<p>My D will be visiting both these schools this summer. We are OOS. Can anyone comment about how the undergrad business schools compare. She thinks she wants to major in marketing but that could change. After 4 years, do the students get national jobs ( Chicago, NYC, etc.) or stay in Indiana to work?</p>
<p>Indiana Kelley is much better and students do get national jobs. Many do not aspire to NYC, but do go to Chicago, Atlanta, Columbus, Cincinnati etc.</p>
<p>It really doesn’t mattter. Once you get below the top half dozen (ranked by prestige) business schools in the United States, an undergraduate business degree is an undergraduate business degree. What the student does after he or she gets to college is a whole lot more important than where the student goes to college - in general, but even more so for business.</p>
<p>Both have very good business schools but at least anecdotally they tend to be attractive to different employers…Purdue’s seems to have some students who switch out of engineering but still have some of the engineering mindset, and IU’s school is of course well known. The two schools have really different curricula from what I understand…maybe your daughter could check those out and see if one is more attractive to her. Students seem to either love or hate the integrated core at IU.</p>
<p>Actually it still matters very much how your undergrad B school is viewed by initial employers. Top 10 school place better than all. Top 25 better than top 50. Big Ten better than MAC, etc. Any review of placement stats will tell you that.</p>
<p>And any review of juried research will tell you just the opposite.</p>
<p>It seems to me, that major companies are recruiting at all the “big schools” these days. At least that’s what I’ve noticed at the campus job fairs and the “single company job fairs” (when one company comes in to speak, meet with, interview, prospective grads.)</p>
<p>Since both PU and IU will be OOS for your D, paying a high OOS cost may not seem worth it if you have other instate, private, or other less expensive options.</p>
<p>No such review has been done of initial job placement from undergrad B schools. The research you are alluding concerns average earnings over time well after college for any major as being tied to the school you applied or went to versus later earnings. And there are many and a growing number of exceptions-minority students, poor students. My numbers come directly from available placement reports out of undergrad B schools. This is what college students are concerned with today–not what some backword looking study indicates for all graduates 10 years ago or more. The economy today is markedly different than it was 10, 20 or 30 years ago.</p>
<p>Now here are some facts to review. Generally IU grads get better pay for similar majors. IU is also stronger in finance where the pay is often best. </p>
<p><a href=“http://www.krannert.purdue.edu/undergraduate/career/documents/2010-11_Stats.pdf[/url]”>http://www.krannert.purdue.edu/undergraduate/career/documents/2010-11_Stats.pdf</a></p>
<p><a href=“Undergraduate Career Services | Undergraduate Career Services | Indiana Kelley”>Undergraduate Career Services | Undergraduate Career Services | Indiana Kelley;
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<p>At NIU’s big spring job fair this year, there were dozens of companies - including some very large and well-known ones - seeking business graduates. And I don’t think too many people consider NIU a “top tier” school.</p>
<p>NIU has a decent AACSB B school. It is also relatively close to Chicago-a major employment center with above average pay. The median starting salary coming out was $39,000. The mean was $42.470. Compare to other data for PU and IU.</p>
<p>Check the employment numbers for any B school you consider. If they do not have them it’s a red flag.</p>
<p>Others</p>
<p><a href=“http://business.illinois.edu/bcs/_shared/pdf/EmployProfile%202010-11%20Final.pdf[/url]”>http://business.illinois.edu/bcs/_shared/pdf/EmployProfile%202010-11%20Final.pdf</a></p>
<p><a href=“http://www.bus.umich.edu/pdf/EmploymentData2011.pdf[/url]”>http://www.bus.umich.edu/pdf/EmploymentData2011.pdf</a></p>
<p>[Employment</a> Report 2011](<a href=“http://www.csom.umn.edu/publications/employmentreport/]Employment”>http://www.csom.umn.edu/publications/employmentreport/)</p>
<p>I can’t comment on Purdue since i’ve never been, but I think the placement statistics speak for themselves. </p>
<p>As far as Kelley goes though…</p>
<p>K201/X201 are unmatched at just about any other business school in the country. They are are the two Excel classes you will take as a freshman/sophomore, and they really put you ahead of the game for internships. All year, I’d hear upperclassmen talk about how they were the Excel gurus in their internship groups, and I experienced that first hand this summer. My Excel skills have really made me stand out in my summer internship, and I’m working with mostly students who go to other top 15 undergrad b-schools. </p>
<p>Other schools (Notre Dame) have tried to implement a similar sequence (they even hired a former Kelley professor to do it) and it failed miserably. Kelley has 11 full-time faculty members, 40 TA’s and 250 volunteer peer tutors all devoted to just K201. Not only can they get 250 undergraduates to volunteer 2 hours a week, but it’s extremely difficult to get one of those peer tutor spots. </p>
<p>The specific section of K201 that I was a peer tutor in last Spring had 32 students, 6 peer tutors, a TA, and the instructor. That’s a 4:1 ratio.</p>
<p>K201/X201 are just amazing classes, and they have already paid off for me in so many ways.</p>
<p>Excel classes?</p>
<p>In college?</p>
<p>May help explain:</p>
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<p><a href=“The Default Major: Skating Through B-School - The New York Times”>The Default Major: Skating Through B-School - The New York Times;
<p>And most kids will not get into an Ivy or “elite” LAC so what do they do? Also I’d love to see the employment stats in a written report like the ones I posted but you will not find one. You only hear about the success stories and not all those scrambling to get into TFA. Most of the firms that do hire them are northeast based snob-factor firms in IB or consulting that rely more on your pedigree than anything else. Does not travel well west of PA.</p>
<p>“Brand-name programs — the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, the University of Notre Dame Mendoza College of Business, and a few dozen others — are full of students pulling 70-hour weeks, if only to impress the elite finance and consulting firms they aspire to join. But get much below BusinessWeek’s top 50, and you’ll hear pervasive anxiety about student apathy, especially in “soft” fields like management and marketing, which account for the majority of business majors.”</p>
<p>Sure, if you can go to HYP, go and study whatever you want. But the fact is, at most top flagships, business students get jobs easily, and non-stem liberal art majors don’t. </p>
<p>Kelley is a top 15 undergraduate business school, so that article (and the other 10 million copy-cat articles) don’t really apply to it. The fact is, whenever alumni came back to speak, students asked what they though the most important class they took in college was. Every single time I’ve heard that question asked, the person answers with K201. </p>
<p>I took an upper level political science course this year. I enjoyed it and had to write a lot. But the courses that have made me more valuable this summer have been K201 and X201. The courses that recruiters repeatedly cite as why they recruit from Kelley are K201 and X201.</p>
<p>I’d be willing to bet that the majors in sociology or education at most lower tier schools are not working any harder than the business majors. And the B majors at Top 50 B schools work as hard as the average student at those schools or often harder. The NYT article was silly and pointless. Radford and similar schools are full of mediocre students, period. That’s why it is Radford and not Rochester.</p>
<p>Flagships like Texas, Virginia, Michigan, Indiana, Berkeley, North Carolina… are never used as examples in those articles that argue an undergraduate business education is worthless. At those schools, business majors typically have the first or second highest entering SAT scores, and are typically thought of on campus as being some of the best students.</p>
<p>To earn direct freshman admit to the Wisconsin SOB you need an ACT 33 or more and a rank in the top 1% of your grad class in HS, Regular admit as a soph requires about a 3.4-3.5 GPA in college in all classes. Certainly not the class slugs.</p>
<p>" At those schools, business majors typically have the first or second highest entering SAT scores" … and leave with the lowest improvements in critical thinking skills.</p>
<p>Grasping at straws now. We have real numbers-not studies of different populations.</p>