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Prep School Admissions
1

<p>I'm wondering what you think is most important and least important in prep schools choosing their students. Here's what I think</p>

<h1>1 Grades</h1>

<h1>2 Teacher Recs</h1>

<h1>3 Interview</h1>

<h1>4 Essays</h1>

<h1>5 EC's</h1>

<h1>6 SSAT/ISEE</h1>

<h1>'s 2,3,and4 I'm a bit unsure, however, this is what I think they look at. I put teachers recs high because they can certainly sink you in a hurry. Some may say essays should be higher, but many students can get help with this. A better way for the schools is obtain a graded essay, which they do.</h1>

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<p>Can't a graded essay reflect assistance too f its a homwrok assignment? </p>

<p>My ranking:
1. Grades
2. Teacher recs
3. Interview
4. EC's***
5. SSATs
6. Essays</p>

<p>*** EC's are hard to rank - since the school is looking for a diverse community and kids to fill out all their clubs, sports, activities, I do think they play an important role. I also don't think a child with straight A's and all of the above with little or no ECs will be as strong as a candidate that is slightly weaker on the above but is active in ecs e.g. big jock, great musician, etc.</p>

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<p>creative1, you certainly have a point.</p>

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<p>I think geography plays a role too. Schools like to have around 10% international (in general), and they like to have broad representation from different states. They also seem to like minority representation and some cultural diversity. I guess this would be around the bottom of the ranking. </p>

<p>I think SSAT scores are unimportant if they fall into the general range of accepted students. They only become an importnat factor if they are significantly above or below the range.</p>

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<p>SSAT last??? People on this site have said they haven't got in because they had low SSAT's??</p>

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<p>i'd rate them all equally the same - ssat's a little lower than the others, though, because just because a person is not extremely smart doesnt mean they can work hard to do well, and just because a person is smart does not mean they are going to do well in school.</p>

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<p>I think you def. have to put grades above SSAT scoeres. Who would you rather have - 1) a student with slightly above average intelligence who is organized, diligent and a hard worker who gets great grades or 2) an underachieving brainiac whose grades don't reflect their intelligence? </p>

<p>I think all other things being equal, most schools would take student #1.</p>

8

<p>don't understimate the importance of the parent's background and information:</p>

<ul>
<li>legacies</li>
<li>Ivy / elite college / post-grad graduates</li>
<li>Successful careers
etc.</li>
</ul>

9

<p>wow, I thought we would just go from #1 to #?. </p>

<p>We then must not forget siblings. The schools that do post the student names, it's amazing how many sibs at each of these schools. </p>

<p>I hope I'm not throwing arrows, but I have heard that G is big on Ivy legacies.</p>

<p>There's no doubt in my mind that grades are ahead of SSAT scores. But what about the other stuff?</p>

<p>Don't believe for a second that grades and high SSAT scores is the magic formula. The old threads are testament to my comment.</p>

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<p>I don't think there is a "ranking" of these things at all, personally.</p>

<p>Grades (plus rigor of courses) and test scores tell admissions whether a student can handle the work at a school. Beyond a certain threshold (each school has their own), only adds a small portion to an applicant's overall score. </p>

<p>I know that when I went to Berkeley, I heard stories from the engineering school about how many 4.0 students were turned down and how many perfect SATs (1600 in my day as they didn't have the writing test) were turned down, while several friends in the school had GPAs between 3.5 and 3.8 and test scores from 1350 to 1450 and were admitted. Clearly perfection wasn't required in academics.</p>

<p>Teacher recs serve to validate the grades and test scores, but more importantly give a feel for how the student fits into the classroom - is s/he a leader, a poser, or invisible. Is s/he high maintenance or a contributor? Need a certain level of comfort that the student will add to the flavor of the classroom without being a disruption. This is more of a pass/fail test most of the time.</p>

<p>Essay is all about a student's motivation - what makes him/her tick and where the passion is. Yes, there is a bit of intellectual measurement here for the truly high level institutions (how well can s/he communicate an idea), but more importantly it shows how self-aware the student is of where he/she is, where the student wants to go, and how s/he is going to get there. Lots of bonus points available here for the student who needs a boost from lack of academic achievement. Lots of opportunity for the pretentious to lose points.</p>

<p>Extra Curriculars and Awards - Very similar to the essay. It shows the passion of the student and committment to achieve over time. This is where a lot of students fool themselves thinking more is better. A school doesn't care if you were a member or officer in 12 different school clubs. What did you achieve from those clubs? Did the chess club go to a big tournament. Did your ranking improve? </p>

<p>Quality and committment are what count in extra curriculars. You do need a certain number of items to show that you are not a total recluse (a big turnoff to schools). That is a minimum requirement. But being a member of 6 clubs at school is no better than being a member of 2 clubs, if membership is all that you achieve.</p>

<p>A multi-year, 6 hour or more per week activity is probably a requirement to get into any of the top schools, whether it be a sport, music, church, or volunteer activity. Some sort of achievement or recognition related to that activity is a good validation of that activity. It shows a passion for something and confirms that a student is driven to achieve over time.</p>

<p>A bunch of 2 or 3 hour a week activities generally is regarded as having a schedule well managed by the parents. They are busy and well rounded, but no passion points are awarded for being highly-motivated.</p>

<p>The Interview - Mostly a tool to validate the passion and drive as exhibited in the extracurriculars and essay. Lots of trap doors to fall through. Also a tool to see where the school lands on an applicant's list. For a candidate who looks generic enough to go to a lot of different schools, this is the opportunity to show committment to that particular school. I'd say this is mostly a pass/fail test.</p>

<p>Money - Yes, I brought up that dirty word! And yes, not needing FA does help, despite the "need blind" claims of some schools. If you meet a certain threshold (some places higher than others) passing all the pass/fail tests, and you are full paying (and even better legacy who have donated money), you are in. All schools need full-pay students. Some need more than others, hence different thresholds at different schools. </p>

<p>The good news is that this is a relatively small percentage of overall applicants who get in this way at most of the competitive schools, because they are usually well endowed and are willing to spend the money for better candidates.</p>

<p>I don't think they look at ranking in these areas. I think they look at minimum scores in each area, then at the number of bonus points beyond the minimum collected from all of the areas to determine admission.</p>

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<p>Wow goaliedad! Very thoughtful and well done! I think you hit it on the head.</p>

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<p>I agree. Good job! Very informative.</p>

13

<p>GoalieDad ... That was a great answer.</p>

<p>I would rate SSATs a little bit higher on a list because it is one of the few common indicators that ALL students go through. Grades, Teacher Recs from example are in a way subjective to the school the student is in. I know some students are better test takers than others but still I would consider the SSAT a little higher.</p>

<p>Anyway, students that are accepted at boarding schools are accepted because they have something to add to the school's community. He/she can have average SSAT, grades ... and out-of-this-world ECs; or great SSATs, average interview, essay and great at ice hockey ... etc. Whatever makes a student to really stand out will improve the students chances to be accepted in that school. </p>

<p>These indicators are important, of course, but I think the order of importance changes on a "candidate by candidate" basis.</p>

14

<p>NewD</p>

<p>A very high SSAT score will give a quick thumbs up as to whether the student is of the right level bookwise. It his difficult to "study for the test", score highly, and hide complete incompetence. So yes, SSAT can be a higher influence for most students.</p>

<p>However, there are a significant number of great students who for whatever reason do not test out as well on the standardized test. Call it a bad day at the test (sick, etc), call it poor preparation, call it whatever. So grades and teacher recs can substitute for OK test scores, if both are excellent and the school has a good history of academic rigor. </p>

<p>"great at ice hockey" - c'mon, are you saying my daughter got into her school because she could stop a puck? <grin></grin></p>

<p>Yes, there are always a number of slots at a school reserved because of needs for certain programs - Ice Hockey being one of them. However, I would guess that those "reserved" slots make up less than 10% of the slots available. Plus, those "hockey players" and other exception students still have to meet that certain threshold for Grades/SSAT or it is still a no-go. No use in having your goalie flunk out first term and have a hole in the hockey team second term.</p>

<p>Of course having another targeted characteristic (like being a URM or adding geographic diversity) also helps applicants.</p>

<p>And even once you separate out the "reserved" slots and international ("full pay") allocations at a school, schools still want a balance of backgrounds to meet their offerings. Too many musicians, or dancers, or even athletes can disrupt program offerings, so the "candidate by candidate" evaluation still becomes important. </p>

<p>Being an applicant who helps fill in an area of shortage or improves the average level of a program can be a tremendous advantage in an application. Conversely, being an applicant in the strengths of a school where there is an abundance of talent can be a big disadvantage in applying. </p>

<p>I've noticed that with many Exeter applicants being drawn there because of certain math program offerings, it can heighten the competition for those math skilled applicants. So if they want a more "balanced" student body, the number of "highly math skilled" applicants is limited, raising the bar for admittance based upon math skills.</p>

<p>I pick on Exeter because it is frequently called out for this program. The same can be said for programs at several of the highly selective schools. I don't mean to throw a monkey wrench in people's application process, but to give them something to consider when selecting several schools to apply to, including safeties.</p>

15

<p>OK, so I have impeccable SSAT score's, but my recommendations reveal that I'm a bit lazy and maybe I'm not a team player. Or say I have those great scores and at my interview, I come across as some arrogant As.......... Those SSAT scores will get you no where in my opinion. Therefore, I say SSAT score's may be the least important. Hey, we can all agree that SAT scores are not a predictor of success in college. Stanford, Harvard, take flyers on very low score SAT and they graduate just like the rest. Ok, am I crazy? I recently read in the Princeton review book for SSAT/ISEE review, that you can get 42 out of 60 correct on the verbal as an 8th grader and score I believe it was a 92. Now before someone like suze calls me on these numbers, I may not be exact, but I'm very close.</p>

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<p>That's what I saw in the book, too.</p>

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<p>Exactly!</p>

<p>Even if you are perfect academically (4.0 unweighted, already got the 2400 SAT score in 8th grade - nevermind the SSAT), you too can be denied admissions at any prep school if you don't score enough points in all the other areas.</p>

<p>Perhaps students still think that if I ace the #1 priority and the #2 priority, I will get in to my dream school.</p>

<p>Fuggitaboutit!</p>

<p>Don't worry about the priorities of the school. Worry about your priorities in life! What do you want to be as a person? How do I develop my skills to get there? And the rest will fall into place.</p>

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<p>I hope we have not forgotten that we are dealing with kids that just started the 8th grade who are closer to 7th graders than 9th graders. Approximately 50% of prep students come from public schools, and 85% of those public schools are probably lucky to have the more basic curriculum, rigor of course work may be somewhat moot. Here in Texas, the public school curriculum is spent on teaching students how to pass a test, the TAKS test. What rigor is that! imo, it's not even an education. For this reason, I have never had my children in public schools. back to the rigor, maybe this is better suited for the college crowd.</p>

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<p>I can see why you put the SSAT at the bottom of the ranking list in your #1 post on this topic, prepparent. And I understand your frustration with students being trained to take a test. Life is not made up of annual standardized tests with right and wrong answers.</p>

<p>Life is a set of integrated puzzles which we dive into every day. We try to deconstruct the situation, properly identify the principles to apply, test our theory, observe the results, learn, and move onto a new part of the puzzle tomorrow.</p>

<p>Whether it is making a new friend, getting a job, helping our children, or adressing a world issue, the principles are the same. But somehow our education system has misconstrued the meaning of this by defining the puzzle students have to solve, eliminating the wonder of learning, eliminating the opportunity for a child to reach into the days box of puzzles and pick out what s/he wants to solve. No wonder public school is no fun.</p>

<p>Children no longer take a problem, learn how to communicate what that problem is, identify the principles behind it, make guesses of how to solve that problem, test their theory and observe and learn from the results. </p>

<p>They now memorize facts and formulas and how to use tools they do not understand the principles behind to come up with an arbitrary answer that has no meaning to them other than whether they got the right answer on the test and can move onto the next level.</p>

<p>We teach our children what to think, not how to think. We make them fear wrong answers instead of learning from unexpected results.</p>

<p>Students worry if they have the right answers on the SSAT test and enough ECs on prep school application and don't understand what makes them capable of thriving in the prep school environment.</p>

<p>When I talk about academic rigor, it is not measured by what facts are learned, but by how a student can apply the principles of the subject beyond the narrow cases of the textbook, how principles can be used to organize and understand, and solve the problems of the world around us.</p>

<p>Prepparent, I understand why you have never had you children in public schools. I know that they have provided poor service to my children over the years. I now struggle with financing one with generous FA through prep school and have another who needs even more help that we cannot find, much less afford.</p>

<p>I feel blessed that my daughter in prep school now has a better educational opportunity because she played a sport where the basic principles are taught, but the players must analyze the game situation, figure out which principles apply, test the theory, observe the results and learn from the experience for the next shift on the ice. Little does she realize that she knows how to learn and that process can be applied anywhere. If she comes away from her year at prep school understanding this, she is half way there.</p>

<p>Ok, time for me to get off my soap box. Sorry to stray so much off topic.</p>

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<p>"Here in Texas, the public school curriculum is spent on teaching students how to pass a test, the TAKS test. "</p>

<p>Yup...we have our fearless leader to thank for that.:(</p>

<p>Myself...I was always an Ann Richard fan...may she rest in peace.</p>