This question is so basic and the advice is on it’s surface, so basic. But sadly, for lots of middle income families, college becomes an emotional decision once the acceptances roll in. I’ve seen countless level headed adults fully prepared to convince “Johnny” he’s going to the state school because A. it’s got everything he needs for his degree and B. it’s has a better price tag, less loans, scholarship offers, etc. Then he gets into his reach school and boom - all logic goes out the window, everyone caves, and Johnny goes to Cornell to the tune of $66,000 (full price too). And if you can pay it, fine. And yes there are some parents who’ve done their homework, or they’ve got their head screwed on straight, and regardless of whether they understand the financials or not, they don’t get emotional and they make a better decision for everyone. It’s really hard to see young folks just out of college paying upwards of $1000 (or more) towards their student debt. How do you save for retirement when you start adding up all the other obligations they have? And I’m not talking about having enough left over for Cable or a car, just being able to have food on their table with that kind of debt out of the gate is a real noose around your neck. Especially if you don’t graduate with a degree that offers huge salaries or you can’t really command the big salary due to your performance. So yeah articles like these are important, but I agree with the poster who said most people aren’t reading this stuff to begin with.
@fullmom, I tried to analyze the very same thing, even though an actual decision for me is four years away. I’d like to believe my husband and I are rational and prudent with finances. We stuck with our budget every time we bought a house, even though it was so tempting to buy a “dream house” instead. We also opted out of private schools after 3rd grade because it made no financial sense (for us). Btw, I could see stark differences in level of education kids are getting at a top (or so they say) public school and “elite” private school - just by attending local math competitions, and still, that didn’t justify the extra 30K/year costs to me.
However, I too realize that if our daughter gets into Stanford and absolutely wants to go there, we’ll most likely make more sacrifices to make that a reality. I think the difference is that parents feel so much more is at stake with a university - it may determine not only your career, but where you’d live afterwards, who will be your lifelong friends, sometimes it may be the place you meet your spouse, etc. Don’t misunderstand me - I am not saying elite college has better education, or propel one’s career to heights unattainable in less prestigious university, or that it has “better” kids that are somehow more suitable as friends/spouses, etc. What I mean is that “dream college” is just that - a dream, and if left unrealized, one would always wonder “what if”.
It’s just harder for many parents to deny their child a dream, no matter how rational it might be. In other words, it would be much easier for me to convince my daughter that she doesn’t need a “dream wedding” and can skip it altogether and just go to city hall like her parents did - because her marriage would be the same whether or not she has a dream wedding. But would her life be different if she goes to a dream university - yes, most likely. And it’s a lot harder to be responsible for taking that dream away.
Different families arrive at the question from different perspectives. If your parents paid for your college, you naturally feel it is an appropriate thing to do for your child. Others have an experience of paying their own way through college. But. the ratio of COA and annual salary is very different than it was a generation ago and vastly different from two generations ago.
I think a more important question is: Should parents place themselves in debt to send a child to college. If so, how much? Taking on substantial debt is rarely a good idea.
At some point, one has to look at Community college for two years and then transfer to a state school as a perfectly sound means to a college degree.
The answer to the question posed is not the same for all parents.
For a “dream school,” I can see going into small debt (say $10K a year) but not life-altering debt. If the dream school means debt over $10K/year, I would rather see my child off to a state flagship, for which I should have sufficient savings to cover all or almost all the cost.
@typiCAmom: The perception that private elites have “better kids” – depends on how you define “better.” For example, there are scofflaws, mass murderers and serial killers among the alumni of private elites, too. If you define “better” as being around those with similar cultural/socio-economic status, most families in the middle and upper middle classes are no better off at a campus like Stanford than they at a state flagship like UCLA. I say that because schools like Stanford have healthy representation of the extreme ends of the socio/economic ladder. Most of us are in the middle - too rich to qualify for aid, and generally too poor to pay full price - and I think this segment is not the majority at elite schools. That your child would be connect with cultural/socio/economic peers (more suitable, as you say, for friendship/marriage) is more likely at a state flagship I think.
It makes sense to pull kids out of really bad/violent K-12 public schools to avoid the “riff-raff” and enroll them in private school where there are “better kids.” But this comparison doesn’t hold for public vs. private elite colleges/universities since people who aspire and are admitted to college are by definition not riff-raff.
What’s the maximum Pell grant? ~$5800? It appears to me that low income families are expected to pay too.
One of the proudest moments of my life was realizing that we had saved enough to send 3 children to the state flagship or financial equivalent. This took effort, planning, sacrifice, and a whole lot of luck along the way.
My family income was low enough that my college was paid for through grants and government subsidized loans. My husband’s family income was high enough that he received very little assistance and had to take out private loans because his parents didn’t contribute a dime to his education because they couldn’t “afford” to despite the fact that during his college years, they ate out very regularly and continued luxury purchases such as season tickets and travel.
I agree that parents are free to do what they choose with their money but I think considering what kind of relationship you want with your child matters. I like pragmaticmom’s theory of spend money on/with your kids while you are living.
I feel that it is a point of pride to be able to pay for my kids’ college educations. I have always felt that it is part of the parenting deal, so we made sure to save for it, which is the part I’m proud of. I also feel it is my last obligation of this sort, and do not have the same view of grad school. I mean, if we can help with grad school or anything else then fine, but I don’t feel that it is part of that parenting deal. Just my view, and I realize not everyone shares it. In fact I had to bring my own husband around to it!
I’m probably nuts, but I considered the cost of educating my kids before I ever had them. Obviously, things can happen that make that impossible or difficult (we certainly experienced that firsthand), but I just cannot imagine a college-educated (or wealthy) parent bringing a child into this world and then showing him the door at 18, expecting him to make it on his own. Pardon me if I offend anyone, but that’s just irresponsible.
My oldest was born in 1995, and it was already very clear at that time that a child born then would likely need some type of post-secondary education to find a good job and achieve independence as an adult. And that was in a relatively prosperous time historically, before the dotcom bubble, 9/11, two wars, and the Great Recession of 2008.
@PragmaticMom, please re-read my post. I personally don’t think the kids at elite schools are any “better” than the rest - in fact, and sorry for my bias, but I’d probably hate to be in-laws with those who can trace their ancestry all the way down to Mayflower. I am talking about is “perceptions” of who are the kids at each school. Whenever we visit Stanford for a weekend walk/bike ride, we meet engaging young adults who are warm, welcoming, and extending my daughter’s horizons. We’ve been to Berkeley only a couple of times as a family, and the timing might have been wrong each time, as we’ve seen protesters angry at anyone not sharing their agenda, smelling of marijuana, and the contrast for my daughter has been stark. Btw, many more of of our family friends graduated from Berkeley than any other U.S. university, so yes, I know and my daughter knows that there are so many kids there who are just as bright, nice and welcoming as the ones we’ve seen in Stanford. But her overall impression due to her experiences so far is in favor of Stanford. I’ve tried exposing her to other universities I’d love for her to consider, i.e. UCSD, but we visited during the week, the weather was not the best, students were busy and not as inclined to engage campus guests or each other (at least in the public areas we saw), so while I liked what I saw, my daughter again compared it to Stanford in favor of the latter.
Please understand, I am not trying to start a war here and don’t want to say Stanford is better than any other university, or bash Berkeley, or anything of the sort. I just want to point out that what makes each uni a “dream one” can be based on perceptions, often wrongly-made.
Going back to parents paying extra for the child’s “dream school” - it’s a very personal decision in each case. I just wanted to bring my perspective into this decision of why such rationale may go out the door when we are talking of dreams. I wrote earlier that my husband once promised our daughter we’ll pay for whichever college she chooses as an incentive to study hard. Of course he may still change his mind if the gap between 529 and tuition keeps growing and we’d need to dip into our retirement savings to keep that promise. But if that offer was off the table, I personally would have hard time agreeing to pay $100K extra for a great school, even Harvard, if the only reason our daughter wanted to go there was because it’s a top school and she got rejected by her dream school. But if she gets into Stanford (and it remains her dream school by then), would I dare take away her dream - I honestly don’t know.
@LucieTheLakie, I think the problem has been (at least for us) that no amount of planning can be enough to meet the unhindered tuition growth. We funded our daughter’s 529 when she was 3, and that time it was indeed enough to cover 4 years of Stanford (at least tuition). Let’s just say that 529 hasn’t kept up with tuition growth rates, so it would still be a dilemma if daughter wants to go to private school. Everything we saved during the next 8 years, we put into our son’s 529. Let’s say we have another baby in 4 years (never say never, right?), if we put our savings and salary into D’s college, there would be nothing to invest in baby’s 529.
Yes, but you’re talking about funding a “dream college,” @typiCAmom, not a generic “college education,” which is what the OP was asking.
When my older son was born (in CA, BTW), my dream for him was to attend Penn (my alma mater). By the time he was ready to apply to colleges, Penn was well beyond his reach, given that he was just your “typical” smart, middle-class, unhooked white boy, and he wasn’t willing to waste an ED application (the only time Penn considers legacy status) on a school he had no strong feelings for.
We could have swung our net COA to Penn or another elite school where “full need” is met, but it would have been hard. Especially since we had another kid (with some special needs) to provide for. So he took the merit money at a big state flagship.
No, it’s not Penn (or Stanford, his dream school when he was 14), but it’s been pretty darn nice. And I can sleep at night knowing he’ll graduate with no debt, and we can focus our attention (and limited remaining funds) in S2.
You’ll cross that bridge with your DD when you get to it. Getting accepted is the biggest hurdle with Stanford, so make sure she has some other schools she likes too. And then see where the chips fall!
@LucieTheLakie, yes, if you take out “dream” out of the equation, it’s a no-brainer for me (again, just IMHO) that parents should pay for their kids college education (and plan for it financially), just like they should pay for sports, music lessons, art lessons, etc., if they can afford it. Otherwise, if the goal is spending all the money you earn on yourself, why have kids?
@ 11,
Why do people bring up what other countries do regarding funding higher education without also mentioning that other countries have higher tax burdens and usually lower economic growth? College is not free. If the government pays for it it is still not free because you would have higher taxes, thus, you are still paying for it. Hence, we’ve arrived at an immutable truth which is that government has nothing that it does not first take from the taxpayers. I wish more people would mention that in the same breath as how college would be “free” if the government would pay for it.
And, if the government did pay for it you could count on costs rising. So please, people, be careful what you wish for.
Leave my daughter drowning in debt when I have the means to help her? No thank you. Don’t spoil them, but don’t drop them into college and leave them stranded! Now, graduate school - that’s a different story.
Some parents don’t realize how much different college is these days in the cost category and think if they went to college without their parent’s help then their children should be able to do it also. About 35 years ago, one of my friends got kicked out at 18 years old, got a part time job at a donut shop and was able to pay for her own apartment, tuition and books at the local state school.
Today, that same part time job at the donut shop wouldn’t pay for an apartment OR tuition OR the books/expenses of the same school. Times have definitely changed.
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I am talking about is "perceptions" of who are the kids at each school. Whenever we visit Stanford for a weekend walk/bike ride, we meet engaging young adults who are warm, welcoming, and extending my daughter's horizons.
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Sigh… I guess Mr.Brock Turner is not one of those kids.
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Today, that same part time job at the donut shop wouldn't pay for an apartment OR tuition OR the books/expenses of the same school. Times have definitely changed.
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It is amazing that some people just do not get this. I have a colleague that insists that he would never pay for his daughter’s tuition - being very magnanimous - he will pay for her books and supplies and she should be able to swing the rest. This is coming from a guy whom I am paying over $175k a year - just amazing.
As a college student, I’m so grateful that I have the support of my parents. I understand the amount of money that is required for me to attend college, and even though, I might not be doing as well as I thought that I’ll be doing, I’ll sure as hell as be graduating in 4 years. I don’t want to squander 4 years of my parents’ money. I also think that it’s important for students to help pay for college in any way possible. I’m currently working two jobs to help pay and it’s a great experience. I help pay for my college tuition and a study abroad program that I’m doing this summer.
Also, it’s good to pay it forward to our future generation, but it’s also important to pay it back to our parents. You best believe that I’m buying my parents a house and whatever they need once I’m financially stable. To be honest, most of our generation are becoming spoiled, and we need to change that ASAP. I honestly believe that each student should work at least one service job or any job that requires intensive labor to keep us humbled.
@furrydog, love your sarcasm. Yes, Brock Turner could happen at any campus. What happened to Audrie Pott was a lot worse. A lesson to my daughter from it - never get drunk and watch your glass/cup so you can’t be rufied.
This is exactly the type of thinking that I was referring to when I used the word “irresponsible.”
Seriously, how are so many “smart” and “successful” people so utterly clueless?
@furrydog, what kind of educational attainment does your $175,000/yr employee have? Do you know if he funded his education himself or had help from his parents?
Honestly, I don’t know which I’d find more frustrating. I was totally on my own to pay for college, aside from my mother filling out my FAFSA form every year. Even back in the Stone Age when I was a student, the best schools offered the most generous FA, so I attended the “best” school I was admitted to (Penn). I still graduated with enough debt that grad school (I’d wanted to go to law school) was absolutely out of the question. And paying off my loans within five years of graduating (shortly before I got married) was one of the greatest reliefs I’ve ever known. Few of my friends at Penn were on FA, and the difference between their opportunities and mine were quite apparent. Aside from their folks picking up the full COA, many of them had parents who were going to pay for them to attend medical or law school. The biggest advantage, though, was that they had a safety net if things went badly. (Forget the difference in academic preparation most of them had.)
I got a very good education at Penn, but the best of it was outside the classroom. I learned what responsible parenting looked like, and it included a serious financial commitment to education, which in most cases included elite college preparatory schools or living in the best school districts. My husband and I are far from rich, but his parents paid for all three of his degrees and avoided debt. (They were highly educated but lived pretty modest lives because they were both academics.) We sacrificed to give our older son the very best education we could afford, knowing that it would pay off wherever he ended up for college. Due to a couple unanticipated major health situations (and a younger child with some special needs), that meant we couldn’t easily afford an elite college education for S1, but we have no regrets. And he’s making the most of the opportunities he’s been given at his Big State U. (@Hawkface, he promised to buy me a nice retirement home some day too. 
)
@LucieTheLakie I was fortunate enough to enter Brown right as they were vastly improving their financial aid program, and so never had to take a student loan. They always met my full need with grants.I’ve since felt morally bound to donate as much as I can so other students can benefit from financial aid. I also feel that it is my responsibility as a parent to contribute as much as I can to my child’s education. I’d frankly happily give up vacations, fancy cars etc., so that my child could have the education I did. Despite what people say, it did make a major difference and I feel that going to Brown made a major difference to my career and life.