<p>I don’t think there’s a hard and fast rule about homework. I loved my son’s BC Calc teacher who gave out suggested homework problems, but said it was up to each student to decide how many they needed to do to feel comfortable that they had mastered the material.</p>
<p>OTOH I think you can get a 5 on APUSH without writing a research paper - which nearly any good college class would have you do. I’m perfectly fine with there being additional projects and papers - the AP is not really an adequate test of whether you’ve mastered the kind of work that ought to be done in a history class.</p>
<p>I am against mindnumbing stupid homeworksuch as overlong problem sets, dumb group projects, and art projects in English and history class.</p>
<p>which is why I’m glad we don’t have many AP classes and why taking the AP tests without the class bothers me. My kids wrote and wrote and wrote for their APUSH class - no mind numbing homework. My middle son was not a great writer but really came together because of all the writing required in his APUSH class and much one-on-one with the teacher…maybe it was just the teacher and not the “AP designation?”</p>
<p>I’ll put in a plug for the opposite situation. My daughter worked like crazy in AP Gov/politics. She wrote multiple papers and did a ton of research. Exams were challenging and she learned a LOT about government and politics. With a LOT of work… a LOT…she got a B+. She got a 3 on the AP exam.</p>
<p>Doing homework every day for every single class and getting it correctly (correct answers for problems) is the only way I know to get straight "A"s. I told that to my D when she was 5 years old and got her first tiny homework in kindergarden and did not understand why she needed to complete it. It has worked like a charm for her, she is junior pre-med with two minors and very busy with job, volunteering, sorority board, and still GPA=4.0.</p>
<p>^^^ It depends on the subject and the person . I’ve been taking AP physics/math classes since sophomore year, and homework is always optional in them.</p>
<p>I never even looked at them haha, managed to get the highest in AP Calc, AP Phys, top 3 in AP Calc BC, Phys C.</p>
<p>I think classes where homework is important are classes where concepts aren’t as important. Subjects like Spanish or maybe bio, which are based off memorization, are when homework is very important.</p>
<p>^I do not think this approach will work in college. It bits me how you can get an "A’ without turning in assignmnents. Well, you can continue using your approach, if it has been working for you. I hope that my D will continue using hers, other will not work for her, but assume she knows it by now being junior in college. Yes, some classes are easier than others. Yes, she rarely did her Spanish or math HS homework actually at home, since those were her easy classes that took few minutes, but she did complete them every day. I would not say the same about Bio, continues to be the hardest one, even more so than Orgo. But it is not the point. The point is the harder the class, the more time you need to spend if the goal is an “A” and completing homework in easy class is still important.</p>
<p>"Doing homework every day for every single class and getting it correctly (correct answers for problems) is the only way I know to get straight “A"s.” says MiamiDAP.</p>
<p>That is true for the vast majority of public schools. It’s also why I didn’t not require my kids to get straight As at any point. I tried to raise them to think for themselves, solve problems creatively, and question any and all authorities. I expected them to cite sources and reasons for their opinions, and to argue well. A consequence of that was that, quite often, they did not get the “correct” answers.</p>
<p>Totally agree with you dmd. My S with 3.9+ weighted GPA, 33 ACT and 36+ credits entering college had a few classes where his AP score was a 5 and the HS teacher gave him a C+. My S was not a slacker, just didn’t like busy work because he had so many other positive things he was involved with to spend his precious time on. He also liked to ask the hard questions instead of giving the rote answer. I think it is great that you switched your kid to a more appropriate school. In retrospect I would have done the same. And, yes, these kids will not be working in traditional IT departments or the like. They will be starting their own businesses, etc. (Must run in th family-Everyone mine has always been self-employed as lawyers, doctors and consultants.)</p>
<p>researchmaven…thanks for that post. glad your kids are doing well.</p>
<p>miamidap…yes, some classes may be harder but some kids have the ability to understand the concepts more quickly and thoroughly. they are ready to move on. it often has nothing to do with whether or not they did the homework. they “get it” the first time around…the concept doesn’t have to repeated, repeated, and repeated again via the homework in order for them to learn the material.</p>
<p>Unless it’s language classes, college assignments are usually given out one week (or more) in advance; this allows students to budget their time if they wish to (there are those who like to cram at the last minute). There is little busy work, in my experience. The profs and their TFs do not care to grade 40 p-sets, 30 of which are repeat of the other 10. If a student feels that s/he has not mastered the material, it is up to that student to do more practice (ungraded).</p>
<p>In high school, teachers assign tons of busy work and often a day or two in advance. They also are big on “presentation” rather than substance and on doing things in the one and only way they know. Being a teacher pleaser in high school will only take a student so far in college.</p>
<p>marite, I think doing homework in college depends on the school. In large universities with large lectures it probably won’t matter. But D just graduated from an LAC, with small classes, and if you didn’t do the reading, etc., it certainly showed and affected your grade, because it was the basis for class discussion, etc.</p>
<p>dmd77,
"Doing homework every day for every single class and getting it correctly (correct answers for problems) is the only way I know to get straight “A"s.” says MiamiDAP.</p>
<p>That is true for the vast majority of public schools"</p>
<p>D. went to very small Private HS that has always sent 100% to 4 years colleges. she graduated #1 in her class. She knows that in order to be aceepted to Med.School, she needs to have her GPA as close as possible to 4.0, that point is not debatable. However, to indulge in creativity and other interests outside of academics that are reguirements for Med. School, she has 2 minors with one of them is Music Composition, she volunteers that is connected to her other interest in Psychology (another minor in Neuroscience). I, like you, never have asked for all "A’, but I have pointed out to D when she was 5, that all homework have to be done before she can go on to her swim practices, music and art lessons and so forth. I mentioned to her also, that doing homework will insure straight A’s. I also said that this is one is the only responsibility that she has, the other things in her life she is doing by her own choice. She ended up responsible multi-talented person, that i hope she continue to be. But there is no guarantee in anybody’s future, we can only try our best.</p>
<p>Nowhere did I say that there is no homework in college. I said:</p>
<p>
Some students do the readings and some don’t. Some go to sections prepared and some bs. their way through section. My college roommate pulled an all-nighter, wrote a 30-page paper (for which she had done the research earlier) and got an A. I, being the anxious type would start my paper way earlier. The point is that in college, assignments are handed much earlier than in high school, which allows students to budget their time accordingly. Also, they have more flexibility in the courses they take. It would be suicidal for a student to have 4 weekly p-sets, all due on the same day, so students mix and match courses. This is much less likely in high school.</p>
<p>MiamiDAP: every child is different; every parent is different. If I had insisted to my children that they do all their work perfectly (which is what you are asking), we would have ended up killing each other. We can certainly agree to disagree on this, since you have different children. (My son and daughter were both highly ranked (but not number 1) at private schools that sent 100% of their graduates to college. They also attended public schools from time to time. Both graduated from excellent private colleges, my son from MIT (after 7 semesters), and my daughter from Reed.) </p>
<p>However, medical schools have a variety of criteria that they use for admission, and college grades are only part of that. Good luck to your daughter.</p>
<p>Marite, it could be a difference between girl and boy. I have one of each, and from my experience what boy considers to be done, will not be considered by a girl to be done. Girls seem to be having much higher standards. But it also could be my experience with my children.</p>
<p>Nope. Nothing to do with gender or being conscientious.
My Ss did way more than what was asked in high school and both attended top 10 colleges. Their high schools just did not give As just for doing all or even more than the homework.</p>
<p>Harvard has got about 3 graduates in its entire history who got straight As all four years. They made national news., and 2 were a brother and sister.
I actually think it’s cruel to say to a student that doing all the homework will get you straight As, because failure to get A becomes translated as a personal failure. I know my S sweated buckets in a course for which he got a mediocre grade. He in fact spent more time on that course than in his grad courses (where he got As).
I was disappointed at that grade, as was my S, but not disappointed at him. I knew he’d done all he could. And it was not even a required course. He just thought it was interesting and he would learn something from it. He could have taken an easier course but passed up on that one because he did not think it would be worth his time.</p>
<p>I have never ever insisted or expected that my Ss get straight As. In fact, that has been the reason why S1 was able to take college courses beginning in 9th grade. All I said was that as long as he was comfortably in the middle of the pack and continued to feel comfortably challenged rather than overwhelmed, then it was okay for him to take college classes. He was never one for an “easy A.”</p>
<p>Is the point of attending school getting grades? Maybe some parents see it that way, but I certainly don’t. </p>
<p>My son attends school to learn. He didn’t do math homework this past school year – counted for 10% of his grade, and he just didn’t want to waste his time doing the same types of problems over and over. Once he gets the concept, he gets it and wants to move on to something else. He got a B in math; I’m okay with that.</p>
<p>Kid didn’t do his Latin homework, either; he didn’t need the practice. So long as he learned what he needed to learn – and he did – the teacher was okay with his not needing the practice and not doing the homework, which was for practice, after all.</p>
<p>And so on. </p>
<p>Kid is now taking Probability and Game Theory at CTY; he took Set Theory first session. He’ll get no grades for these; he’ll learn a lot this summer anyway, even with no grades. Imagine that!!</p>
<p>Agreed with Owlice…sometimes the grades aren’t the important factor…but the TITLE of this thread and the OP indicate that for the OP, she was “really angry at her son” due to a grade shift and the main reason for it seems to have been incomplete assignments. SO…for this OP…where the grades mattered…if they mattered as much to the son…the way to have gotten the grade his parent wanted was to complete and hand in the WORK.</p>
<p>Re: an above post regarding enterpreneurs…lawyers, doctors, etc…I certainly hope my doctors and lawyers completed ALL of their work in professional school and not just what “they” thought was important. But that is my opinion.</p>
<p>I never expected certain grades from my kids…but I did expect them to do the best they could do in any subject they took. If “doing their best” included doing the homework…so be it.</p>
<p>DD did MORE homework for a LOWER grade in Organic Chemistry than in any other course she has ever taken. That happens sometimes too.</p>