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<p>Some private schools may give large merit scholarships or offer relatively large amounts of need-based aid, while some public schools are expensive for out-of-state with little in the way of scholarships and need-based aid. It is best to evaluate the net cost of each school individually, rather than assuming based on private / public (these days, the schools should have net price calculators on their web sites to give estimates of need-based aid before you apply).</p>
<p>^Exactly correct. Some privates will give much much more than low ranked state public. One example is Case Western (I have mentioned it several times). In addition, you are not concern with IS vs OOS, everybody is on the same footing.
Research is very useful. Not only on internet. In our case, listenning to recent applicants and their parents was very useful and provided very accurate source of information, since you know kids personllay, you can more accurately compare your own to this particular student.</p>
<p>LadyD,
The title of this thread is a bit misleading. It says, “Should your kids attend a well known, expensive private school at full tuition.” The reality is that all well known expensive private schools offer FA and most of the really well known ones offer extremely generous FA (H is free for those making less than $60K, and costs something like 10% of one’s income for those earning up to $180,000). So the question really is directed at wealthy parents who choose to pay full price for a private school.</p>
<p>@ahsmuoh – Totally agree! In our experience, too, a public flagship’s honors college is definitely the way to go.</p>
<p>I’ve seen both sides. My husband earned his PhD at Harvard (in history), and I attended the Divinity School there (that’s how we met). My son, OTOH, is in the Honors College at University of Alabama. Does he have some super-easy classes? Yes, by his own choice. (He’s not the math-science-y type, so he took the “Rocks for Jocks”-type courses to fulfill his core math and science requirements.) But such easy-cheesy classes exist at Harvard, too. (Back in our day, there was a history course called The Age of Exploration – popularly known as “Boats” – which was a favorite among the jocks. It was taught by one of the guys on my husband’s dissertation committee.) </p>
<p>Moreover, my son’s honors and advanced classes are FULLY as rigorous as anything my husband and I ever experienced at Harvard. This past summer, my husband coached my son with the Greek text he would be using this fall (a scholarly critical edition of Oedipus Rex, which apparently seeks to establish a definitive text for the play). Oh. My. Gosh. My husband said it was the hardest thing he’s ever done in his life; it left him intellectually exhausted every day. And my son’s Greek professor has the kids translating the entire play…they will be responsible on the final even for the parts they haven’t covered in class. If anyone thinks this is significantly easier than your typical liberal-arts class at an Ivy, I invite him/her to try it sometime!</p>
<p>I am definitely NOT knocking people who choose to go the elite / private route; no one need be defensive about personal choices. But some of us simply do NOT have that option, and, for us, a public flagship’s honors college can be an excellent alternative.</p>
<p>Bay, good point. But, personally, we found that financial aid did not exactly pour in from private institutions. (We are right about at retirement age, and our retirement nest egg is just large enough so that we do not qualify for most grants – even Harvard’s.)</p>
<p>BTW, my niece who went to Wisconsin – and did nationally recognized / published research there – is the daughter of a doctor. I guess she would qualify for participation in this thread, even if we don’t. ;)</p>
<p>Also BTW: Is there any place at College Confidential for non-wealthy posters? The affluent do seem to dominate most threads here, which is why I normally do not participate in discussions outside of the Alabama sub-board. I have nothing against the wealthy; heck, I even have rich relatives; but I simply feel…out of place in these discussions of $200K out-of-pocket college educations. </p>
<p>But perhaps this points up a growing problem in our society: viz, that four-year colleges, especially private ones, are increasingly becoming the exclusive province of the well-heeled. I know so many academically gifted kids who are attending our local two-year community college (with the intent to go on to a four-year public college afterward), simply because they cannot afford any other option. As college costs continue to soar, will we end up with a two-tiered higher-education system – community colleges for the middle and lower-middle classes and four-year colleges for the affluent? Hmmmm, sounds like a question for another thread, perhaps.</p>
<p>“When #2 son starts applying for college, he won’t even bother applying to private institutions. It’s not worth the aggravation! Why go to all lengths to be admitted to a place you cannot afford?”</p>
<p>Depends on what you consider affordability is - 5k, 10k, 20k, or 60k.</p>
<p>The myth of fixed college education costs at privates is similar to fixed airline ticket pricing. There are people in there attending free, paying 20%, 40%, 80% or 100% of the price tag. The question being asked is why anyone would think 100% pay is worth it to anyone.</p>
<p>ucbalumnus, been there, done that. Will never fill out another FAFSA. Who needs the aggravation? FAFSA obviously feels we can afford to fork over everything in our bank account, break into our 401K, etc. We do not share this view; we would like to have something to live on when I retire next year. 
YMMV, and I totally respect that.</p>
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<p>Some parents and students from lower and middle income backgrounds do post here, but they are in the minority.</p>
<p>Note the “bubble” – lots of people think of themselves as “middle income” with incomes much higher than the median household income of about $50,000 in the US.</p>
<p>^Depends on the thread. If you go to specific year threads you should see people of every income level describing the schools they are applying to, various outcomes, who is doling out money and who might be discriminating against someone needing full aid.</p>
<p>As the one who started this thread, I wanted to add some additional comments in order to keep this thread on track.</p>
<p>First, although top private schools do give a lot of need based scholarships, very few give merit based scholarships for undergraduate studies. I assumed, probably correctly, that the expensive private school won’t give a merit scholarship and the parent/kid will have to pay full or almost full tuition. Obviously, those who qualify for lots of need based aid will benefit greatly and should consider the top ivys or top private schools. These types of kids were never my target for this thread.</p>
<p>Secondly, I also assumed that academic stars who can get into top private schools have options to go to either a good state school or good private school with enough of a merit scholarship as to make the school almost tuition free. This also assumes that these latter schools have the majors required by the student.</p>
<p>Thirdly, everything that I said was solely ‘something to think about.’ I did not say that people need to do this or that anyone is an idiot who pays full tuition for an expensive priviate school. I have not said that and don’t feel this way.I hope my goal of making this subject “top of mind” was accomplished.</p>
<p>What I do believe strongly, however, is that no school is worth incurring over a hundred thousand in debt for undergraduate education. In fact, I am not sure that I would recommend over $50,000 in undergraduate debt if there are less expensive alternatives. I am sure some will disagree with this.</p>
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<p>If this was your point, then you should have stated it this way. It <em>is</em> a different question, because many people may incur debt in that amount for public schools, too (UC Berkeley costs $26K+ per year). Some people also may be able to easily manage the payments on a debt of that size, due to having paid off their homes, or because the debt is a 30-year heloc. So I agree with you, some people will disagree with this premise, too.</p>
<p>taxguy, I totally agree 100%! Thank you!</p>
<p>Yesterday on NPR, the president of Grinnell and several Ivy Leagues’ administrators (Cornell and another), stated that they can no longer afford to meet full need anymore. With the recession and the ever increasing cost of higher education, the percentage of full paid are getting smaller every year. They are looking at the ability to pay as part of the admission equation and these schools are “quietly” shifting their aid packages to more loans and less grants. For students who are already enrolled, this shift will prove to be painful since they were hoping for the same level of support for all 4 years.</p>
<p>LadyD, I do understand your reluctance on FAFSA (see above) and it’s so nice to hear that your S is thriving. He’s lucky to have received the NM deal from UA since they have cut back this year to only include housing for the first year. You should not feel alone on CC, we’re another family that it’s not a choice of between a BMW or a private education, it’s more like pay full price (minus 5-10K of FA) at an elite/ivy or free tuition at a good private or honors college publics. We would have to take out partial loans for the first option.</p>
<p>I know someone who went to a huge state school and is now successful! This busts every single myth ever created.</p>
<p>Anchser, although I personally believe that you may be right, one person does not create a statistical corelation.</p>
<p>Bay , my main point was not about college debt. That was a secondary recent point raised by me.</p>
<p>As a hiring manager for 25 years I can safely tell you that for 99% of positions it matters not one iota from what school you earned your undergrad degree as long as it was not a “for profit” school. Once you get your first job all that matters is your performance. The degree itself at that point and going forward is a check box on the application. </p>
<p>Now grad school is a different story - the school does matter in most cases. </p>
<p>Save your $ on undergrad. I know Ivy grads out of work and tier 4 grads that make an excellent living. It’s about what you do on the job not the name on the piece of paper.</p>
<p>taxguy,
I’m confused now about your main point. Can you restate it for me?</p>
<p>taxguy I think Ancher was just being sarcastic though 
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<p>Seriously? Well, this would suck, but at least if our contribution price rose dramatically then I could take a year/semester off and apply to be a transfer to a school back home or something and be a commuter, perhaps. Oh well, we’ll cross that bridge when we get there. But I’m just wondering, what about financial aid packages from schools that offer the no-loan policy? If we choose the no-loan policy, does that just mean the grants will just decrease by a lot?</p>
<p>NJSue, It would be great if kids went to college, kept the same jobs ,as during the Ozzie and Harriet days, never got divorced or needed help.Sadly, those days are gone! Today, as many as 50% of recent grads don’t have jobs. People rarely stay with the same employer. Employers lay off even good workers based on what is best for their bottom line. Kids get divorced and come back to live at home with ever increasing frequency. Since these things tend to happen anyway, wouldn’t it be better to have the money for these contingencies assuming the same educational benefits for the kids?</p>
<p>Taxguy, in the real world, people who might be able to stretch to send their kids to a full freight private school, don’t end up socking the extra dough away if their kid chooses another, less expensive option. In the real world, that means that they can afford to contribute to Great Aunt Selma’s assisted living expenses; that they can afford to fix the leaky roof; that when the radiator on the 10 year old car blows that they can decide, “fix or buy another car”. You are living in a dream world if you think the people whose kids choose a less expensive option then take the money they would have sent to Princeton and sock it away in a nice large cap stock fund at Vanguard.</p>
<p>And guess what- plenty of folks go into deep debt whose kids are graduating from no-name public U’s with limited job prospects. I asked someone yesterday, “What was the plan when Joey told you he needed a 5th year at our state U so he could finish his degree in leisure studies?” Her response, “He thought he could get a job as a trainer for the NFL but those people all have master’s degrees or decades of experience”.</p>
<p>oh jeez. More money borrowed with no realistic way to pay it back. This is not a kid getting A’s at Harvard or Cal Tech with proud parents scrimping and saving to make it happen. This is a kid with a C average from a perfectly respectable but not well known state college who needed 5 years to graduate, with mom and dad sweating every dollar they’re borrowing against the house in a down housing market… and no employment prospects.</p>
<p>So your comments which seem directed at people who are full pays-- I take issue. Tell my friend how she can turn her kid into a fully employed adult; she’ll appreciate it.</p>