home. It’s my kids who are the aberration.</p>
<p>*For the child who does not have the means (stats wise or funding) to go away to school, what do you suggest that they do if they don’t like their local state school? Do you think that they shouldn’t go to college at all? *</p>
<p>========</p>
<p>*I’d suggest they look closely at the list of private schools that offer merit aid. My younger son (not a perfect student by any means) got merit aid at American that would have made the cost of attendance less than our state universities. *</p>
<p>I was talking about students who don’t have the stats for significant merit. A student with an ACT 24 and a 3.0 GPA isn’t going to get enough merit from a school like American to make it cost less than going to a state school.</p>
<p>And, again, the point wasn’t just to make it cost less than going away to a state school…which can still be unaffordable to many…often costing $18k - 25k+ per year.</p>
<p>Many families can’t contribute much or ANYTHING towards college, so the modest stats students have to go to a local state school and fund it with a student loan.</p>
<p>Many average students with financial concerns do not have other choices.</p>
<p>So to clarify this for me - how do you figure out your childs true chances of schools with low percentage acceptance rates.</p>
<p>DS is applying to a few with mid-30% acceptance rates going in as an engineer. His math is above the 75%ile, the cr is on the bottom, and sometime below the 25%ile. He’s got decent grades, but he took the most rigorous coursework possible on the math/science, and got exemptions to take classes his school generally didn’t allow soph & jr kids to take. His private school just didn’t have the options of tons of AP’s like I read on here. </p>
<p>I have to hope that these more selective schools take a holistic approach and truly look at the interviews and recommendations and essays and not just his cr score. </p>
<p>When looking for safeties, we chose schools where his low score, the cr, was in the mid-range, but still offered the environment he wanted - traditional, many kids living on campus, strong engineering.</p>
<p>Statistically speaking, how do you figure out your particular childs chance of getting in?</p>
<p>Lycoming College has a Dean’s scholarship of up to $15K for an ACT of 22 or higher and a 3.0 average. Maybe with need based aid, it could work out. You also need to be in the top half of your class. I have no experience with Lycoming - hope this gives you another school to check into.</p>
<p>eyemamom, it’s guesswork. My younger son was in the top 75% for CR and bottom 25% for math at most of the schools he applied to. He got into some and rejected from others. The schools that accepted him were ones with acceptance rates in the 20% (or so) and better range, and also the ones that were the best fit. All three reaches which accepted him were ones that had applications that allowed him to show some of his creative talents as well as his academics. But every student is different. I think you just have to be a little more conservative when there are lopsided scores, or find a safety you are so happy with that you stop worrying, or get in somewhere EA so that you stop worrying. My younger son did the latter two and because of the EA acceptance and the fact that he really liked his safety, didn’t worry about the fact that he might well end up attending his safety. When he got into a reach EA, he had a little more confidence that the holistic part of holistic admissions might work in his favor.</p>
<p>mathmom - thanks for that, you made me feel a little better. We have the exact reverse situation. I know I’m anxious, and my worry won’t do anything for anyone. It’s the not knowing. And the truth is we put a lot of time in last spring analyzing choices. No one here can reassure me or promise me anything. </p>
<p>He applied to 9, with 3 of them being what I call safeties. One of the schools, which I thought was likely, which is our state flagship, got moved to a reach after I found out that last year they received 28,000 apps for 4,000 spots - that’s a 14% admit rate, which for UMD sounds crazy. But his “reaches” are not out of sight, and I see him being a good fit at them. So I thought we were 3/3/3, but we’re really now 4/2/3 - reach, likely, safety.</p>
<p>Once I can get a yes I will breathe a sigh of relief. It’s a shame ds hated pitt so much, it would have been great to have a rolling admission in our pocket.</p>
<p>I decided already I’m making my dd (class of '14) find a rolling admissions application. There are so many things I’ll do differently for dd. That poor oldest child, guinea pig, that we practice on. </p>
<p>Hubby is guessing ds will get into 7/9, I’m thinking more around 4/9. In any case at the end of the day we only need one, but two would be nice to have a choice.</p>
<p>Those on the other side of this - I envy you and look forward to look back at this time and laugh.</p>
<p>“One of the schools, which I thought was likely, which is our state flagship, got moved to a reach after I found out that last year they received 28,000 apps for 4,000 spots - that’s a 14% admit rate, which for UMD sounds crazy”</p>
<p>Actually, the admit rate would be higher than that. If the school ultimately wants a class size of 4,000, they are going to admit a lot more kids than just 4,000, because a lot of kids who are accepted won’t attend. (The “yield”. I think that UMD admitted 44% of the 26,000 applicants for fall 2010 – and that is a blend of in state and out of state – I don’t know if the in state applicants had higher acceptance rates.</p>
<p>For the extremely selective colleges, you definitely cannot rely upon median test scores. That is because they consider many more factors, and they often reject many students with near perfect scores. The admissions at those colleges are very unpredicatable, which you just have to learn to accept. </p>
<p>In comparison, some of the largest public schools ONLY consider GPA and standardized test scores.</p>
<p>UMD’s overall acceptance rate last year was in the high 30s. Getting into Engineering is tougher. We know someone with a 26 ACT, 3.16 UW, 2 APs and in-state who did not get into UMD engineering, but was accepted at Ohio State, Penn State Univ Park, Kent State, Florida and two directionals in MD (would have majored in chem at those two).</p>
<p>Nephew mentioned above had a 27 ACT/3.45 UW, 5 APs from a rural KY district and got merit $$ from Louisville.</p>
<p>Our guidance counselor told us that UMD avg accepted gpa is 4.0 and SAT’s at 1300. More and more are applying to public schools during the weakened economy, so competition is getting tougher at the state schools.</p>
<p>There are colleges out there for modest students - not necessarily better than their state college, but certainly smaller - take a look at the scholarships at the College of Saint Rose which has scholarships for ACT scores as low as 21! (SAT score 980 for CR +M!).</p>
<p>Oh, I know that there are privates that give out scholarships for lowish stats. The issue is that those schools usually still cost more than commuting to the local state school or CC. There are kids that only have their stafford loan to help them pay for college. </p>
<p>Even St. Rose requires a higher GPA than the one that I stated. And, by awarding a $5k per year scholarship, that hardly brings the cost down to a local state school. St. Rose costs $35k for tuition, room, board, books…a student would need about a $25k per year scholarship to get the cost down to a local state school. </p>
<p>And, just because there might be a free ride out there for an ACT 24/3.0, doesn’t mean that the student will like that school as a safety either. Any school that is giving free rides for an ACT 24/3.0 would likely be filled with very low stats kids. </p>
<p>And, we can’t ignore…going to a school that is quite a distance away incurs additional costs. We have one child who is several states away, and one who is instate. The difference in travel costs and assisting with move-in, etc, has been significant. </p>
<p>Again, I’m not talking about getting the cost down to a “sleep away” state school…that can cost $20k-30k per year…beyond what many families can pay. I’m saying that for many kids with modest/lowish stats (even below ACT 24/3.0), their safety may have to be their local state school or CC…whether they like it or not.</p>